The "Standard Envelope Dilemma" - Looking for some input please
Summary: jekyll424 is a top-rated seller experiencing increased issues with postage and delivery of trading cards through USPS. They noticed a rise in returned items or packages marked for additional postage, despite adhering to guidelines. 1786davycrockett suggested using a flexible packaging method with penny sleeves and cereal box material to avoid non-machinable charges. bdmh-enterprises and fm2000 echoed similar methods to ensure packages meet USPS requirements, while also advising against handing them directly to postal clerks. codaycards faced similar problems and considered stopping sales, but jekyll424 encouraged perseverance, noting that changes might be due to USPS inconsistencies rather than eBay's faults. The discussion centered on troubleshooting postal issues without sacrificing card protection.
I am a top rated seller. I ship trading/sports cards mostly (like many other sellers here I'm sure), some larger items like toys and collectibles. I am not new to shipping here or in other formats, and have been in business for over 10 years. I have shipped over 1.2K items here in the past year. I can't really say that I've had tons of problems with shipping, I follow rules well, take advice, and stay within what I've understood to be the guidelines and recommendations as instructed by eBay and USPS... no toploaders, nothing over .25" thickness and proper label attached (.78 cents for up to 1 oz, etc...) I do use very thin semi rigid keepers that flex well, and I don't shove multiple cards in a pack and cross my fingers that it gets to it's destination. On occasion, I've seen an ESU go missing, or never make it to the first "scannable hub". Most folks say it's the cost of doing business. Here lately though, the number of pieces that has been "lost", returned (I'll get to that in a second here), or in some instances, made it from my location in Georgia all the way across country and then gets rejected and sent back has exponentially increased. Today, I opened the mailbox to a stack of my envelopes that are all stamped "returned for additional postage: .53 cents due" (which I understand to be the non machinable fee.
Has something changed? Is it selective at different areas of the country? I hate to stop using any kind of card protector because I know what can happen in machining, but I've also seen the mind blowing auctions of USPS "lost" mail TCG auctions on Gov Deals . com out of Atlanta where obviously our stuff ends up and even if we put in claims (which I always have) the USPS auctions it for profit anyways. So I'm asking for advice, help... anything really. I want my customer's purchase to be protected, even if it's an inexpensive card, but I won't stay top rated if many more envelopes come back or disappear. My local post office wasn't even aware that eBay had discounted rates for standard envelope and I had to show them the website guidance. It just seems so disconnected. And I've been staying quiet, because it seems like this will just end up being a gripe session with little that I can do about it except ship my orders with little to no protection. Help! (and thanks for reading this).
c_527349
·2 days agocodaycards’ $5–7 postage due fits being re-rated as a parcel. USPS letters must be flexible and no thicker than 1/4 inch; a rigid letter-size piece is nonmachinable (surcharge), and once it isn’t flexible as a flat it’s priced as a package. A semi-rigid holder in a 4.5 x 6.5 kraft mailer can pass at one counter and fail a sorter elsewhere, which would explain the regional differences. Cheap check: the letter template slot most post offices have, plus the bend-around-a-can test fm2000 mentioned.
codaycards
·4 days agoFor the past 2 days, I've had all of my ESE cards returned.
Yesterday's returns were marked with a specific dollar amount for insufficient postage. It wasn't cents; it was dollars ($5-$7) per envelope. That looks like they are marking them up to Ground postage requested.
Today's returns were marked insufficient postage, but they did not bother to write in how much more was being requested. I assume they wanted Ground postage for them, too.
I ship in a cheap white envelope from Dollar Tree.
Penny sleeve, semi-rigid, and folded into the eBay packing slip printout on standard copier paper. It does not weigh more than 1 oz and is not more than 1/4" thick. It's more bendable than the deluge of unsolicited credit card offers we get in the mail every week.
Something changed.
Selling cards is a hobby for me, but I am considering deleting all of my listings and putting my cards back in the closet because dealing with the headache of fighting the post office isn't worth it for me.
So far, I've bought new labels and trying to drop at a different post office in the morning, but I don't have a lot of hope that this is going to work out. My shipping method has been good, no problems, all year long and then it suddenly stopped being good.
I would rather stop selling on eBay than deal with the mess.
jekyll424
OP2 days agoAs a fellow seller mentioned in a previous reply in this thread, it might be the card saver. I've changed my process slightly to still protect the card but remove the semi rigid, and I'm holding my breath on results. :)
While I understand the frustration, literally, I would maybe ask you to consider that it is not eBay that is essentially causing this confounding headache that many of us are experiencing, but continual dramatic changes within the USPS that seem to be inconsistent, maybe rolling them out at different times, inexperienced people in positions, and as someone plainly put it earlier, disgruntled employees that are faced with millions of pieces of parcel per week and given no clear direction as to which changes are in effect, etc.
eBay charges fees, yes. They are continually reacting to constant USPS changes, and it seems like they are trying to keep up as best they can. Do I wish they didn't outsource the support team first tier of buyer/seller assistance through a way too basic chat bot and customer service unequipped to do more than very basic triage? Yes of course. But when you get actual seller/tech support assistance, they're pretty good. The seller fees are a bit steep for my liking, and I wish I didn't have to bleed an additional 5+% in promotional fees to get my storefront in better viewing position.... BUT! They put us in front of millions of potential customers that are SEARCHING DIRECTLY for products we can provide them. They have a massive shipping infrastructure that's solid and actually DO go to bat for sellers when they can, and when we can provide evidence it wasn't our fault as a seller. I look at their fees as I would any other subscription or app. They're providing a service that I myself benefit from, and they have huge overhead that they have to maintain.
For me, it's a "check all the boxes" post, to eliminate me making mistakes that I may not be aware of, and hopefully gain insight from other sellers that are certainly currently seeing these issues pop up more than before.
I hope that helps.
fm2000
·1 week agoAre you actively testing your envelopes to make sure they are flexible after you seal the envelopes? Take a coffee can or large cereal bowl and make sure your envelopes can easily flex around it. It is a pain to do this for every envelope, but it is a good troubleshooting method. If they easily flex for you, and they can go through a letter size template, and are 3oz or less, there is another problem.
Letters that get kicked out of the system end up in a manual sort pile and can sit for a week... or a few. The post office can't just throw letters out or choose to just not deliver them, they will arrive or be returned... eventually, possibly postage due.
If a clerk ever gives you a hard time about ESE, point to the "Pitney Bowes" imprint on it and tell them it is metered mail (which it is). They should (hopefully) know what "metered mail" and who Pitney Bowes is and let it go.
jekyll424
OP5 days agoYes, and I've checked my process against the detailed regulations found in USPS Postal Explorer (which contains the most detailed language and policy I've found yet. I have a link in this reply for anyone who may not have seen it. It just seems as though while some locations have zero issues being delivered, others like Massachusetts and California have difficulties., and when my mail leaves north Georgia and travels through the Chattanooga hub, there are no complications (although I hit speed bumps in Nashville occasionally), but traveling south through Atlanta's hub is a coin flip, even though all mail is packaged exactly the same, and has been for almost 2 years now. I do wish we had a "non-machinable" upgrade option for letters and small parcel weighing under 3 ounces but meeting the dimensions and thickness requirements. Since writing this post, I've even stopped using the thin cardsavers and only using a team bag protector over the penny sleeve and securing to the packing slip. I really appreciate everyone's insight.
https://pe.usps.com/ (general link to USPS policy - updated Sept. 22, 2026)
https://pe.usps.com/QSG_Archive/NHTML/QSG_Archive_20161107/Q201.htm archived exact guidance on letters - dated 2016 but still good info)
jekyll424
OP1 week agoI appreciate the help everyone. It's much more productive here than the ai generated help chat that really only addresses "wanna sell something?" , "Wanna return something?" or "Wanna buy something?" lolol.
bdmh-enterprises
·2 weeks agoI have always used grading sized semi rigid sleeves and have never had a problem with them. I can still successfully send 8 cards in 2 semis or 27 raw in a 3 pocket #10. In fact I've found my 'delivered' scan rate has increased from 95% to close to 97% over the last year with my 'any' scan rate remaining over 99%. I have never had one returned or delivered Postage Due.
So that would bring us to the envelope. If you are using any kind of 'armor' or 'shield' whatevers, they are too stiff. Plain paper envelopes only. I would highly recommend using #6 as they fit a semi rigid almost perfectly with no empty envelope to flop about and the smaller envelope require less actual bend around the wheels. I only use #10 to fit multiple raw cards horizontally, I use cut up binder pages to simulate pockets. If you use a #10 for singles, you must tape the sleeve to the left side of the envelope and attach the label on the right so the 'stamp' is in that upper corner.
Also never hand them to the counter clerk, you want the machine to decide if they qualify, not some disgruntled worker. Always drop them in a blue box, the letter slot in your PO or leave them in your mail box for the carrier to pick up (they will rarely look at or care about the envelopes and just put them with all the others they collect).
jekyll424
OP5 days agoI really appreciate your insight. I don't use Armors/Shield or any stiff cardboard. I use plain paper envelopes (kraft mailers - standard 4.5 x 6.5 to accommodate my zebra labels). And I understand that it's metered mail. I don't use any kind of tape outside the package, but I do place the label over the closure of the envelope for security in shipping. They generally go in the box and are pulled by my route carrier. In fact, the few times I missed the carrier (mine comes bright and breezy), and had to go to the post office directly are the times it seems, if I trace it back, that I had issues. In fact, I use team bags and have eliminated card savers altogether to attempt to solve which part of my processing is off. I don't assume I'm always correct in my methods, I want to make certain my compliance with, or understanding of regulations isn't the problem lol. But even after those changes, I still get returns. I see that you're a well respected and long time tcg/card seller. I genuinely appreciate the troubleshooting. Thank you. I'll keep trying. :)
1786davycrockett
·2 weeks ago@jekyll424
Yes, I've been reading a lot this year about many post offices coming down heavy on the ESEs -- many ESEs never making it out of the USPS Distribution Centers, due to being non-machinable, and USPS not bothering to send them back to the sellers marked "Insufficient funds" , or not forwarding to the buyer marked "Postage Due."
It sounds as if you were one of the "lucky" sellers who actually had your ESEs returned to you -- but many others are never seen again, and wind up in whatever passes for the "dead letter" department now.
Your problem is no doubt the semi-rigid keepers -- that's what is making your ESEs non-machinable.
I just use penny sleeves or glassine envelopes, inserted between 2 strips of the material used for cereal boxes or 12 packs of soda. Trim those strips down to fit snugly inside a #6 or #10 envelope, and mail them from a USPS "blue" box. The 2 strips are sufficiently rigid to protect the card, but flexible enough to slide easily through the high-speed USPS roller systems.
I've been mailing my ESEs that way for years, with no problems, no buyer complaints and no returns -- give it a try!
jekyll424
OP2 weeks agoThanks for your reply. It's (penny sleeve / team bag) probably the only reasonable solution. I certainly can't blame a buyer for not wanting to ship ground advantage on an inexpensive collectible card, but it seems like trying to protect their purchase as well as possible within what I thought was our guidelines ends up being a mistake as well. :/
bdmh-enterprises
·2 weeks agoI don't know about OP's, but the China brand semi rigid sleeves I use are no less flexible than cereal box.