Item return to seller, what should I do
First post. I am the buyer. Purchased a $200 item 2+ weeks ago and seller did not ship until 5 days later.
By the time item reaching my house, it has been 10 days later when we already left for vacation.
In anticipation of rains, I left a note for USPS to deliver it to my neighbor before left. But USPS somehow marked it undeliverable and shipped it back to seller.
Now seller does not respond and I am afraid an item not received case is not going to be in my favor. Should I continue to contact the seller to get refund or just open PayPal/cc dispute?
I am also a regular seller so I understand it is not really seller's fault. But I am sick that seller wants to keep both money and item ... actually I don't mind a refund minus shipping.
Thanks for all your help!
imac7065
·3 years agoWriting this as someone who's been on both sides...
1) by ebay ToS you will lose any case because it was marked "refused"
2) You should contact the seller and offer to pay to re ship the item
3) You should file a complaint with the shipping company for marking it "refused"
4) If seller is refusing to respond to communication, open a case and contact ebay that they are not responding... You will not win the case but you will get their attention finally.
inhawaii
·3 years agoMy opinion and what I would do.
I feel like the buyer and the seller should take equal responsibility.
The seller for shipping so late.
The buyer for not making arrangements for alternate mail delivery.
Assuming the seller has the item back.
I would give the seller some time to respond.
I would ask the seller to refund me less shipping.
If no response after a week, I would do a chargeback.
slippinjimmy
·3 years agoThe OP did contact the seller, as stated they waited 7 days and got zero response so a claim via PayPal or bank IS the appropriate action.
If the seller had been responsive and suggested they would refund less shipping the OP would likely have been agreeable. the seller instead went with the "shadow ban" instead, keeping the returned item AND the money.
Yet another buyer potentially lost to all eBay sellers and they spread the word while good sellers wonder why sales are slow (definitely not saying it's the main reason but the chasing away of buyers has been going on around here since day 1 and we are all paying the price).
a1platinum
·3 years agoIt's too bad you didn't know that USPS can't deliver to other than the addressee. Simple note to carrier in MB to hold mail for so many days works fine.
mam98031
·3 years agoNot a note in the mailbox. That is a pretty iffy way to do it. Contact your local post office and tell them or go to the USPS website and file the notice.
phoceanpeng
OP3 years agoI am OP. Thank you all for the discussion. Here to provide some updates.
I admit that it is my ignorance not holding the delivery. Previously I only did it for long away time like 2/3 weeks.
As for the item,
1. Seller got the returned package 7 days ago.
2. Seller did not respond to work things out
3. I have the feeling that Seller wants to play the odd to keep both item and money.
4. I sent Seller one last msg today asking for refund minus shipping by EOD tomorrow. Otherwise I will file chargeback with PayPal.
Note: my bad feeling with the seller is based on my limited interactions with Seller. Seller has 96% positive feedback rate and some buyers reported items not delivered. I urged the seller to ship the item earlier at day3 after purchase. And seller simply created a label at day3 and did not ship the item until day 6. Seller did not respond to the refund request after getting back the item.
mam98031
·3 years agoYour only hope of seeing your money is filing the Chargeback at this point. Ebay won't help you because the initial issue was created by you. I'm not pointing fingers or anything, it is simply how what transpired will be seen.
Far too often when a buyer files a chargeback, they are still in possession of the item. And they will likely win the chargeback for whatever reason they filed with their CCC. Most CCCs will allow the buyer to keep the item and force the seller to fully refund the buyer as well. So you have somewhat of a reversal of this situation. I'm not defending it at all.
I've had buyer's items returned to me as undeliverable for various reasons. I always refund my buyer for the product but not the shipping or non recoverable fees. I just think I should be allowed to break even on the transaction since I didn't do anything wrong.
But again, you do need to file the Chargeback as it is really your only hope to get refunded.
nh7235
·3 years agoFile a dispute with PayPal here. Unlike eBay, Item Not Received is just that -- you did not get your item, even if it was refused or it returned to the seller undelivered: PayPal does not play stupid games like eBay.
Upload a screenshot of your message to the seller as the proof PayPal asks to show you've already requested a refund. Then go silent @phoceanpeng and do not talk to the seller any more. And just wait up to 5 calendar days for your automatic refund.
phoceanpeng
OP3 years agoHere to provide some update. I filled a PayPal dispute and PayPal sided the seller initially -- appearantly the seller uploaded an eBay tracking screenshot citing item delivered.
Subsequently I submitted an appeal and won the case back because USPS tracking shows item returned to sender.
Thank you all for your help!
mam98031
·3 years agoFYI In Ebay if tracking shows Returned to Sender, it equals delivered and the seller is covered by Seller Protection. So while PP may have ruled for you, the seller should be fine as they should be covered by Seller Protection.
rseuqinh
·3 years agoWrong. The seller would be fine -- Return to sender equals Delivered -- if it's an eBay case.
But there's no eBay case -- it's a payment dispute filed either at PayPal, or a chargeback.
dbfolks166mt
·3 years agoSince the seller is not responding I would simply open a chargeback with your CC company. Make sure you let the CC company know the complete story and that the seller has received the item back but has not refunded your payment.
mam98031
·3 years agoI disagree with this. The OP hasn't said that the seller actually has the item back. And no sellers should ever refund until they actually has the item back. IMHO they should wait until the seller has the item back. Give them about 24 hours to process or reach out to them. And if they don't, send them an email and ask about a partial refund because the OP doesn't expect [no should they] a refund on the shipping.
dbfolks166mt
·3 years agoI disagree with this. The OP hasn't said that the seller actually has the item back. And no sellers should ever refund until they actually has the item back. IMHO they should wait until the seller has the item back. Give them about 24 hours to process or reach out to them. And if they don't, send them an email and ask about a partial refund because the OP doesn't expect [no should they] a refund on the shipping.
According to the OP the seller has the item back although they did not indicate when or how long the seller has had the item back. According to the OP the seller has not responded and in reality the seller does not have to as according to eBay's policy refusal or return to sender is seen as delivery by eBay and the seller is not obligated to refund anything although it would be the proper thing to do.
showmecurrency4u
·3 years agoi thought this forun was a sellers forum, not a buyers forum. a post to help a buyers take money should not be allowed because of an error buy the buyer.
mam98031
·3 years ago@phoceanpeng
Sellers are allowed to have a stated handling time. You should always look at the listing on the shipping info page to see what kind of handling time they have. Sellers are not required to ship immediately, just within their stated handling time.
When you are going to be away from home, you either need to make arrangements directly with your neighbor to pick up your mail, or you notify your local post office to hold your mail. You can do that at your local PO and I think you can do it on their Website too.
You are correct that you would not win an INR [item not received] case. Because you did receive the item. The seller did what they were suppose to do.
You are assuming the seller is doing that. Does the tracking show that the seller has received the item back?
A refund minus shipping and fees is all you should get back. You are correct, your seller is not at fault here and should not be made to suffer financially because of it.
Watch the tracking. When it shows the seller actually has the item back, give them 24 hours or so, if you don't hear from them, then reach out to them. Keeping in mind that they did nothing wrong. You want them to work with you, so keep that in mind.
slippinjimmy
·3 years agoWhat does the tracking show? It takes time for a package to be returned, has the seller actually received the returned package?
If the delivery attempt was only a few days ago it's unlikely your seller has received it. Them may just be waiting for it to come back.
phoceanpeng
OP3 years agoTracking shows
Out delivery -- refusal -- return to sender -- delivered (to sender)
Caught the carrier today and was told that he got the redirection note and tried my neighbors' home but no one was home. Then he just marked the item as refusal because of the note.
I think I will give the seller a few more days before opening paypal case.
Thanks all for your advices!
soh.maryl
·3 years agoSo it never occurred to that postal carrier that maybe he could try to deliver the package the next day or another day? Or he could leave a note at the neighbor's house about the package? Is he not allowed to do that?
rfmtm
·3 years agoI agree, and at the vary least the carrier should not have marked it "refused". Most carriers in my experience would have left a note to call the post office to arrange re-delivery. Then the post office would have held it for a few days before returning it to the seller.
However, there also is no reason the buyer could not have put a hold or forwarding order in when they knew this was going to be a problem. Regardless the seller isn't to blame, but certainly should do the right thing and either offer to reship at buyer's expense or refund the item cost.
mam98031
·3 years agoCarriers don't have to play detective to figure out how or when to deliver a package. It just isn't part of their job. Imagine if they had a few houses on their route that needed this done. How would that carrier ever get their route done without working extra hours.
The OP didn't tell us if there were previous notes left for them that there was a package that needed to be delivered. That is the typical thing for a carrier to do. After several days, if the PO isn't contacted, then yes they return to sender.
soh.maryl
·3 years agoThank you for your information about postal carriers. But how is it playing detective for a carrier to say to himself,"Oh, they left a note that it should be delivered to the neighbor, but it appears the neighbor is not home. Since it's raining, will just take it back to the PO and try again tomorrow because it should not sit out in the rain."
mam98031
·3 years agoNo need to be sharky. This isn't the carrier's fault. The buyer could have and should have notified the post office of their need for alternate delivery options.
As you know I've been at this a very long time. I have never had USPS upon the first attempt to deliver and couldn't, then return the package to the sender. They always leave a notification in my mailbox that I have a package ready for pick up or redelivery, I just need to let them know.
Rain or no rain, the buyer's responsibility is to provide a sage location for delivery.
It is possible that the OP hasn't shared that portion of the story.
ed8108
·3 years agoSince you already contacted the seller & have received no reply contact PayPal to see if you may be covered for a refund minus the shipping
Do not have more then one dispute open at the same time.
ms.rodriguez*
·3 years agoEmail the seller one more time and ask him to please refund the cost of the item MINUS the shipping that you paid and the ebay fees. Tell him that he has 24 hours to do this or you will have no choice but to do a chargeback. Apologize for YOUR mistake in not putting the mail on hold. The seller does not deserve to keep the money and the item but he certainly does not deserve to lose the shipping paid and the ebay fees because of your failure to stop the mail.
This is very simple and I do not understand why folks go on vacation and not notify the post office. In the future, don't buy anything online if you are going on vacation and do not want to stop the mail. Even if the seller shipped the next day, there was no guarantee that the item would have arrived before you left for the vacation. Sometimes, packages take the scenic route.
stainlessenginecovers
·3 years agoThat would be the fault of USPS and not the seller. If item was marked as 'undeliverable' and goes back to the seller, then seller keeps money and item. They 'shouldn't' but they can. Opening a 'case' with your CC would also wind up the same as that tracking number shows 'delivered' or 'couldn't'.
soh.maryl
·3 years agoWhy would it be the fault of the USPS?
stainlessenginecovers
·3 years agoBecause of this:
In anticipation of rains, I left a note for USPS to deliver it to my neighbor before left. But USPS somehow marked it undeliverable and shipped it back to seller.
Unavailable member
·3 years agoYour local USPS should have been contacted about holding your mail and packages until your return. This can be done in person or online. This service is free of charge.
You’ll probably have to file a chargeback since your item was returned as undeliverable you lost MBG protection on that transaction.
Sorry this happened.
soh.maryl
·3 years agoNot sure why you wouldn't have just asked the post office to put a vacation hold on all your mail.
phoceanpeng
OP3 years agoThank you. Lesson learned. To be honest, did not do it just because the trip was short for less than 1 week -- I had packages left for days never got a problem.
This time I was a little nervous and left the redirection note only because the forecast of heavy rain for multiple days while I was away.