What would you do?
I sold a $90 item (one of the most expensive items i sell) on 2-20-23.
This was a repeat buyer. He had purchased one from me about a month ago.
On 3-12-23 the buyer opened a INR.
I immediately responded to the case and uploaded the tracking number.
The tracking was odd. It did not show "delivered".
Instead it showed "deliver to agent for final delivery".
I did some research on the boards and found that per devon from ebay, I am covered in a INR.
The case is still open and the tracking hasn't changed.
I forgot to block this buyer!!!
Tonight he buys another one.
The optimistic me is thinking ... he must have received the 2nd one and is now buying a 3rd one.
He's a good repeat customer.
The suspicious me is thinking ... don't got through with this 3rd purchase.
I'm asking for trouble.
What do I do? What would you do?
Perhaps What do I do? What would you do?
Perhaps devon@ebay can chime in with advice.
iamalwaysright
·3 years agoI recently had a buyer who I had to ship to that same FF in Wilmington. I didn’t check other responses but I’m sure someone already mentioned that the status will show that for FF from now on.
My buyer filed INR and mentioned they didn’t get the item. They were either playing dumb or really didn’t understand what I meant when I told them to check with their FF agent. I was waiting to be covered by seller protection like you said but the day I was able to file for eBay to step in, the buyer closed the INR himself saying he got the item.
If I were you, I would ship the latest item and treat the purchase separately from the INR.
12345jamesstamps
·3 years agoI get packages from Macao and tracking ends once it is in the USA. After that, I have no tracking in the USA. And I get my packages. Its possible tracking ends once it leaves the USA. Tracking doesn't always show it moving after a certain destination out of the USA. I would mail the new item. Repeat buyers are hard to obtain. Plus, a freight forward might be waiting for other packages to arrive before sending previous packages out.
I sent just a standard envelope to a freight forward address and it sat until other packages arrived.
Did you google the address to see if it is a commercial address?
inhawaii
OP3 years agoI a little more researched all 3 sales.
#1) Shipped to ebay's old GSP address in Erlanger KY.
#) Shipped to what appears to be a freight forwarder in Wilmington DE.
#3) Has ebay's EIS address in Glendale Heights, IL.
The buyer is in South Korea.
The story seems somewhat plausible.
The 1st order he went with GSP.
The 2nd order he went with a freight forwarder where he may have had some problem getting the item.
The 3rd order he went with EIS.
I did reach out to the buyer, but don't expect to hear back from him within my 1-day shipping window.
I'm going to go ahead and ship the 3rd one. As they say in Hawaii "Chance 'em".
If I lose $90 I will start a go fund me account.
I'm sure my generous fellow ebay sellers can scrape up $90. 😉
Thanks for all your advice!
sakic92710
·3 years agoAs long as you don't mind waiting 3 months for my 'go fund me' donation., I might get $23 in sales by then.
buyselljack2016
·3 years agodevon says eBay has your back. The "go fund me" will not be needed 🤣
reallynicestamps
·3 years ago@inhawaii
#1 and #3 are the seller's choice not the buyer's.
He may have decided to try the forwarder because many buyers are shocked by the "high cost of shipping" through GSP.
That "high cost" is because GSP charges import fees to cover Korean duty and sales taxes.
The forwarder would likely do the same.
This may not be clear to the buyer. (Lord knows my fellow Canadians can't figure it out and English is the first language for nearly 75% of us)
EIS seems cheaper than GSP because I understand they do not charge import fees in advance, leaving those to be paid on the buyer's doorstep.
I have some Canadian pennies you can put in your GoFundMe.
reallynicestamps
·3 years agoHave you looked at the address on Google Maps?
Is it a reshipper in a strip mall?
Is it the buyer's name always the same or just the address?
Because delivery to a freight forwarder is delivery. If the forwarder is not prompt about reshipping that's not your problem.
One problem that sellers make for themselves is that a decent freight forwarder has hundreds if not thousands of customers, and no matter how carefully the forwarder runs their business, the odd crook will be there to take advantage, leading to bad Google reviews from uncomprehending sellers.
devon@ebay
Hey @inhawaii! For the first transaction just as you called out you would be covered in a potential INR case. For the most recent orders I would recommend to reach out to the buyer and see if they are aware of what address they are using for the orders as far as if they are being delivered. If you have not blocked them yet and you are having to ship out these to stay within your handle by window you of course would be covered as the seller for any other potential INR's. If you choose to cancel the most recent orders just be aware that depending on how you cancel them that it could cause defects to your account.
janet9988
·3 years agoIts not a POTENTIAL case. The case has been opened since 3-12 and is still open. How long does protection take ?
stainlessenginecovers
·3 years agoThat is a Freight Fowarder. Have you messaged the buyer asking 'what's going on'?? Can't hurt; if no response, cancel reason of address and block.
sakic92710
·3 years agoUPDATE : "Delivered to agent for final delivery" means someone accepted the package on their behalf. It is delivered.
1richdoug
·3 years agoWilmington is a re-shipper sight. If that was address on label they gave EBay; then was delivered to "agent". ic no probs here; is the address on 3rd one the same as other two?
sakic92710
·3 years agoI'm no expert but I do know the English language pretty good. lol "Delivered to the agent" means delivered. I do not know why the buyer did not cancel the INR case. 10 days later & the case is still open? If there is no communication, I would feel a bit suspicious. eBay has said nothing about the case, either? Did you ask the buyer to close the case? We need more info, dude. lol 😛 As far as I am concerned, I would trust the 3rd sale & send it. The buyer was good on the 1st one & IMHO, the 2nd is considered delivered. Did you compare the tracking info with the 1st sale? If it also says 'delivered to the agent' you are good to go.
retro_entertainment_collectibles
·3 years agoHave you communicated with the buyer?
I would certainly do that expressing concerns over the previous transaction.
As another party stated, presume that you've looked up the delivery address, find anything?
frodobagginskennedy
·3 years ago@inhawaii Delivered to agent in Wilmington Delaware is usually a freight forwarder. That is all you are ever going to see on delivery tracking if so. Have you googled the address? I am from the Lovely First State, home of our addle brained useless President, we have a lot of freight forwarders in upper Delaware. Some have their own zip codes as they are huge.
I would message buyer that it was received by the FF per tracking. They need to contact them and to please close the case as e Bay is holding your money.
If they do NOT do as requested I would cancel the 3rd transaction as problem with address.
harafkac0
·3 years agoI believe you will win the INR, of course there's only one way to find out and that is to wait until the case closes.
Meanwhile I would ship the buyer's last order.
But that's just me.
toysaver
·3 years ago"What would you do?"
I would spend the rest of my life fighting and working so eBay would automatically block any buyer with an open case from making another purchase.
farmalljr
·3 years agoGonna be honest here..... I do NOT have confidence that you will win an INR case. I don't care what the eBay rep says, I just no longer believe them. Sellers have no recourse, and telling us what we want to hear quiets everyone down.
I would say there is a problem with their address, since they filed an INR on the second purchase. The buyer seems to be admitting there are issues with the address, since they claim to not have received their purchase. You could be out the 90 bucks + fees and shipping twice.
It's not like this would be the first time they tell you one thing and then do something else. No real reason for buyers to use freight forwarders anymore, since eBay offers international shipping, other than to find a way to get "free" stuff. There may be a few good reasons why they would use a forwarder, but the scams all seem to come from forwarders.
varebelrose
·3 years ago@farmalljr wrote:..No real reason for buyers to use freight forwarders anymore, since eBay offers international shipping, other than to find a way to get "free" stuff. There may be a few good reasons why they would use a forwarder, but the scams all seem to come from forwarders.
There is a very good reason many international buyers use forwarders; the fact is that many US sellers opt to NOT sell internationally at all; the use of a FF allows buyers to purchase items from those sellers. It does not mean its a scam.
farmalljr
·3 years agoIf a seller is opting to NOT sell at all, that should be the end of it. Going around the system shouldn't be allowed, at all. Sellers that do things like that, lose their accounts.
Again, no real good reason for FF'ers at this point. Most of the international scams are all run when using FF'ers. I would be very suspicious of this buyer because they have a case opened and ordered another product. The first thing I would do is block them.
A seller certainly should HAVE a choice in participating in international sales. It's our inventory and WE are assuming ALL of the risks. If I don't want to have to worry about problems with international sales, then I should not be FORCED to. eBay offers a way for buyers to buy internationally, without the use of FF'ers. Again, NO real good reason for them. Other than a loophole to run scams on unsuspecting sellers. There are other means to get something shipped internationally, that offers the seller at least a little more protection.
varebelrose
·3 years ago"A seller certainly should HAVE a choice in participating in international sales. It's our inventory and WE are assuming ALL of the risks. If I don't want to have to worry about problems with international sales, then I should not be FORCED to. eBay offers a way for buyers to buy internationally, without the use of FF'ers. Again, NO real good reason for them. Other than a loophole to run scams on unsuspecting sellers. There are other means to get something shipped internationally, that offers the seller at least a little more protection. "
Again, many sellers do not want to ship internationally, and thats fine. I certainly did not in the last 3-4 years we were actively selling here. But there are international buyers who want items those sellers have. And shipment to a freight forwarder is NOT international, it is to a domestic address, and once the package is delivered to the FF, the seller is good to go. I had many, many successful sales to buyers who used them, and would wager the majority of sellers here have as well, whether they even realized it or not. Its not the cesspool of scams that you seem to be painting it as.
farmalljr
·3 years agoIf that were all true, then there would not be a thread about FFer's not showing as delivered. What eBay says and does, may not be the same thing. If YOU want to roll the dice, that's fine. However, there are sellers here who do NOT want to pay the extra fee for international purchases, and they do NOT want the hassle of an international sale.
How you feel about it means nothing. How I or others want to run our business, is our problem. It's none of anyone's business but our own. There are people who want nothing to do with international sales. Respect THEIR opinions on the matter and stop trying to make them bend to your wishes/reasons. The sale may ship to a US address, but ALL of them ship to a US address before being forwarded to other countries. It's an international sale. Period. Playing word salad does not make where the package ends up, anyplace different. Your duty is NEVER done at the point of delivery. You have sold here long enough to know that, so lets not play that game either.
If international buyers want things bad enough, there are other ways to get it. Air America is a prime example of filling that gap. It's a USA sale, to a USA funding source. There is never any returns with them either, as I am sure they make those sales final to all their international buyers.
varebelrose
·3 years ago"How you feel about it means nothing. How I or others want to run our business, is our problem. It's none of anyone's business but our own. There are people who want nothing to do with international sales. Respect THEIR opinions on the matter and stop trying to make them bend to your wishes/reasons."
Passive/aggressive much? I am not trying to make anyone "bend" to any point of view, just pointing out that there are, despite your vehement arguments, valid reasons for buyers to use a FF other than to scam sellers.
"The sale may ship to a US address, but ALL of them ship to a US address before being forwarded to other countries. It's an international sale. Period. Playing word salad does not make where the package ends up, anyplace different. Your duty is NEVER done at the point of delivery. You have sold here long enough to know that, so lets not play that game either."
Of course a sellers "duty is done" once a package is shown delivered. Shipping to a US based FF address that has tracking shown delivered IS done, at least as far as any possibility of an INR case being filed. Thats not "word salad", that is literally eBay policy.
"If international buyers want things bad enough, there are other ways to get it. Air America is a prime example of filling that gap. It's a USA sale, to a USA funding source. There is never any returns with them either, as I am sure they make those sales final to all their international buyers."
Air America and the various other versions of that company ARE a freight forwarder lol.
farmalljr
·3 years agoA few things, Air America is NOT a freight forwarder. They are a RESELLER of items on eBay. You give your feedback to AIR AMERICA, not their buyer. They are the BUYER, not a FFer.
When you can show how eBay always follows it's policies and can show where they have removed from the terms of service "we can change these rules at any point without notice" or where they have removed the "we can make any decision we want and it's final" THEN maybe your point is more believable. We all know eBay does not in fact, always follow it's own policies. It's not a passive aggressive response. It's another member here trotting out the eBay talking points, sweeping things under the rug at the seller's expense. eBay does NOT back the seller as the rules says they will, 100% of the time.
If a seller here doesn't want to mess with international sales or buyers, it's the sellers business, not mine or yours. You in effect try to play off that there are sellers who have gotten hosed shipping to FFer's. Some of us can afford to absorb those "costs of doing business". Other's can't afford it. You are not an employee of ebay, and you are not backing sellers who will lose money in those scams. So why are you so invested in pretending that ALL sales are protected, when they just aren't? You keep stating it like it's fact. If it was, no thread would ever have been made about how eBay failed to protect sellers and the buyer scammed them through a FFer.
What you may have experienced up to this point, may NOT be the same thing others have experienced. I'm not passive aggressive, I'm pointing out fake news.
reallynicestamps
·3 years agoIf international buyers want things bad enough, there are other ways to get it. Air America is a prime example of filling that gap. It's a USA sale, to a USA funding source.
Air America is a freight forwarder.
farmalljr
·3 years agoThey are NOT a freight forwarder. Period. I'm about tired of people claiming they are. Air America is a RESELLER that SHIPS internationally. When Air American BUYS from you, they pay you. You give THEM feedback. You SHIP to them. They in turn, reship the package THEIR customer bought. Air America IS your customer, not the end receiver. Air America's business is built on copying your listings and selling for a mark up. No different than if a reseller for Amazon buys your product. The Amazon reseller IS your customer, NOT whoever they sold to.
If you don't know the difference between a freight forwarder and a reseller, then I don't know what to tell ya. No excuse to spread fake and false information. A freight forwarder has NOTHING to do with buying the item, they ONLY are receiving and reshipping the package. Period.
Sheesh....
sticker*pimp
·3 years agoActually, yes there is. I have a house in the Caribbean. Water access only. There is no Postal service here. I have to use a freight forwarder in Florida to get packages to me. They have a depot on one of the main islands. Usually take 4 days to receive after it arrives in Florida.
slippinjimmy
·3 years agoAnother reason is cost, eBay's International Shipping is NOT cheap in any way shape or form. It might be a bit less than USPS direct but that is all. I can ship to most countries for less than half what EIS charge, forwarders which have much higher volume obviously pay even less than me.
Some of my very best overseas buyers use Forwarders even though I am happy to ship direct if they wish. It's probably because that is just the way they normally buy from the US
joels-retrocade
·3 years agoIf your margins allow for it maybe add signature required for the third one just in case lol.
the_fancy_fox
·3 years agoI think I would Head to Facebook and explain the tracking and what we were told here on the forum. Ask for them to close the case.
As for shipping the other one….. tough call. Have you tried talking to your buyer?
lakefor94
·3 years agoYep, you are going to lose the INR the buyer filed. It is the reshipper joints that get that scan.
I am sure you have seen the LONG thread on this debacle.
I believe the sellers are having to go thru Facebook to get these closed.
I think the buyer is playing you.
1tuna
·3 years agoI would ship it
the buyer does not live in Wilmington De most likely
its probably a reshipper so its kind of like the buyer is not really sure if the reshipper even got the package or not
the buyer probably saw the weird tracking and figure they had better do something
@inhawaii
ajs_coins_and_alchemy
·3 years agoEither he got the 2nd one and bought a 3rd ... or he never got the 2nd one and is trying to by one to replace the one he didn't get?
I think his newest purchase has no bearing on the INR case. If he is a good repeat buyer and came back and bought another, he isn't scamming you...who tries to scam someone while continuing to buy? His INR is logical/plausible with weird delivery stuff going on and maybe did receive it eventually.
I would let the case play out and allow new purchase to proceed and wait for more information to come your way before making any decisions.
I mean what would/could you do about the case right now? Let that play out.
What could/would you do about this purchase? Cancel it? Seems no reason to unless this was an apparent scam.
What could you do about his future business? Block? I wouldnt unless it was a scam but he is a good repeat customer who continued to buy even after having hiccups with you.
I'd go with the flow and hang loose if I were you 🤙🤙