Does eBay police Coins categories AT ALL anymore?

[ted_200]

It does not appear so.

Over the last months, a flood of garbage listings for fake bullion products has inundated virtually every category on this site.  A lot of these are easily located by the diagonal goldish colored text added to the listing photos.  Users spending any time in the categories know exactly what I'm talking about.  These listings violate one or more of the following eBay policies:

- Prohibition of added text to listing photos.

- Offering plated bullion products.

- Offering "German Silver" bullion products.

- Use of stock photos.

- Search and Browse manipulation (listing in wrong category).

- Offensive materials policy (plated bullion items glorifying the Third Reich).

- Selling replica items without disclosure.

Of greater importance than eBay's unenforced policies, many of these offerings are outright counterfeits of major brand bullion products, with absolultely no disclosure - a violation of the true manufacturers' intellectual property rights, in addition to a violation of federal law and numerous FTC regulations.  In other cases, replica bullion coins covered by the Hobby Protection Act (HPA) are being sold without the required COPY mark (in addition to a lot of non-bullion coins too). 

Using the Report Item link has gone from mostly useless to totally useless.  Even better, eBay has now got "Product Pages" for these items right in the eBay Catalog!  One could speculate eBay might bear some responsibility for these items/listings as a result.  One need not speculate though that these listings make shopping on eBay difficult and unpleasant.

Does eBay police Coins categories AT ALL anymore?

[elheron-grande]

Hola Ted200 - it is good to 'see' you again!

The answer to your question is; Probably Not Much.

The real 'test case' was the Tiffany vs. eBay in Southern District of NY 

[04civ.4607-RJS].   This case went to the Supreme Court and was dismissed by Justice Sotomayor.    This case pretty much established eBay as not being a 'vendor' but a 'venue'.

The 2nd case was in US District Court 23 March 2017 where the judge pretty much determined that 'eBay is not the seller of merchandise'.  Judge Karen Bowdre.

What these two cases found was that eBay was taking 'reasonable precautions' to police merchandise.   These cases also re-inforced the 'venue' label..

It is interesting to follow these cases brought against our most happy host.

Regardos Muchos!  

[elheron-grande]

In other woids; it is CAVEAT EMPTOR for buyers!   Opinion. 

[ted_200]

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@elheron-grande wrote:

In other woids; it is CAVEAT EMPTOR for buyers!   Opinion. 

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Si, Senor Grande.  It is good to 'see' you too!  I had actually intended to include your Latin-o warning in my original post. 

I understand that eBay has historically claimed to be "only a venue" in past litigation fiascos they had become involved with - with some success.   However, I wonder how well that tactic would work with the offending merchandise having been given a Product Page in the eBay Catalog.  In my mind, this would be akin to the old Sears Roebuck & Co. catalog having trademark infringing counterfeit items in it, that were shipped by a third party.  They could still claim they were not the seller of the merchandise I suppose, but I think it would be more difficult to claim lack of any responsibility for an item that appears in a catalog that they own, publish, and distribute. 

[elheron-grande]

Hola Ted200!  Good point about Sears and Sears catalog sales.  When Heron was a youngster we purchased Sears merchandise using the Sears catalog... I remember it well.

Perhaps in this 'age' of electrons and internet,  a large corporation doe not need to 'worry' a bunch about 'image'.   There are multi-millions of folks using the 'venue'.

At the rate of human reproduction in many parts of the world, it appears that our most gracious of hosts might never 'run out' of customers to use their venue.

Perhaps it is one a those situations where the corporation might 'lose' a million customers but gain 10 million to replace the 'lost batch'. 

Heron does not know the answers to the situations that might happen in the future.  Anything could happen.  However, for 'now' the corporation appears to be healthy and prosperous.   This is a good thing for stockholders.    Perhaps not so good for the 'buyers' that do not know what it is they are doing.  Nor do they research to find out.  Probably 'impulse' buying in some situations?

Regardos Muchos!

[ted_200]

At the rate of human reproduction in many parts of the world, it appears that our most gracious of hosts might never 'run out' of customers to use their venue.

Well... it certainly appears our hosts will never run out of reproduction numismatic items to collect fees from at least.

Other than the offensive materials policy, I think the below referenced item may violate every other policy I mentioned.  Note that it is "SPONSORED" - meaning eBay is collecting additional fees for directing buyers to it.  I don't see how they could possibly claim they are not a party to any resulting transaction. 

Any eBay Policy issues (and general illegalities) aside, this sort of thing certainly cannot be good for promoting legitimate bullion purchases on the venue. 

Seriously?

[ted_200]

- Prohibition of added text to listing photos.

- Offering plated bullion products.

- Offering "German Silver" bullion products.

- Use of stock photos.

- Search and Browse manipulation (listing in wrong category).

- Offensive materials policy (plated bullion items glorifying the Third Reich).

- Selling replica items without disclosure / HPA violations.

AGE's are legal tender.   That's no better than offering counterfeit fifty dollar bills, an offense far more serious than anything already on that list. 

[john9112001]

What is "AGE's are legal tender. " ?

[*smedley*]

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@john9112001 wrote:

What is "AGE's are legal tender. " ?

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American Gold Eagles

[ted_200]

Branded 1 Oz. Silver for $7.20, that's a deal....

Top Rated Seller

[ted_200]

Today, while doing my ususal browsing... in Coins > World > Lots, no less... I find a whole bunch of listings for fake ASEs from sellers in China.  No "COPY" marks on the coins... says right in the title "Silver Plated"!   This sort of thing could be monitored using a bot... it's not rocket science.

[*smedley*]

unless the Secret Service/FBI/Homeland/etc gets involved, ebay ain't gonna do diddly about it... and probably not even then...

[too_toot]

EBay's coin policy should follow the US Mint's guidelines for replicas and other privately minted items so there is no confusion over them:

https://www.usmint.gov/news/consumer-alerts/business-guidelines/business-faqs/dos-donts-businesses-a...

Furthermore, so many of these Carpy Chinese Coin Concoctions (C4) use symbols, wording, mottos, etc. that make the item appear like a legitimate and official US Mint product. IMO, such items should be removed pronto and all sellers of them who do not readily disclose their medallion, non-numismatic and non-bullion status in the listing(s) should be removed.

Citing here the old "Washington Mint" (later, "Collectible America", now defunct) case where Sac Dollar looking coins were being produced without proper disclosure. This could also be the basis for removing American Eagle "coins", etc.:

https://www.usmint.gov/news/press-releases/20020808-united-states-mint-lawsuit-ends-in-historic-sett...

[*smedley*]

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@too_toot wrote:

EBay's coin policy should follow the US Mint's guidelines for replicas and other privately minted items so there is no confusion over them:

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"We are just a venue"

so... figure the odds...

[ted_200]

EBay's coin policy should follow the US Mint's guidelines...

There isn't necessarily anything wrong with eBay's coin policy...  all of this numistrash would go poof if they'd just enforce the policy that already exists.   Replicas are prohibited by that policy.  Period.  Plated bullion is prohibited by that policy.  Period. 

eBay's policies are more restrictive than the US Mint (other than eBay prohibiting HPA compliant replicas). 

The Wasington Mint stuff is sort of like the old "evasion copper" from Britain... similar looking to an official coin, but upon reasonable inspection clearly not, because of differences in design or legends.  These AGEs/ASEs and phony bullion bars aren't that... the legends and designs are identical, they're just counterfeits plain and simple.