Negative feedback without contacting seller.
When attempting to leave negative feedback does everyone see the button for "Had an issue? Sellers try their best to help, so give them a chance to make it right."?
I ask because after years of no negative or neutral feedback (2300 sales) I got 3 negatives (one revised, the others don't respond) and 1 neutral in a span of about 30 days all with no contact about the issue prior to feedback.
30 comments
ducrooster
·1 year agoI have had the vary same thing happen.
I could only conclude that one of two things happened, either a competitor had set out to sabotage my sales/business using friends or relations accounts to do so (bit of a long shot & surely they wouldn't?) or that its just human nature... like sheep following each other through the hole in the fence, people feel more comfortable with dishing out the bad feedback when they can see another has recently done so. You may have had a few people already deliberating on leaving a bad one, but instantly felt better to do it when they could see another had already done so.
intimatesinc
·2 years agoJust an observation from selling on and off for decades. It comes in 3’s. As soon as your positive streak is broken by someone the others question and react. It’s awful but that’s what happens.
Unavailable member
·2 years agoJust post on these boards about a buyer that first contacts the seller about an issue. You’ll see a string of replies claiming that the buyer is a scammer looking for a partial refund.
pastcache
OP2 years agoI am assuming you are alluding to a reason why a buyer would neg with no contact. I would like to believe that would be a much rarer accusation during a complaint than represented on these boards. I feel like a complaint without a demand for partial refund can mostly be ruled out as a scam.
robbie31415
·2 years agoYour feedback responses make me know I will never buy from you.
pastcache
OP2 years agoRobbie, you defended the following actual feedback left on ebay.
"More D.E.I. hires That have zero H.R. skills or are just too lazy to do the job."
"I quit eBay because they steel from me and they have too many equity hires. eBay went woke!"
"too many "equity hires" at eBay"
Can you please explain how that is acceptable, but what I said offends you?
robbie31415
·2 years agoAre you quoting things you found on the forums?
Do you consider forum posts as 'actual feedback'?
If any user, including the ones on the forum demonstrated a lack of professionalism by defensive and confrontational behavior in regards to their responses to customers then I'd stay away from them.
If I make a purchase, and I review the sellers feedback. I typically ignore the ranting of the upset customer. (Unless I see key words like 'Arrived from Amazon')
I look mainly at how the seller responded. Was the seller's response professional, non confrontational, remorseful, showing they want to fix the issue? You know, customer service skills.
pastcache
OP2 years agoI consider actual feedback to be just that, in this case left by a seller. Don't you remember when I called it out and you oddly responded in defense to say DEI Hires are a bad thing?
You wouldn't buy off a 5 star, next day shipping, top rated seller with 99.5% feedback and thousands of sales because of a mere 3 feedback replies, which you think aren't showing a desire fix the problem, despite each one complaining about the lack of ability to do so? Can you explain that?
"...zero contact about your issues & don't reply to my message offering a full refund and free return label" "...ZERO contact about the issue & a chance to remedy it.." "...taken care of any creasing issues..." You ignored "Sellers try their best to help, so give them a chance to make it right" "option & instead left neg feedback with zero contact about your issues & didn't reply to my message offering a full refund and free return label..."
robbie31415
·2 years agoFirst time I've seen that.
However, my feelings on DEI programs has nothing to do with feedback.
You showed positive feedback that is very unprofessional and I don't support it. I'm also pretty sure I never have in the past.
I don't care if the person has 100% feedback, I care about how they handle their replies.
Doing a reply similar to what @inhawaii showed would build confidence that if I ended up not being happy with my purchase that the seller is professional, caring, and willing to make things right.
Yours. The first part starts off aggressive and defensive and tbh I don't even know the whole thing because I instantly stopped reading and called you a pass in my mind.
You can take what I'm saying personally, however I'm only giving my honest opinion.
Feedback replies aren't for the person who left it. It's for new potential buyers.
pastcache
OP2 years agoYou had to of seen it as you replied directly to me when I quoted and criticized it last week. Perhaps its another case of opining on something not fully read and or understood. Yes, your feelings on DEI have nothing to do with feedback, hence my unanswered question to you back then asking why you inserted your feelings about DEI being bad when it had zero relevance. I was just pointing out your apparent lack of consistency in judgement. Even if a seller is way more unprofessional you give them a free pass because you share their views on DEI, Wokeness, and Budlight. Really just makes it a bit comical given that you felt the need to tell me you 'know you will never buy anything from me'
If you didnt even bother to read my whole feedback reply why bother opining as if you had? Those quotes of my feedback were almost all the first part, perhaps tone affected comprehension as well ability to finish reading the entire thing? Even so, you have been informed that I did state that I did complain about not being able to fix the problem and that I would offer full free returns. Can you explain how that is not directed at potential buyers? As well as pointing out inaccuracies?
I do understand the negative affects others have more logically and consistently conveyed here and elsewhere and even which you have stated. Your opinion is welcome. I was just curious if you could provide a reasonable explanation for your unusual off topic initial remark. If your train of thought is actually that you would overlook 5 stars in communication, description and shipping on thousands of sales even from someone with even 100% positive feedback; to decide not to purchase something based solely on blind tone policing then I feel like that shows incredibly poor critical thinking skills and a lack of understanding of basic math that would strongly correlate with the type of problematic buyer that no one would miss not having to deal with. I would hope there is a misunderstanding there, but either way I am basically in agreement with you, with no offense taken.
inhawaii
·2 years agoSorry I kinda side with @robbie31415 on this one.
Your actual replies to negative feedback would have been better if you simply said...
"Sorry you are unhappy with your purchase. Please contact me for a return and full refund."
It would make you look a lot better.
pastcache
OP2 years agoThat wasn't a side that I took. Nor do I disagree. I will again admit it's a fair and valid point, my replies could have been better. I was responding to this: "Your feedback responses make me know I will never buy from you."
inhawaii
·2 years agoPerhaps a little harsh but just his honest opinion.
I wouldn't take it personal.
He did hit the nail on the head though...
when responding to negative feedback, it's not for the person who left you the negative feedback,
it's for all your future prospective buyers to read/see.
Good luck to you.
gloryglorygifts
·2 years agoYes, it is there. Sorry they are coming in groups like that now. I know, that's upsetting. People just don't seem to read anything anymore. As a retailer, I'm very aware of what I write for feedback. I know hot it feels to get negs and neuts.
Your buyers look like they weren't aware that you had some resolutions to their issues. Too bad. Packages do get squashed in transit. Not every transaction goes smoothly...
As others have said, all you can do is respond to it professionally and move on. Good luck!
inhawaii
·2 years agoYes it sucks to not be contacted before a buyer leaves you a neutral or negative feedback.
If you're like me you'll bend over backwards to make it right.
It seems like some buyers would rather leave a negative feedback than have their issue resolved.
adamcartwright
·2 years agoYour listing states that the document is in a glass frame, but the photos do not show a frame.
The confusion is understandable given the description.
Seems like buyers are impulsive and don't take the time to ask questions. That's where anticipating questions in your description comes in.
wastingtime101
·2 years agoYes @pastcache , there is a version of that on both app and the website. eBay added it a year or two ago to encourage communications before neg FB is left.
Buyers do not have to send a message though. They can get around the suggestion to contact the seller and go straight to the neg if they want.
fern*wood
·2 years agoI can see why the document buyer might have been confused by the way it arrived, since the description stated it was in a glass frame along with the frame dimensions. It didn't say the frame wasn't included, although it isn't pictured, but I bet they thought it would arrive flat inside a protective frame. It's strange the condition field is left blank. Even if they don't read descriptions, that is a prominent part of listings near the title without needing to click to find it.
I don't know about the pop up warning, but many probably ignore that based on past experiences with some sellers.
dhbookds
·2 years agoEach person that buys something has their own ideas about stuff.......and each may react differently.....you may have gotten more picky people in a group simply as a coincidence in time.......or an evening out of averages....
One thing I would suggest......relative to the beaters. You never mention rust/wear tho certainly your pictures show it... There is a "item condition" space in the listing form and that is to describe the condition (plus/minus) of the item. I suggest you do use it, to forestall "they were dirty and rusted" type of feedback.
fashunu4eeuh
·2 years agoThough common sense would suggest otherwise, buyers are under no obligation to contact a seller before leaving poor feedback.
Therefore, admonishing a customer for this in a follow-up response would not be appropriate. The buyer has done nothing wrong, per se, in choosing to forgo seller contact.
It is bad for business to denigrate one’s customers in a public shaming. This would include blaming, angry, defensive, and/or name-calling behavior, which only makes the seller look bad in the long run. It can broadcast a lack of professionalism and courtesy.
It is also not necessary, or desirable, to leave warnings for other sellers in feedback follow-up comments. The primary and arguably most important audience one aims to reach is the future buyer, not fellow sellers. It is buyer opinion that will matter.
pastcache
OP2 years agoAll fair and valid opinions in yours and other replies but I have yet to get an answer relevant to the question. Thousands of sales and no issues then all of a sudden 4 bad feedback a really short period. Its either a coincidence or something changed hence the question. So I asked if everyone sees what I see when I go and test it.
rosszonebricks
·2 years agoOk, to specifically answer your questions directly:
Yes. Buyers get to see a version of that text. There are several, depending on device. Some may see the button (but right next to it is 'Leave Feedback Anyway', so no forced deflection). Some may just see the text when they choose to leave feedback. But again, no forced deflection.
An unstated question, but I'll address it specifically: "Is this a bug?" No, I do not believe it is. 2 negs and a neutral out of 500 in the last year just feels unlucky.
pastcache
OP2 years agoMore like "3" negs and neutral out of 80 9 "30 days", and again all with no prior contact/no response to messages. Thanks for answering the question. Didn't think it was a bug was thinking they may have been phasing out the suggestion.
chevymontecarlo88
·2 years agoMoney is tight these days. Buyers are being more selective. I think if you adjusted (Prior to sale) your descriptions/shipping methods and conditions, you would not of had at least two of the neg. feedback. (beaters and document). I don't necessarily agree with their feedback but the lack of descriptions/condition has always been an issue on Ebay. It does not surprise me that it happened.
My opinion, nothing changed.
-Good luck
georgiagenes
·2 years agoSorry you are not getting a direct answer. 25 years on eBay and our last negative maybe 3 years ago was removed. 2 recent neutrals they won't remove. But my issue is the next negative we get and the absence of FAIR and EVEN treatment as they have handed off the feedback removal to the TOOL which never works. Agents, if you can get one, no longer have the power of removal. These undeserved bad feedbacks will result in less transactions, less $ for sellers, less for eBay shareholders. When sellers cannot leave negatives for buyers (since 2008) the EVEN treatment idea is incorrect. It is typically easy to spot a bad buyer, just look at their feedback given. In fact we do that every time someone wants a better deal and definitely any time we have an issue with a buyer. Should a buyer who has been on eBay 6 months that has given all bad feedback in the last month and 50% bad feedback have the same ability to ruin an established top rated seller's reputation as say a 10 yr account who leaves 2% bad feedbacks? Sellers are ranked by eBay up and down based on many parameters. Shouldn't buyers be ranked too and treated accordingly. Our last neutral buyer has at least 2 negatives given that violate eBay rules. Really their entire feedback given page should be deleted or hidden. That would be FAIR.
Here is my recent post on Newbie Bad Buyers:
https://community.ebay.com/t5/Ask-a-Mentor/Newbie-Bad-Buyers/m-p/34421419#M664196
georgiagenes
·2 years agoThe buyer did not violate eBay rules but they are violating eBay buyer guidance by not messaging first. And it is our store's policy as stated in all of our listings and the thank you sticker on the package to message us FIRST before starting a return or leaving feedback (not that our policy matters). Look at our comments for the 2 recent neutrals we got after 2+ years thousands of items with not one non-positive. The result was record sales this weekend so I guess our buyers like what I had to say which would be shaming them for lack of communication. We simply do not need newbie bad buyers on eBay coming in with the ability to wreck havoc on a 25 year top rated seller like us. We are just a small family side business who has to compete with customer service and better feedback than the big sellers. We can't do the customer service if they don't follow guidance and instruction to message us with any issues. Also you say "not desirable to leave warnings for other sellers", well I did that and also messaged all other sellers who received undeserved negative feedback for when I hopefully talk to corporate. They were VERY frustrated with this buyer. By the way, this buyer messaged us with "you should get a real job" when he first received our like new shirt. No return. No indication anything was wrong. Then left thankfully just a neutral 2 weeks later. Sent a nice message and they did not respond. Sent a feedback revision request they did not respond. Come to find the address is actually a nursing home and does not match the name & town the account is registered to. Could be an account made by a worker there using a patient's credit card! Potentially a fraud accounts, getting free stuff, and damaging GREAT sellers. How exactly do you propose to combat this issue? With the so called feedback removal tool (which has not worked for anyone that I know of), it needs to be better trained to favor established sellers over newbie ebayers. It should kick out reviews given by buyers with lower ratings (newer account, greater % non-positive feedbacks) to a human review panel who can look at more than just X, Y, and Z.
chevymontecarlo88
·2 years agoThere will be times you will not be able to make some buyers happy. That being said, how you reply to that feedback will be viewable to everyone especially new potential customers. (as stated above) @rosszonebricks
Looking at your pictures of the vintage egg beaters, the pictures clearly show (if viewed on my computer) the condition (rust, discoloration), i would advise adding those details in the description. Some customers may use their phone which might make it difficult to view the actual condition. Also state how they work and what limitations they may have. Some (buyers) purchase these for decorations while some think they will work just as good as ones from the dollar stores. Sometimes they don't. Not everything vintage was built better or performs better than modern day utensils.
As far as the vintage document, i would also suggest documenting how you will be shipping the item. (rolled up, possible tape applied to it ect.) This item is not replaceable so if they really wanted it, giving them a refund most likely would still be a disappointment to them.
I am not saying you are wrong about anything (maybe your feedback reply should be more positive) but making sure your listing is fully documented in the description may help prevent sour grapes. (negative feedback) Sometimes you may want to reach out to them once they purchased the item to explain how you will be shipping or to emphasize the condition/functionality of the sold item.
heckofagame
·2 years agoI agree with @rosszonebricks , what you say in a reply can have more of an impact on future sales than the negative itself. It's best to keep it professional.
rosszonebricks
·2 years agoNegative feedback can really be upsetting.
Buyers are not required to attempt to work things out with a seller prior to leaving negative feedback. If you are a Top Rated, it does at least force them to wait 7 days past the estimated delivery date, so does give them extra time to cool off, or reach out to the seller.
However, words of advice: When replying to negative feedback, you are actually responding to FUTURE customers. I've definitely seen far far worse examples of nasty replies to a buyer than yours, but if you read it with neutral eyes, it still sounds pretty berating to the buyer. Future buyers may think: "Wow, if THIS is how they act when issues arise... maybe I'll shop elsewhere."
georgiagenes
·2 years agoWe had 0 non-positives for 2 years as well. Last negative maybe 3 years ago was removed. As for responding to FUTURE customers, you should check out my response to our recent neutrals. Been messaging multiple sellers since yesterday about our most recent neutral, a 6 month old account damaging multiple sellers with bad feedback. The result has been a huge selling weekend for us. I guess the buyers like what I had to say about the neutrals! It may only be eBay guidance to contact the seller 1st before starting a return or leaving feedback, but it is our store's policy stated in all of our listings (not that it matters). If buyers would do this, a tremendous savings in time and frustration would occur and eBay really should require buyers to message first. Maybe give the buyer 1 day to respond and if they don't make other options available. But I don't mind a return that is for didn't fit without a message first. It should be harder for a new eBayer to do damage to established 25 year sellers like us.
I don't know that the feedback removal tool has worked for anyone. Just declines. See my recent Newbie Bad Buyers post. Buyers need to have a rating based on age of their account and their positive feedback percentage. Fraud accounts are almost always new accounts as well. It should be harder for them to post feedback from the beginning, or get non-positive feedback to stick. I am not as worried about the 2 undeserved neutral ratings we got so much as the next negative we get. And the newbie 6 month old buyer who has left 50% non-positives and ruined multiple established sellers' feedbacks. eBay has cut back the hours and customer service staff. I used to tell the chat assistant to CALL ME and get an option. They would call in 1-2 minutes. It was great. Last one was 24 minutes. Undeserved non-positive feedback results in less transactions... less $ for sellers, less for eBay shareholders because potential buyers go to our feedback page and they don't click on the 3,000 positives this month, just the 1 negative. This was the case with my newbie bad buyer who left that one negative for a non-profit big seller! His 'opinion' is vastly outweighed. That table should not even be there. Buyers should have to page down through all those positives to find the one negative. THAT would be "fair treatment" as eBay purports. And by the way, since sellers cannot leave negative feedback for buyers (as we use to be able to), it is not EVEN treatment either. One good step would be if we could leave a follow up comment to our original feedback. We just do automatic positive feedback when they pay, because why bother? I am working to speak with someone at corporate again about these issues. I was a management consultant, MBA information systems, and industrial engineer in my early days. But all it takes is common sense.
https://community.ebay.com/t5/Ask-a-Mentor/Newbie-Bad-Buyers/m-p/34421419#M664196