Should I accommodate this buyer's request? And if so, how?
This is from an auction winner. If I understand right they want me to cancel their order and relist the item as a BIN. The are in China but their account is a decade old and they have 795 positive feedbacks including 6 in the past month, so I'm not thinking this is any kind of scam setup. Well unless by "open a new link" they are talking about an off-eBay purchase, but I don't think so.
Am I being naive? It is strange that they say the amount breakdown "changed" -is there any reason eBay would do that on the buyer's invoice? If you think this is a safe and straightforward request, how should I price the BIN? -As you can see I didn't actually charge them $49 for shipping, so I assume they're seeing overseas stuff included in their shipping cost. Goodness sake, now I realize I don't even know if this is an EIS purchase or if they're talking about the quote given to them by a freight forwarder. I probably need to ask them a question or two, but I'm not even sure 'what' questions to ask them. I just know they seem like a good buyer and I really don't want to start this auction all over again!
The email:
"Hello, I'm sorry for the delay in payment for a few days. Due to customs clearance issues with previous packages, I would like to ask for your assistance. The original total price was 187.5+49.1=236.6 (total price), but now it has been changed to 125.5+111.1=236.6 (total price). The total price remains unchanged. However, due to the price exceeding the requirements during Chinese customs clearance, you can cancel the order and open a new link. I will purchase again at the bidding price. I hope to receive your understanding and assistance."
reallynicestamps
·2 years agoUmmm - does no one remember who built those railroads that opened the West?
There are many native born Americans (and Canadians) whose ancestry is not Europe.
And it is currently fashionable for third or fourth generation Americans to use their "ethnic" name rather than anglicizing it.
That being said.
If you google the address and it appears to be a freight forwarder, you know that you have the second safest address possible.
No INR, because delivery to the FF is delivered.
No NAD, because you only have to supply the return shipping label to the FF address. And if unused the RSL is refundable.
And no porch pirates.
We are still vulnerable to chargebacks, but that's true of shipping to a suburban home too.
gurlcat
OP2 years agoTo be clear, the buyer's account says they are in China and in their emails they did talk about customs practices in China. But anyway yeah if they're using a FF, I'm not skerred at all!
ryanrobyn
·2 years agoIf you do this make it as "make an offer" (price it higher and then tell him what price you will accept) and make the shipping flat rate and not calculated
gurlcat
OP2 years agoToo late, see other replies.
gurlcat
OP2 years agoSo after a few more weird emails last night, and the fact that the "private listing for ____" BIN listing was drawing lots of views and making me nervous, I ended it and went to bed. When I woke up I found that the auction order was paid for, with the shipping having a non-EIS address.
So, sounds like a FF, the only thing is it's in North Carolina on the East Coast, not the West Coast as is normally the case for Asian FF's. This kind of makes me wonder if the package is actually going to Russia. I have heard that there are Russian buyers working around their accounts being blocked by eBay, by having Chinese buyers make purchases for them, then U.S. FF's shipping to them. Incidentally my 2 most frequent non-domestic buyers have always been Chinese and Russian (they're both crazy for vintage jewelry I guess), and I can recall at least one instance since the war started where my buyer was Chinese but the shipping was for a Russian name and an East Coast address.
Anyway, a lot of yall are going to wince, but I'm shipping this puppy! I agree 100% with Dr. Angelou, and what Chinese and Russian buyers have shown me is they are far less trouble than Americans (particularly American women, if I'm being fully honest). I can't recall a single problem with any Chinese or Russian buyer ...... now, Chinese SELLERS, whole other story.
Anyway, if this does go sideways somehow, I promise I will update and accept the deserved "I told you so"s.
dbfolks166mt
·2 years agoSo after a few more weird emails last night, and the fact that the "private listing for ____" BIN listing was drawing lots of views and making me nervous, I ended it and went to bed. When I woke up I found that the auction order was paid for, with the shipping having a non-EIS address.
So, sounds like a FF, the only thing is it's in North Carolina on the East Coast, not the West Coast as is normally the case for Asian FF's. This kind of makes me wonder if the package is actually going to Russia. I have heard that there are Russian buyers working around their accounts being blocked by eBay, by having Chinese buyers make purchases for them, then U.S. FF's shipping to them. Incidentally my 2 most frequent non-domestic buyers have always been Chinese and Russian (they're both crazy for vintage jewelry I guess), and I can recall at least one instance since the war started where my buyer was Chinese but the shipping was for a Russian name and an East Coast address.
Quite possible the buyer is from/in Russia. Package could be going to friend or family or to US FF. To the best of my knowledge eBay like a lot of other companies blocked buyers based on their shipping address not their registered address. Even if they had done so based on the buyers registered address there are easy ways around either situation.
It is pretty well known that Chinese business entrepreneurs setup Chinese based FF companies inside China where purchased items are shipped to from all over the world. Items are received in China and then quickly shipped to the sanctioned country buyers such as those in Russia and North Korea. China pretty much ignores the sanctions put in place by lot of countries over the war in Ukraine. The process also works quite well in reverse for sellers shipping items out of Russia.
Anyway, a lot of yall are going to wince, but I'm shipping this puppy! I agree 100% with Dr. Angelou, and what Chinese and Russian buyers have shown me is they are far less trouble than Americans (particularly American women, if I'm being fully honest). I can't recall a single problem with any Chinese or Russian buyer ...... now, Chinese SELLERS, whole other story.
Anyway, if this does go sideways somehow, I promise I will update and accept the deserved "I told you so"s.
a_c_green
·2 years agoTo a North Carolina address? You'll be fine. It doesn't matter if the buyer wants to fudge the paperwork with whoever is receiving it in NC, because your delivery obligation is fulfilled as soon as tracking shows a Delivered status to the City and ZIP of the Ship To: address you received with the payment.
If they try to file a Not As Described claim later on for some reason, they will need to return the items to NC first, since that's where your Return label will originate from.
gurlcat
OP2 years agoYup, that's my thoughts too. Not to say some nonsense is out of the question; there are scams involving returns via FF's, and of course card chargebacks are always a potential threat. But I follow policies for maximum seller protections, and (to reiterate what I said from the start) this buyer DOES have a great record. I think they were just trying to get me to help them game the system a little bit, but that doesn't mean they'll game me instead, and I don't have the achilles' heels that some sellers have so gaming me isn't so easy.
sextons-sweet-deals
·2 years agoCome on! It's China!
You know better. You have been here for years.
If you're willing to ship international, then you need to use eBay international service to be protected.
reallynicestamps
·2 years agoIf the customer is willing to cheat customs they are also willing to cheat you.
Cancel as requested.
Block dishonest buyer.
Relist.
dbfolks166mt
·2 years agoIf the customer is willing to cheat customs they are also willing to cheat you.
Cancel as requested.
Block dishonest buyer.
Relist.
If it goes through EIS not really the sellers issue if there are problems it's eBay's to deal with.
reallynicestamps
·2 years ago@dbfolks166mt
Maya Angelou - "When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time."
Why deal in any way with a crook?
dbfolks166mt
·2 years ago@dbfolks166mt
Maya Angelou - "When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time."
Why deal in any way with a crook?
Generally I would agree but at least they are showing you up front what they are attempting to do. The buyer is in China so it's the Chinese government he is cheating out of the taxes and import fees. EBay doesn't seem to care about scammers and thieves so why should anyone else. Given some of the crap China is pulling with all the counterfeit items, who's production is likely backed by the government, more power to the buyer.
It's like all the sellers who have never reported their income from eBay and are now screaming about the pending 1099-K issuance changes at the federal level. Several states, of course, have already changed.
dbfolks166mt
·2 years agoRegardless of whether the buyer is using a FF or this is going through the EIS program the only thing you have control over as far as the shipping is the domestic leg. If it goes through a FF that piece of the transaction is outside of eBay and is between the buyer and the FF. What the FF does with regards to the customs forms is between the buyer and the FF.
If this were to go through the EIS program, which it is what it sounds like the buyer is seeing, you have no control or ability to send the buyer an invoice that is done by the EIS program and includes the cost for the item and both shipping legs, your domestic leg as well as the international leg. EIS collects taxes and duties for some countries, China apparently being one of them. I am guessing that those are shown separately in the invoice EIS sends to the buyer and are not part of the $49.10 shipping cost. So the buyer is probably getting an invoice for $187.50 + $49.10 + taxes/duties.
The buyer is wanting you to change the sale price to $125.50 and increase the shipping cost to reduce the taxes/duties but unless you put a fixed price of $62.00 on the domestic shipping leg there is no way you can alter/change the international leg but the total shipping cost the buyer would see on the invoice would be the $111.10 they are alluding to.
Below is probably what the buyer is seeing for the shipping cost.
gurlcat
OP2 years agoDang it, now I wish I hadn't checked my email before a good night's sleep. I have such smooth sailing most of the time, stuff like this just riles me up. And I had such a GREAT DAY of azz-kicking, did a bunch of stuff I had been procrastinating, and until about an hour ago I was marveling at how none of the things that could go wrong did.
Now I'm looking at my bank accounts and realizing the guy at Costco got me to use the wrong card for the core charge refund on my old battery, and I reallyreallyREALLY don't want to go all the way there again. Now this thing with a buyer. -Tell you what, if I have to cancel this order I am reporting them. I just had a non-payer last week.
chapeau-noir
·2 years agoFWIW, I believe postal duty into China starts at 500 yuan - about 65$ US.
gurlcat
OP2 years agoThe only theory I have is that the strange "changed" price breakdown is what a freight forwarder is giving them as an invoice, not eBay. But then again, I don't really know how things work with FF's so that's my only guess.
Unavailable member
·2 years agoCall me skeptical, but I'm not buying into the buyers claims. The auction price wouldn't change unless you sent a discounted invoice.
If it was my auction, I would cancel the order per buyer requested, then block the buyer. Send second chance offer to the next highest bidder. Because to me it sounds like a problem waiting to happen.
albertabrightalberta
·2 years agoI'm not sure what he's asking either as I don't know what those numbers represent but I'm guessing it a way to get you to lie on the customs form.
Instead of selling the item as 187.50, he wants you to make the price 125.50. And you're supposed to make up the difference by padding the shipping charge.
I wouldn't do it.
gurlcat
OP2 years agoOh I should have been clearer -I won't be filling out any customs forms, lol I have no idea how people do international shipping on their own. I do only EIS, or if someone has an order shipped to a FF that's fine with me too.
After I made this post I realized it's late at night so I probably won't get a lot of member advice. I decided to just go ahead and create a BIN listing for $187.50 (their winning bid) plus $8.85 (my original shipping price) re-titled it 'PRIVATE LISTING FOR _____ ONLY!' and sent them the link. I said if they pay for it, then I'll cancel the auction order. I want to help if they're asking for something I can do without jeopardizing my own money or relationship with eBay, so what I did will have to do, or SORRY!
a_c_green
·2 years agoThat won't change anything; don't do it. The high Shipping charge is from eBay (shown to the buyer, not to you) as part of their international shipping (for Customs fees or Duty charges or whatever). The buyer will end up seeing the same numbers as before.
a_c_green
·2 years agoThat's it exactly. The purchase price of $187.50 is apparently incurring a higher duty fee on him than if he got you to re-jigger the pricing to be a $125.50 purchase with a higher shipping charge (which he hopes you will agree to as it keeps your original total for the sale).
The $49.10 Shipping cost he mentions sounds like what he is getting from eBay for their eBay International Shipping; if he was using a reshipper he would be seeing only a domestic (U.S.) shipping charge.
His English makes things a little confusing. Instead of writing "you can cancel the order" he means to say "can you cancel the order" and then send him a link to a new listing with revised pricing.
I don't see the point of indulging this buyer. I would either cancel right away as Buyer Requested (which it technically is), or tell him in a short and clear reply that you are not able to revise the terms of sale, so all you can offer is a straight cancellation (don't get into haggling a relisting) or let him pay the balance as it stands right now. If it is eBay International Shipping, they're going to pile on their international fees regardless of how you change the Shipping costs on your end.
gurlcat
OP2 years agoI took it as them saying what it was changed TO was problematic, so they need a listing that is like it was originally intended to be.
If you're right and they're trying to get me to change the item/shipping prices in the BIN, I guess I won't do that, although I can't see what difference it would make for me, not even in my eBay fees.
a_c_green
·2 years agoWell, maybe so, but the unexpected fees they are seeing were due to eBay handling the international shipping for you, part of which is to collect the Customs/Duty fees on behalf of the buyer's country. If you shipped the item directly to the buyer in China, he would have to pay that same amount to his post office. If you undervalued the sale and jacked up your Shipping to compensate, AND shipped it internationally yourself instead of handing it off to eBay International Shipping, then he might pay less at the receiving end, but I see no advantage in helping him evade Customs fees that don't involve you in the first place. That is his problem, not yours. Don't make it yours.
gurlcat
OP2 years agoOh I am definitely not taking a crash course in direct international shipping for someone who should have asked at any point in the 7 days before sniping this win. As it stands, they can pay for the auction win or pay for the listed BIN, or get nothing but reported to eBay.
dbfolks166mt
·2 years agoI looked at the listing and provided the Chinese buyer is not using a freight forwarder this item would go through the EIS program at checkout. I am not what the buyer is referencing with regards to the "price change" but if they have not paid yet they may not have any intention of paying. I would probably just cancel the listing using buyer requested. I would reach out to the buyer and let them know you have canceled the order and are working on relisting the item as BIN/IPR but you cannot guarantee some other will not buy it after it i posted. Repost the listing and as soon as it is up send the buyer a link to the new listing.
As for relisting it I would price it at the $187.50 with Immediate Payment Required (IPR) and calculated shipping. Its the same price the auction ended at so not sure what the buyer will see when they open the new listing.
solidguitar1961
·2 years agoCustoms fraud