selling sewing patterns Part 2
Follow up to my previous thread.
1. what is your shipping method? poly mailer? bubble mailer? cardboard mailer? one of the first two but with cardboard stiffener?
2. I read online to mark "do not bend" to avoid damage to the pattern. that to me suggest cardboard stiffening
3. can they ship Media Mail? A lot of conflicting advice online. Some sites say categorically yes while others reproduce USPS information about media mail
39 comments
krazzykats
·2 years agoWhen I was selling patterns exclusively, I used comic book bags and boards with a kraft mailing envelope, now I use the eBay bubble envelopes for the occasional pattern sale.
Comic book bags are cheap protection for sewing patterns. And with comic boards keep patterns flat. They also reduce pattern envelope wearing when handling/storing the patterns.
mam98031
·2 years ago@krazzykats
I'm not familiar with a "comic book bag". Would you mind providing a picture or listing for them please.
krazzykats
·2 years agocomic book bags and boards for sale | eBay
toomuchstuffagain35
·2 years agoI ship most in an ebay padded mailer. I do tape the sides at the top where the flaps are so it's more waterproof than being open.
The larger pattern packs - ie some of the classic Vogue etc I also ship in a comic book bag with backing board in a larger ebay padded mailer.
fern*wood
·2 years agoMy friend used to sell nothing but patterns. This is several years back, but she told me she started getting them returned with postage due because the envelopes were too flat to qualify for tracking. She started added a hard mint candy to each package to make it lumpy. I thought her candy solution wasn't good, but she never listened to me. ðŸ˜
keziak
OP2 years agoWas that because back then before First Class got absorbed into Ground Advantage she used First Class instead of a flat?
I'm not too keen on shipping things with no tracking, I'll try experimenting with the flats and see how it goes.
mam98031
·2 years agoI would not recommend shipping without tracking unless you don't mind the problems that this can cause a seller. Not only in their seller stats, but because it is much easier for a buyer to file an INR and win every time.
femmefan1946
·2 years ago@mam98031
The thing with patterns is that the buyer is someone who actually reads the listing and actively enjoys following instructions.
They are among the easiest buyers to deal with since they can look ahead and solve problems before they happen.
The only time a customer was unhappy was when I goofed and listed a cut pattern as uncut. She let me know in Messages, I apologized and sent a full refund. Problem solved.
There are many categories where tracking is absolutely necessary. Anything that attracts males between 15-35 in particular. I don't sell in those.
policequilts
·2 years agoI haven't had any problems with selling patterns.
I normally place one or more in a reclosable plastic bag and then into a poly mailer.
I would add some cardboard for some of the quilt patterns because they are flimsy and larger size.
Never had a problem even with the Ann Person's or Great Copy patterns that are about 12" x 8".
lacemaker3
·2 years ago@keziak,
Speaking as someone who has purchased a lot of vintage sewing patterns, I can tell you that just writing "Do not bend" on an envelope is useless.
If a package can bend, then it will probably get bent, no matter what you write on it. If it needs to bend in order to fit into the letterbox, then it will definitely get bent.
I prefer to receive them unbent, so I appreciate it when sellers add some cardboard to the envelope. But I don't recall ever receiving one that had been damaged by being bent.
keziak
OP2 years agoDoes bending ruin a pattern?
lacemaker3
·2 years agoNo. The only way bending or folding could damage a pattern would be if the tissue paper had become brittle, which can happen with age especially if the paper is acidic. But I haven't noticed this happening much with old patterns.
I have some patterns that are 100 years old or a bit more, and they are not brittle, and they don't crack or break when they are folded or handled. The envelopes they are packaged in may be susceptible to damage though. That doesn't affect the function of the pattern pieces (the tissue paper) but it may be important for someone who is primarily a collector.
The tissue paper is thin and fragile, and can be hard to work with, but it is more susceptible to moisture and rough handling.
joleneandjack
·2 years agoI had water damage in my house and getting the tissue paper wet made them useless to try to salvage, even when they dried. Huge mess.
mam98031
·2 years agoIt can. Depends on how badly the carrier bends it. If it is a booklet getting bent, it really degrades the quality of the booklet. As a crafter, I hate working with a pattern that is all bent up.
nobody*s_perfect
·2 years agoA few years ago, USPS removed all references to "Do not bend" in their policy manual, and actually issued a memo specifically stating that they pay no attention to "Do not bend" instructions, adding that if you don't want an item bent, then you should make it un-bendable. Which can be done with two layers of corrugated cardboard, with the grain going crosswise to each other.
There has been a longstanding mailing standard that mailers marking their mailpieces with “Do Not Bend†must add a stiffener within the mailpiece. That requirement was included to provide a sensory reminder in case our employÂees did not see the marking. However, we do not guarantee that these pieces will not be bent during processing or bent or folded when delivered. Therefore, we are removing references to this marking. We recommend that mailers prepare these items (that could be damaged by bending or folding) in boxes or similar protective containers mailed at the applicable parcel rates, instead of adding handling endorsements on the outside of the mailpiece.
https://about.usps.com/postal-bulletin/2007/html/pb22213/updt.3.2.html
retro_entertainment_collectibles
·2 years agoWhilst I never sold a sewing pattern the idea comes to mind of simple fold over cardboard. You can find large boxes all over creation for $0, cut em, fold em' over wella... Nice and stiff and easy to do.
Shipping multiples also becomes a breeze and the patterns are not going to add significant weight.
As to shipping price if free isn't actually free then you'll be raising pricing and I've no clue how competitive or not sewing patterns are or will you be producing you're own? That is doable too, very very easy in fact with almost no cost involved. I'd suggest similar to what I do. Make a mock sale up so you know weight and look at highest ground advantage price distant from you versus lowest local/regional to you. Then pick ship price in between. So, those sales closer to you, make a little money on the shipping and those more distant loose little but it should basically balance out. It can position you at an overall better price point for your offerings as you can be price competitive on the article(s) and yet have an attractive shipping position as well. For multiple's as the patterns probably dont much weight(?) do a .50 per additional or something along whatever fits nicely given ratio of cost to additional pattern sold.
Its the model nobody seems to think about! LOL. But over 20 years ago model we used. Here people are either: I charge the shipping or I offer free shipping and roll the expense into the price. I think most consumer can do basic math, more likely get frustrated in having to do that basic math period across handfuls or more of sellers. Another area Amazon shines, "No addition required" LOL. How cool would that be as a marketing campaign, "Amazon your price competitive alternative with no addition required." LOL.
Striking the balance between zoned pricing at a flat rate can be VERY effective in offering better value to the consumer and as a side benefit when rates go up very simple to work with. Go into you're shipping policy and whatever, $6 turns into $6.50, done. If you've multiple pattern buyers that say .50 additional, ok, lets do .60 additional. Nobody gonna blow a cork champagna-tistically speaking.
mam98031
·2 years agoWhat type of sewing patterns are you talking about, it makes a difference?
If they are in a packet, then they need to ship Ground Advantage.
If they are pattern books with 8+ pages they can go Media Mail. This is what I sell mostly, but I do have some pattern packets too.
For my books I do put a piece of cardboard in them to stiffen the package. Then I put in it a 2.5 to 3mil poly mailer and then into an envelop for mailing. The outer envelope has Do Not Bend on the front and the back.
For pattern packets, I put them in a poly mailer and then into an envelope for mailing.
I always double protect patterns, especially this time of year when packages often get wet. I use the letter size Ebay branded bubble mailers for my books too.
I would not go to a cardboard mailer, way too expensive.
Just remember if you are going to stiffen a package, cut your cardboard so that the spines, for strength, in the cardboard run side to side of your package. About 8.5 inches wide and I cut mine about 5-6" tall.
keziak
OP2 years agothanks all for the good advice. Mam98031, what is the envelope you mention? The Priority envelope?
I am debating whether to use Free Shipping. I started another thread about it. Does that discourage multiple orders because there is no combining for a discount? My TOS talk about how to get a discount when combining so I'd have to take that out if I went to Free Shipping. I don't know if many/most people just like Free Shipping.
I left a question for someone selling cardboard mailers. I can't tell from the ad how many are in an order so I don't know the unit price. Seems like a weird thing to leave out.
mam98031
·2 years agoWhen it is an Ebay sale, I use the Ebay branded padded envelopes. I do not use PM unless the buyer has purchased so many books it really is a better way to ship. But sadly not too many of those types of buyers these days.
Free Shipping can be a very good thing. For me I tested that for about a year. It didn't seem to do much for my sales. But yes I made a little more on multiple purchases. Last year I went back to stated shipping and my sales picked up. I'm guessing that more buyers like combined shipping savings or something. But all I know is that for me the stated shipping seems to work better.
In my listings I state the following in the description:
PLEASE READ
COMBINED SHIPPING DISCOUNTS
For those of you interested in multiple listings, I do combine shipping charges.
· PLEASE Check with me or request an invoice BEFORE you pay and I will give you the combined rate / discount on the shipping.
· If you want combined shipping discount you should allow me to invoice you for all your purchases in one invoice.
· Please do not pay each item individually. The fees are just too high. If you pay individually I may not be able to extend you a combine shipping discount.
Attention All International Buyers
I SHIP WORLDWIDE. Contact me for the international shipping costs. It is more expensive, so if you have concerns, contact me before bidding.
All International customers are responsible for any Import duties, taxes or any other charge that may be imposed on the package by your countries Customs Department. Those charges are not included in the item price or shipping charges. These charges are the solely the buyer's responsibility. Please check with your country's customs office to determine what these additional costs will be prior to bidding/buying if you have any concerns. These charges are normally collected by the delivering freight [shipping] company or when you pick the item up ? do not confuse them for additional shipping charges, they have nothing to do with me.
Also please be aware that we do not mark merchandise values below the amount you paid or mark items as a gift. USA and other regulations prohibit such behavior.
I do use EIS, so I guess I should really update my blurb for international shipping. Maybe sometime next year, LOL.
femmefan1946
·2 years agoI am debating whether to use Free Shipping. ....Does that discourage multiple orders because there is no combining for a discount?
In my opinion,no.
Most buyers love the Immediate Gratification of Free Shipping. "Lookit this bargain!!"
Most buyers don't really consider that the cost of shipping comes from somewhere, and that cost is part of the price.
Which is cheaper : A $10item with $5 shipping? A $15 item with Free Shipping?
The seller never pays for shipping. It's part of the price of the item.
And with multiple orders the seller has two choices.
mam98031
·2 years agoSome do and some don't. Depends on what you are selling. Free Shipping is not a one size fits all kind of thing. It works great for some things and not so much for others. Especially if you sell multiple items to one buyer often, they want combined shipping discounts and that is rarely offered by sellers that do free shipping.
nobody*s_perfect
·2 years agoHere's a USPS ruling regarding pattern books. They seem to base their judgment on whether a publication is primarily text-based:
"Crossword puzzles, pattern books, poster books, iron-on transfer books, and cut-out books which do not consist of reading matter as well as publications containing advertising are not acceptable in the mails at the Media Mail rate of postage."
https://pe.usps.com/text/csr/PS-064.htm
mam98031
·2 years agoI know it can be a bit confusing. But the pattern books they are referring to in the paragraph you are quoting are strictly picture books. IDK why they don't say it here.
Pattern books that have instructions on how to create something are consider Educational Materials.
MEDIA MAIL SERVICE
Media Mail shipping is a cost-effective way to send educational materials. This service has restrictions on the type of media that can be shipped. Media Mail rates are limited to the items listed below:
Media Mail packages may not contain advertising. Comic books do not meet this standard. Books may contain incidental announcements of other books and sound recordings may contain incidental announcements of other sound recordings. In accordance with standards in the Mailing Standards of the United States Postal Service, Domestic Mail Manual (DMM), Section 170, Media Mail packages must have a delivery address and the sender’s return address and are subject to inspection by the Postal Service™. Upon such inspection, matter not eligible for the Media Mail rate may be assessed at the proper price and sent to the recipient postage due, or the sender may be contacted for additional postage.
https://about.usps.com/notices/not121/not121_tech.htm
Or section 4.0 of the link below.
https://pe.usps.com/cpim/ftp/manuals/dmm300/173.pdf
You might remember when USPS was really cracking down on items Ebay allowed to be shipped via media mail. In the beginning they [Ebay] had this wrong too. I worked with the shipping team to get this fixed as it greatly affected me and many others. I also had conversations directly with USPS. Finally [took several months] Ebay finally agreed and changed certain categories to allow media mail. Ebay also conversed with USPS on this.
It was such a success to get this corrected, but there remains one mistake on Ebay's part. Magazines are not eligible for media mail but they never split Magazines off to their own sub category. I explained this to the shipping team, but nothing ever came of it.
joleneandjack
·2 years agoGreat leg work!
kitschy*loot
·2 years agoI don't sell them but I collect them, and I can tell you what makes me happy when sellers do it. I like when they sandwich the patterns between sturdy cardboard and place them in a plastic covering and ship inside something waterproof. Some sellers have sent them with no cardboard and no protection from rain and that makes me very displeased but I overlook it as long as it arrives safely.
tobaccocardyahoo
·2 years agoThis is what really frosts me.
Buyers who want packaging which is not necessary to avoid product damage.
Buyers who prefer a solution which is unnecessary.
Buyers who want a package which costs more, both in materials and shipping charges, and takes a greater amount of time to ship.
At least you are not leaving negative FB for sellers who just pack well enough to avoid damage. For this I thank you. Those who haven't accepted that their preferences are not required help make many items not worth selling - and both buyers and sellers suffer as a result.
Every shipping cost increase makes it necessary to do one's best to improve packaging efficiency. Especially when every type of physical media product is less in demand, and impossible to raise prices on the item and its shipping on, most of the time.
mam98031
·2 years agoI personally don't think that @kitschy*loot is asking for something unreasonable. While I don't sandwich my books in cardboard, I do put enough cardboard inside the book to hopefully keep the carrier from bending it. Putting the book inside some kind of plastic envelop is important so they are protected from the weather. They just want to receive their item in the condition it was being sold at. That is a reasonable request IMHO.
reallynicestamps
·2 years agoPoly mailer.
And letter rate, no tracking*.
Sell with Free Shipping (ie shipping is included in my selling price).
Almost all single patterns fit nicely into eBay's branded 6x9" poly mailer.
This is also waterproof, of huge importance with paper goods.
I can't see that there is anything to damage in a paper pattern. All the pieces are folded already, after all.
And the poly mailers are hard to chew up. Which is why they are so widely used in ecommerce.
Most shipments are handled by machinery.
Very few machines can read.
* I'm shipping from Canada. The cost of shipping a 110 gr pattern to the USA by letter is $3.19. With Tracking that rises to $9.68 (although just now we have a promotional discount ).
nobody*s_perfect
·2 years agoIn the US, the rates for First Class letter are available only for pieces up to 1/4 inch thick. For flexible pieces up to 3/4 inch thick and up to 11-1/2 inches long and 6-1/8 inches high, the sender can use the First Class flats rate, AKA Large envelope. There is no tracking for First Class letters or flats, but many sellers of lower-value items are quite successful using these services for items in categories that do not attract scammers.
keziak
OP2 years agoso much new information. mam says patterns in packets need to go Ground Advantage and she uses "an envelope" but doesn't say the First Class Large Envelope. So is the issue moot? I tried to google the question of whether sewing patterns can go by large envelope, no luck and the USPS help center is closed.
nobody*s_perfect
·2 years agoYes, sewing patterns can be mailed as USPS First Class flats if they meet the requirements for dimensions, flexibility etc. If you add cardboard then you can't mail as a flat because they have to be flexible. Also, the weight limit is 13 ounces.
keziak
OP2 years agoLooks like it's $3.03 for 8 oz and $3.99 for 12. Thanks for the clarification of using cardboard. The Endicia label says First Class which is confusing to me because I thought there WAS no more First Class.
keziak
OP2 years agoI found an awesome web site with tons of details about selling patterns, plus I am researching how sellers do it on Ebay. Some of the listings go into a whole lot of detail.
mam98031
·2 years agoPlease share a link to the website you found.
joleneandjack
·2 years agoWhat is the website? Thanks!
mam98031
·2 years agoMake sure to understand the distinction between a sewing pattern PACKET and a sewing pattern book with at least 8 pages. The two are different and the latter qualifies for MM but the packet does NOT.
duffy4444
·2 years agoI think the OP may be unnecessarily concerned and perhaps confused. Unless the patterns are high-value items, there should be no reason to spend Ground Advantage rates on such flexible and thin items.
@nobody*s_perfect has all the solution you need, as long as the USPS guides are heeded.
I have sold hundreds of under-3/4"-thick needlecraft kits and quilt, linen & clothing patterns over the years, and saved a lot of shipping costs by using USPS First Cass Large Envelope. None have been damaged or returned.
The only thing you need to consider is that they cannot get a USPS tracking number. However, they are not really a sought-after item for scammers. The genre of such buyers are more interested in crafting and making something rather than wasting their time scamming, for example, a $10 or $20 item.
Over the years with hundreds of such sales and shipments, I've had only two items that were not received. I believed they were genuinely lost or mis-delivered, and I quickly refunded those two customers. My business model can handle that kind of occasional loss. The postage savings many times over more than makes up for a couple such losses.
IMHO and by years of experience with such items, keep it simple and try it out once or twice with poly bags or manila envelopes.
Cheers, Duffy
net926
·2 years agoI have been selling patterns for many years. Patterns are super easy to ship.
You cannot ship patterns media mail, they do not qualify.
I ship my patterns in poly mailers, no stiffening needed.
I wish you alot of luck.