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Sold 'No Returns'- wants refund, sent back same picture in listing claiming 'Not As Described'
Woman bids on and buys a model Department 56 building, about 8" high. I listed it Used, "Like new", and No returns.
She files for a return. Ebay immediately grabs the money from my bank account, and puts it on hold.
She says, "There's a light pole missing from the front right side, see?"
Its literally the same photo that I had in the ad. In fact I had two pictures of the front of the building, one was a close-up. My pictures of the item in the ad, were clearer and better than hers in the message after it was shipped to her!
My issue is this.
Why she bid on it, and now doesn't want it, I don't know. But now I have to pay to ship it back to myself, and Ebay will refund her purchase AND shipping out of my bank account.
And I had sold it No Returns!
How can they say its not as described, when you take full photos all the way around?
I called and finally got someone at Support. They said this: Yes we see your point. Go ahead and refund her money, pay to ship it back to yourself. Then wait two days. You can then file a dispute and prove to us you were in the right. We then if approved, will refund your return shipping then.
I said, why can't I prove it now?
If you're going to cover the return shipping, why can't you pay the return shipping now?
Because you have to take pictures of the item after you mail it back to yourself, says Support.
Why can't you use the pictures she just messaged me?
That's not the way it works, is the response
How can I possibly prove my case, after I have it back in my own possession?
The policy is maddening. Honestly I just don't trust Ebay to refund my double shipping. If they are going to do it, why won't they do it now.
And how can all this be happening, when I specifically listed it and they agreed on sale, No Returns?
kh-calisto
·10 months agoHi everyone,
Due to the age of this thread, it has been closed to further replies. Please feel free to start a new thread if you wish to continue to discuss this topic.
Thank you for understanding.
inhawaii
·10 months agoCustomer filed a INAD and returned the item and it was in fact just as you described it? I think we've all had that happen to us. It happens. It's all part of selling online. Juat be thankful you got the item back instead a box of rocks.
soh.maryl
·10 months agoGiven the age of this post, let's hope that the issue was resolved.
reallynicestamps
·10 months agoYou can have a No Returns policy.
And abandon the product with the unhappy buyer.
You cannot have a No Refunds policy.
The buyer gets the refund, and since you refuse the return, keeps the unwanted product to dispose of as they will.
A seller with a No Returns policy can demand the return of the product, however.
The seller will likely be required to supply return shipping but need not refund until the purchase is returned.
seolinke
·10 months agohy this platform are good
soh.maryl
·10 months agoWere you told that you'd be paid to post here?
jonathanbrightlight
·10 months agoOLD THREAD
alightmo-8
·2 years agoFacing a frustrating situation here. Sold a Department 56 building, listed as 'Like new' with 'No returns' on eBay. The buyer claims a missing light pole, though the photos in the ad, even clearer than hers, show otherwise. Now, I'm on the hook for return shipping and refunding, despite the 'No Returns' policy. eBay suggests I pay upfront and file a dispute later, which feels risky. Their process seems counterintuitive and unfair. Has anyone dealt with a similar issue?
mam98031
·2 years ago@alightmo-8
While there is such a thing as a No Return Policy on Ebay, ALL sellers are require to meet or beat the MBG. So while a seller with this policy can deny a properly filed Buyers Remorse claim, they can not do that with an INAD. The seller needs to process those even with a No Return Policy.
It is find if the seller doesn't want the buyer to return the item, but then the seller needs to refund the buyer or Ebay will force them to.
Pictures ARE NOT a replacement for a proper description and stating the proper condition of an item. That is an open invitation for an INAD.
robbie31415
·2 years agoThe OP knows.
Similar posts with them having no return policy back in March.
https://community.ebay.com/t5/Selling/Ebay-support-not-telling-the-truth/td-p/33605344
mam98031
·2 years agoInteresting, How did we get back here again on the same thing?
mam98031
·2 years agoIt is really important @barclays_curious to understand what each Return Policy Means. While a No Return policy may mean you won't accept returns, it does NOT mean you won't give refunds.
The return policies options are as follows.
With option number 1, No Returns the seller can completely deny taking a return for a Buyer's Remorse Return Request, if the buyer properly filed the claim. Or if they want to they can accept the return and have the buyer pay the return shipping. If the seller so chooses they can withhold the original shipping if it was separately stated on the listing [not free shipping] when it is time to refund the buyer.
On options 2 & 3 the buyer is responsible for the return shipping on a Buyer's Remorse Return. Plus if the seller so chooses they can withhold the original shipping if it was separately stated on the listing [not free shipping] when it is time to refund the buyer. As of October 1st 2019, sellers that are TRS have some additional protections as well as they can issue partial refunds if they options 2 or 3 as their return policy.
On options 4 & 5 above, they are also known as Free Returns. If a seller that has either of those policies they will pay the return shipping even on a buyer's remorse return. A seller can withhold the original shipping value from the refund if the shipping was separately stated in the listing [not free shipping]. Also Seller’s offering options 4 or 5 have the ability to do partial refunds in certain cases if the item arrives back damaged, missing something or in a condition less than what it was sent to the buyer in, see the policy for more details, the link is below. In the cases where a deduction in the refund is taken due to damage or other authorized reasons for a partial refund, Ebay will protect the seller from negative or neutral feedback.
ALL OPTIONS [1, 2, 3, 4 and 5] are required to process SNAD claims without exception. Even if they are improperly filed and should have been a Buyer’s Remorse claim.
All return policies by sellers must meet or exceed what is stated in the Money Back Guarantee Policy!
14 day return policies are allowed in certain categories: Camera Drones, Camera lenses, Collectibles & Art, Digital Cameras, Jewelry and Medical & Mobility.
For those with Free Return and/or TRS members with 30 day return policies, there are some added protection benefits, one of which is the ability to do a discounted refund under certain conditions.
albertabrightalberta
·2 years agoSince no one else brought this specific detail up, I'll point out that @barclays_curious didn't list the item as "used" or "pre-owned" or whatever the terminology is for collectibles.
The listing was posted as "new (other)" and "new" doesn't mean lightly used.
And in fact, on the condition page, ebay states what "new (other)" means:
https://www.ebay.com/pages/help/sell/contextual/condition_1.html
It's a pet peeve of mine and a lot of buyers to search ebay for "new" items and read descriptions that say, "used just 3 times," or "only worn for 2 hours at a wedding," or "like new, lightly used."
Although there are cases in which buyers lie and claim NAD because they changed their minds or don't want to pay return shipping, I don't believe this is one of those cases.
barclays_curious
OP2 years agoListen to this. Now this is TOTALLY unfair.
When this buyer filed for a return on my No Returns Agreement sale. Ebay then immediately took and withheld not only the sale money, but they took the same amount of shipping money out of my bank account, too, that I had spent to ship it to the customer.
Wait a minute. I never PAID that shipping money to Ebay, I paid it to the post office!!!
Then.... they told ME to pay to ship the item back to myself!
Seriously. So I paid to ship it once, then twice when Ebay seized the shipping money amount again. And then a third time to ship it back to myself. That's 3 times, with no sale at all.
Why does Ebay get to seize and hold the post office shipping money also, a second time?
Then get this. They allow me to offer a partial refund as one of the options, instead of paying to ship it back to myself after I paid to ship it to the buyer, AND paid Ebay the same amount. But it says "You Only Get One Chance" to offer a partial refund.
What the heck is this??????
Why is there only one chance? And then what, Ebay takes ALL the money?
uchhhhh
albertabrightalberta
·2 years agoYou are confused about paying for shipping. You aren't paying for shipping 3 times. You've paid twice.
When the buyer made the purchase, they paid for the item + shipping + sales tax.
From that money, ebay took FVF and you had a balance that included the shipping charge you charged the buyer.
If you printed the label through ebay, you paid for the shipping label with the funds paid by the buyer. (First label you paid for.)
When the buyer filed for the return, you're paying for a second label.
ajs_coins_and_alchemy
·2 years agoApparently you didn't read the fine print of the "No Returns Agreement Sale" you entered into.
You didn't pay out of pocket for the shipping the first time you paid for it with whatever you collected from the buyer (at least you should have). So you never covered shipping the first time. So you only paid shipping twice. You are NOW covering original shipping cost and covering return shipping cost. Your original shipping was covered by buyer.
Partial refund is something you can send the buyer to encourage them to keep it and encourage them to close the case. They must agree to it. Reasons you do this would include if the buyer could (for example) replace the light pole for $10, you could offer them $10 to cover the cost of the replacement light pole. They keep item, you keep most of the sale money and everyone is happy. You usually negotiate this before sending... you only have 1 chance to send it and then buyer can choose to close the case or not.
If buyer closes case because partial refund, you'd have paid buyer partial refund out of your pocket but EBay would release the held funds back to you. The money ebay took is to cover the return in the (likely) event of a refund. If buyer closed case now (w/ or w/o partial refund from you) you'd get your money back. If buyer follows through with case and wants to return for refund EBay holds the money from you to give to buyer.
Nothing is unfair about it. It's what you signed up for and agreed to. You shouldve read the fine print.
mam98031
·2 years agoThis is just a person peeve of mine, so take it for what it is worth "Apparently you didn't read the fine print ..."
Fine print denotes very small print usually at the bottom of something, often used to hide or detract from anyone really reading it. Ebay doesn't write any of their policies this way. To include the Return Policies.
farmalljr
·2 years agoYou don't understand how selling works here. I suggest you get real familiar with how it works. Babbling in anger isn't solving a thing.
mementomoria
·2 years agoConsider yourself lucky to be getting your item back and you can relist it properly. If you continue to fight this, the buyer will simply do a charge back and they will keep the item and get their money back.
civicwagonparts
·2 years agoFirst rule of ebay: Do not sell anything you cannot afford to lose.
I am going thru the same thing with a buyer using my pics from the description on an eBay "not as described" claim.
I did get eBay to see this, and the claim was denied.
So the buyer filed a Payment Dispute chargeback w their CC company, and that was decided in the buyers favor. eBay took the funds right out of my bank account.
I am now in the appeal process with eBay, but I am not expecting a positive outcome.
Mine was a $300 car bumper with $180 in shipping costs.
At first it used to really get me angry. Now I look at returns as around 1% of my yearly sales, and write it off to the cost of doing business.
barclays_curious
OP2 years agoNever mind. You and I both know that even if I had sold the item "AS IS, NO REFUNDS", Ebay would still have taken the sale money back, and given them a refund, and charged me double shipping.
Because its not their money, its my money right? Makes all the difference in the world.
ebeths_eclectic_collectibles
·2 years ago“As is†is always problematic when there is a money back satisfaction guarantee involved and eBay is certainly no the only marketplace to have these buyer protections in place. I have to admit I have used the terms “As is†without problem but usually it is to highlight condition issues that are far from perfect. If you are going to use these terms, and I would sparingly, make sure you highlight damage, wear, missing parts etc to the best of your ability.
evry1nositswindy
·2 years agoFrom your description: Lightly used in LIKE NEW condition. All original packaging in good shape.
In your description, you say all are in good shape. No where does it say that anything is missing. Something missing is not like new. It is not as described, the buyer is right. Your no returns policy means just that--you don't want the item returned. You still have to refund if the item is not as described. You can send a post-paid label to the buyer if you want the item back. If not, just refund. Either way, you have to refund.
barclays_curious
OP2 years agoMessage received. I will never use the words "Like New" again, until they drop me in the ground!
Apparently that is licence for the buyer to be blind, and not look at what they're buying. And selling no refunds, means they can return it. Check.
My only question is: Whats the purpose of the No Returns, if buyer can return it anyway?
Please answer that.
I'd love to hear the explanation.
toomuchstuffagain35
·2 years agoIf you have no returns, it doesn't prevent a buyer filing a Not as Described claim which overrides your No Returns.
What No Returns does is give you the option of accepting or denying a remorse return.
lakefor94
·2 years agoTrue. If the buyer had selected a remorse return reason such as "Just did not like it" the seller can deny the return.
yuzuha
·2 years agoAn item that is missing a piece is not "Like New."
farmalljr
·2 years agoYOU are the one that described it (wrongly). Don't blame the buyer for not looking close enough at the pictures. You can see what each condition description means, if you read it. There is no world where something is missing pieces, and it's "like new". It's missing pieces, it is damaged.
You don't have to take the item back. That is what no returns means. If you don't want it back, you can just refund the buyer and let them keep the item. There is NO such things as no REFUNDS however. Even if eBay in certain circumstances would allow you to deny a return, the buyer can still file a chargeback with paypal or their credit card company, up to 180 days AFTER a purchase.
Welcome to selling on line. If these terms don't suit you, then you may want to consider only selling in person for cash payments. There is no such thing as a final sale when you transact electronically.
inhawaii
·2 years ago"No returns" only applies to remorse returns (I changed my mind).
If in this case the buyer wanted to return the item because he/she changed her mind,
your "no returns" policy would hold.
All buyers are covered by ebay's MBG (money back guarantee).
So because this is a INAD (item not as described) return, buyers are entitled to return an item for a refund.
If you don't accept the return, ebay will still refund the buyer and they will get to keep the item.
Sorry this happened to you but it's all part of selling on ebay.
rugerskick
·2 years agoIts usually better to describe an item in lesser terms than what it actually is.
Also if an item does have defects, even if trivial to the seller, they should be mentioned, to prevent a largely-preventable INAD case being submitted.
Do your best to minimize hassle and potential reasons why something could come back to you. In the long run it pays off for you and your buyers.
rovemele-zmdmfp
·2 years agono returns only apply when a remorse buyer didnt like it or care for it regrets the purchase you are just letting them know by no returns on remorse sales so most will use not as discribe so they wount have to pay for return
cause they also know they might get it for free cause you dont want to spend that xtra money to send a label so u tell them to keep it and must give them still a full refund you will get many that know how to play the game cause
they x sellers or have another page they sell and has been done to them . i personal rather lose for them to ship it back to me than they get to keep it for free .. many buyer got a item for free and than they get hooked . so it your choice i also have no returns cause i sell to get rid of it but at time you get some that want everything for free and u cant do nothing about it ( that ebay life here ) gotta take the good and block those bad people and at least report them . like that at least the more they get reported they wont be able to do it again and again to other good luck
inhawaii
·2 years agoI hear a lot of people on the boards say that.
With all due respect, that just is not true.
I have a no returns policy and I DO want the item back.
I accept INAD returns and refund the customer when I get the item back.
I've never had a customer get a refund and get to keep the item (unless I decided to do so).
evry1nositswindy
·2 years ago@inhawaii Thanks for the clarification. I offer free returns, so I wasn't aware of the differentiation. With a not as described, we are all at the mercy of the 30 day money back guarantee.