Final value fee of what the item did not sell for

Dirty rotten eBay is up to theft, money stealing tactics again. It was necessary to cancel an auction and eBay decided to take a final value fee of what the item did not sell for ! Without authorization!

This is not the first time EBay tries to screw the sellers. There's has to be a way to get a refund as like I said this is an unauthorized debt from my account!

pere-loui

434 View listings

Posted 2 years ago·Last reply 2 years ago

41 comments

kabilab

·2 years ago

2017 View listings

Pere,

There is nothing wrong about disagreeing with anyone, but to address them with "dirty rotten eBay is up to theft............." would probably be counter to a positive resolution of your situation.

simba6

·2 years ago

2323 View listings

First off that selling fee is for finding you a sales lead. They did that and had you set up with a buyer. If that buyer had failed to pay you would have not been charged.

Since the start of eBay there have been sellers that refused to go through with the sale. It drives off buyers and eBay has tried lesser measures to stop it. You lucky they only charged you. Too much of that can get you banned from selling for life. Ant they don't say how much it too much. Beware.

farmalljr

·2 years ago

1880 View listings

@pere-loui wrote:
Dirty rotten eBay is up to theft, money stealing tactics again. It was necessary to cancel an auction and eBay decided to take a final value fee of what the item did not sell for ! Without authorization!
This is not the first time EBay tries to screw the sellers. There's has to be a way to get a refund as like I said this is an unauthorized debt from my account!

This is what happens when sellers do NOT KNOW what they are doing. It was "authorized". You DID agree too it.

Your actions (ending the auction) DID cause yourself to get charged. You can blame eBay all you want, you are the one that ended the auction when you had bids. Suck it up buttercup.

lakefor94

·2 years ago

122 View listings

"Without Authorization", What is eBay going to do, call the seller and request permission to bill the seller account accordingly?

mam98031

·2 years ago

Owner / Operator19752 View listings

@lakefor94 wrote:
"Without Authorization", What is eBay going to do, call the seller and request permission to bill the seller account accordingly?

They don't have to. All members agreed to the User Agreement when they created their account.

mam98031

·2 years ago

Owner / Operator19752 View listings

This is most likely due to a misunderstanding on your part regarding some rule or policy. And I know when we aren't aware of something it often feels like someone is out to get us.

Ebay has had a rule about cancelling auctions when their are bids on the auction for at least several years now. You are correct Ebay would take the FVF for the price the high bidder bid on the listing, and that is PER THE POLICY. It isn't hidden from any of us, but sometimes since there are so darn many rules we have a tough time on keeping up with all of them.

You can only end auction listings with bids one at a time by selecting a valid reason. Ending listings early disappoints bidders, so we may place limits and restrictions on your account if you are doing so regularly.

https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/listings/creating-managing-listings/ending-listing?id=4146#:~:text=You%20can%20only%20end%20auction,you%20are%20doing%20so%20regularly.

Now if this is the first time you have done this or the first time in a very long time, if you contact Ebay, you may be able to get them to refund the FVFs they charged you. Remember you want them to do you a FAVOR, so don't get upset with them. Be nice and polite. Make them WANT to help you. Otherwise if you treat them disrespectfully, chances are they may not help you at all.

On each Ebay page there is a link to contact Customer Service at the top of the page and again at the bottom of the page.

I would suggest that you contact Ebay for Business on Facebook, Instagram or Twitter for the better trained CSRs.

Here are your options for contacting Ebay Customer Service. Please be aware that for social media CS, you send them a Private Message and briefly explain what your problem or issue is. Feel free to leave your Name, address, phone number and/or your email address in this message. It is private and secure and it may help to speed up the response for you.

https://twitter.com/askebay

https://www.facebook.com/eBay/

https://www.instagram.com/ebayforsellers/

Your options will be on the left. If you use the link below you can only get to the Automated Assistant or Chat box type AGENT in the box and hit enter. You will then get more options. Not all options are available 24/7. It will depend on staffing available. So sometimes you can request a call back and sometimes you can't. Sometimes you have the Chat option available and other times it won't me. If it is important to you to use one of those options, just try back later.

If you use a cell phone or other mobile device, you may need to turn off your Spam filter so that Ebay can call you.

If you are a seller outside of the US or Canada, you will need to use the Chat Option.

https://www.ebay.com/help/eua?id=5275&mkevt=1&mkpid

https://www.ebay.com/help/home

albertabrightalberta

·2 years ago

I can explain it to you but I can't understand it for you.104 View listings

@pere-loui wrote:
Dirty rotten eBay is up to theft, money stealing tactics again. It was necessary to cancel an auction and eBay decided to take a final value fee of what the item did not sell for ! Without authorization!
This is not the first time EBay tries to screw the sellers. There's has to be a way to get a refund as like I said this is an unauthorized debt from my account!

It sounds like you had an auction that had at least one bid. When you ended it early, ebay charged FVF on the high bid amount.

kensgiftshop

·2 years ago

389 View listings

Did you receive any messages about the item before you ended it.

It wasn't without authorization, you agreed to it when you listed the item

monica-sells

·2 years ago

94 View listings

Which item was cancelled. It looks like you did not have bids on some....did you cancel with a bid open?

wastingtime101

·2 years ago

0 View listings

@pere-loui wrote:
It was necessary to cancel an auction and eBay decided to take a final value fee of what the item did not sell for ! Without authorization!

You gave authorization through the user agreement when you listed the item.

Here's the policy page on ending listings:

https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/listings/creating-managing-listings/ending-listing?id=4146

Listing format	Time left in listing	Listing state	Can the listing be ended early?
Auction	12 or more hours	No Bids	Yes
Auction	12 or more hours	1 or more bids with reserve price not met	Yes. You may be charged a final value fee based on the amount of the highest bid.
Auction	12 or more hours	1 or more bids with reserve price met or no reserve price set	Yes, you may end the listing by cancelling all bids. You may be charged a final value fee based on the amount of the highest bid, or you may sell the item to the highest bidder.
Auction	Fewer than 12 hours	No bids	Yes
Auction	Fewer than 12 hours	1 or more bids with reserve price not met	Yes. You may be charged a final value fee based on the amount of the highest bid
Auction	Fewer than 12 hours	1 or more bids with reserve price met or no reserve price set	No, you can only sell the item to the highest bidder

If your listing isn't eligible to be ended early, you can contact any bidders to explain the situation and ask them to retract their bids. If the auction has finished, you can contact the winner and, if they agree, you can cancel the transaction.

You can only end auction listings with bids one at a time by selecting a valid reason.

Ending listings early disappoints bidders, so we may place limits and restrictions on your account if you are doing so regularly.

lilyswan2

·2 years ago

4448 View listings

used to be you can end early with bids once a year and not be charged final value fees. has this changed?

wastingtime101

·2 years ago

0 View listings

@lilyswan2 wrote:
used to be you can end early with bids once a year and not be charged final value fees. has this changed?

Unfortunately it changed a couple years ago per reports on this forum. eBay no longer automatically applies that once per year freebie.

If the seller contacts CS they might give them a courtesy credit. Those are often one-offs so if we're talking only a few bucks I'd let it go and save the credit for when it's really needed. But if it's a hundred bucks or something then yeah, contact CS to see if they can help.

steve_stuff

·2 years ago

4558 View listings

"If the auction has finished, you can contact the winner and, if they agree, you can cancel the transaction."

Not really - two/three years ago we were getting ghost listings every week or two - was able to cancel active listing with or without bids, but with the fixed price and last second bid/win ones we contacted the buyer, explained what happen and even sent them a photo of the original 'your item sold' message [we keep them all] showing that it sold weeks/months/years earlier and was long gone. Everyone agreed to us cancelling -

Six months ago got a message from ebay basically saying that the bots had noticed we were asking people to agree to cancel - even send the rule[s] and a list of which items with the amount [$20/25] of fees 'avoided' - and say 'no action will be taken at this time' but don't do that again.

Luckily we haven't had another ghost till a few days ago but it was a scheduled listing so was able to get rid of it before it went live.

mam98031

·2 years ago

Owner / Operator19752 View listings

@steve_stuff wrote:
"If the auction has finished, you can contact the winner and, if they agree, you can cancel the transaction."

Not really - two/three years ago we were getting ghost listings every week or two - was able to cancel active listing with or without bids, but with the fixed price and last second bid/win ones we contacted the buyer, explained what happen and even sent them a photo of the original 'your item sold' message [we keep them all] showing that it sold weeks/months/years earlier and was long gone. Everyone agreed to us cancelling -

Six months ago got a message from ebay basically saying that the bots had noticed we were asking people to agree to cancel - even send the rule[s] and a list of which items with the amount [$20/25] of fees 'avoided' - and say 'no action will be taken at this time' but don't do that again.

Luckily we haven't had another ghost till a few days ago but it was a scheduled listing so was able to get rid of it before it went live.

Thank you for sharing that @steve_stuff . Ebay has said they are cracking down on sellers that misuse the Cancellation system. Your example is a good one.

mam98031

·2 years ago

Owner / Operator19752 View listings

" If the auction has finished, you can contact the winner and, if they agree, you can cancel the transaction." For it to be a correctly filed cancellation with the reason the buyer requested it, the buyer has to reach out to the seller and ask for the cancellation, not the other way around. Unless something has changed, that is how it has been explained to me before. But as we all know, things change often around here, so it is hard to keep up on everything.

wastingtime101

·2 years ago

0 View listings

@mam98031 wrote:
" If the auction has finished, you can contact the winner and, if they agree, you can cancel the transaction." For it to be a correctly filed cancellation with the reason the buyer requested it, the buyer has to reach out to the seller and ask for the cancellation, not the other way around. Unless something has changed, that is how it has been explained to me before. But as we all know, things change often around here, so it is hard to keep up on everything.

That quoted line was copy/pasted from the linked policy page. I copy/pasted the entire section without dissecting every sentence. You're correct that buyer has to initiate the request to cite buyer requested. If seller asks the buyer and buyer agree to the cancellation, then it's supposed to be put through as an out of stock cancellation. eBay may forgive an occasional misuse of buyer requested, but if it's a habit the seller will be caught as @steve_stuff demonstrated with their post.

We've all seen eBay policy pages that are in need of update. It appears this is one of them.

Hi @kyle@ebay . Can you have this policy page reviewed for correction?

https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/listings/creating-managing-listings/ending-listing?id=4146

Specifically, this misleading text:

If the auction has finished, you can contact the winner and, if they agree, you can cancel the transaction.

kyle@ebay

Admin2 years ago

Community Advisor0 View listings

@wastingtime101 wrote:

@mam98031 wrote:

" If the auction has finished, you can contact the winner and, if they agree, you can cancel the transaction." For it to be a correctly filed cancellation with the reason the buyer requested it, the buyer has to reach out to the seller and ask for the cancellation, not the other way around. Unless something has changed, that is how it has been explained to me before. But as we all know, things change often around here, so it is hard to keep up on everything.

That quoted line was copy/pasted from the linked policy page. I copy/pasted the entire section without dissecting every sentence. You're correct that buyer has to initiate the request to cite buyer requested. If seller asks the buyer and buyer agree to the cancellation, then it's supposed to be put through as an out of stock cancellation. eBay may forgive an occasional misuse of buyer requested, but if it's a habit the seller will be caught as @steve_stuff demonstrated with their post.

We've all seen eBay policy pages that are in need of update. It appears this is one of them.

Hi @kyle@ebay . Can you have this policy page reviewed for correction?

https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/listings/creating-managing-listings/ending-listing?id=4146

Specifically, this misleading text:

If the auction has finished, you can contact the winner and, if they agree, you can cancel the transaction.

Hey @wastingtime101 thanks for bringing this up! I will go ahead and pass this over to the appropriate team for review.

mam98031

·2 years ago

Owner / Operator19752 View listings

@kyle@ebay

Thank you. We see some sellers abusing this thinking it is OK to do when it should not be OK to do this. The buyer doesn't have a reason to ask for the cancellation, it is the seller that has a reason for needing it, so they contact the buyer and ask them with whatever reason they have come up with. Many times it is a seller trying to get around honoring the sale but without getting a defect for themselves.

And why is this currently in the policy as being specifically for auctions?

kyle@ebay

Admin2 years ago

Community Advisor0 View listings

@mam98031 wrote:

@kyle@ebay

Thank you. We see some sellers abusing this thinking it is OK to do when it should not be OK to do this. The buyer doesn't have a reason to ask for the cancellation, it is the seller that has a reason for needing it, so they contact the buyer and ask them with whatever reason they have come up with. Many times it is a seller trying to get around honoring the sale but without getting a defect for themselves.

And why is this currently in the policy as being specifically for auctions?

Hey @mam98031 I think you hit the nail on the head with what I highlighted in red!

With respect to your question, I would say that these situations are generally (though not exclusively) with auction-style listings, so I think that's probably why the help page is phrased that way.

inhawaii

·2 years ago

Ebay's most handsome seller.4976 View listings

I have some bad news for you ... you did authorize it.

Perhaps you should read up on cancelling auctions early.

No rip off here.

isaiah53-57

·2 years ago

961 View listings

@inhawaii wrote:
I have some bad news for you ... you did authorize it.
Perhaps you should read up on cancelling auctions early.
No rip off here.

Nope no rip off, no way, no how - If its written somewhere in the tos, its no harm no foul - its just the site taking deserved funds to stay in business right? - Brings to mind a current thread where a poor soul had 2 bidders in a bidding war of an item he had a $40(approximately) "Buy It Now" on - These crazy bidders take the price up over 13,000 and the worried seller kills the auction - He gets a bill from ebay to the tune of $1500 or something like that - Yeah its just the site doing what they do - no harm no foul right Hawaii?

Considering, in my opinion, the EXTREME lack of protection this site offers its sellers and the very few tools you have to protect yourself from bad buyers, don't you just love it when the site cashes in on one of those few tools left? To the tune where anyone who hasn't slogged through the TOS trying to protect themselves gets caught in the trap... Yeah they got your back alright - though, from our experience, seems they don't have a problem sticking the knife in it - Happy ebaying everyone...

broto_64

·2 years ago

0 View listings

@isaiah53-57 wrote:
@inhawaii wrote:
I have some bad news for you ... you did authorize it.
Perhaps you should read up on cancelling auctions early.
No rip off here.

Nope no rip off, no way, no how - If its written somewhere in the tos, its no harm no foul - its just the site taking deserved funds to stay in business right? - Brings to mind a current thread where a poor soul had 2 bidders in a bidding war of an item he had a $40(approximately) "Buy It Now" on - These crazy bidders take the price up over 13,000 and the worried seller kills the auction - He gets a bill from ebay to the tune of $1500 or something like that - Yeah its just the site doing what they do - no harm no foul right Hawaii?

While I do agree that $13,000 is enough to concern a seller it still doesn't warrant ending the auction. What that seller should have done is allow the auction to complete, then await payment and either ship the item once payment is received or... When payment isn't received (because this is the most likely scenario) 4 calendar days after the listing ended, the seller can cancel the order by selecting the Cancel order button and choosing Buyer hasn't paid in the drop down menu. At this stage unless the buyer pays shortly ebay cancels it in the seller's favor without fees of any kind... Granted it involves waiting and being patient so if a seller can't wait there is always the option of cancelling instantly and paying the fees.

As was already stated you really do need to read up on policies, things on ebay work in a particular and sometimes a very peculiar fashion but they do work and if you work them correctly you will not come out the loser.

mam98031

·2 years ago

Owner / Operator19752 View listings

I've been in that situation before, not quite as high as 13k, but way over what the value of the item was. I too cancelled the auction.

It is a lot of money and to be in limbo for up to six months [because of chargebacks] is a lot to ask of a seller.

isaiah53-57

·2 years ago

961 View listings

@broto_64 wrote:
@isaiah53-57 wrote:
@inhawaii wrote:
I have some bad news for you ... you did authorize it.
Perhaps you should read up on cancelling auctions early.
No rip off here.

Nope no rip off, no way, no how - If its written somewhere in the tos, its no harm no foul - its just the site taking deserved funds to stay in business right? - Brings to mind a current thread where a poor soul had 2 bidders in a bidding war of an item he had a $40(approximately) "Buy It Now" on - These crazy bidders take the price up over 13,000 and the worried seller kills the auction - He gets a bill from ebay to the tune of $1500 or something like that - Yeah its just the site doing what they do - no harm no foul right Hawaii?

Considering, in my opinion, the EXTREME lack of protection this site offers its sellers and the very few tools you have to protect yourself from bad buyers, don't you just love it when the site cashes in on one of those few tools left? To the tune where anyone who hasn't slogged through the TOS trying to protect themselves gets caught in the trap... Yeah they got your back alright - though, from our experience, seems they don't have a problem sticking the knife in it - Happy ebaying everyone...

While I do agree that $13,000 is enough to concern a seller it still doesn't warrant ending the auction. What that seller should have done is allow the auction to complete, then await payment and either ship the item once payment is received or... When payment isn't received (because this is the most likely scenario) 4 calendar days after the listing ended, the seller can cancel the order by selecting the Cancel order button and choosing Buyer hasn't paid in the drop down menu. At this stage unless the buyer pays shortly ebay cancels it in the seller's favor without fees of any kind... Granted it involves waiting and being patient so if a seller can't wait there is always the option of cancelling instantly and paying the fees.

As was already stated you really do need to read up on policies, things on ebay work in a particular and sometimes a very peculiar fashion but they do work and if you work them correctly you will not come out the loser.

Problem is, in the real world, no one reads the legal speak of Privacy Notices and TOS's - They are designed the way they are purposely - If people read these things, they would likely not opt in to most TOS contracts - Some TOS's have been outed on National news with warnings, but it doesn't stop many, because seems people are more interested in watching Tik-Tok or YouTube videos rather than being concerned about their personal well being and willing to literally signing away their God given, assumptive rights for a FREE service - Yeah FREE for a FEE - there is always a cost.

Most people are going to assume at least the bare minimum of protection and rights, and rightly so, but we are talking about corporate America here, who's only concern is the next quarterly report - What was once common and expected protections and rights have vanished in the legal speech of TOS's - and people are unwittingly paying the price for assuming any amount fairness in business...

You may know these things, because you have been here a long time and have a presence on these boards, but I would bet dollars to donuts, 8 out of 10 people selling here won't know about this money grab until it hits them upside the head...

mam98031

·2 years ago

Owner / Operator19752 View listings

@isaiah53-57

Not reading an agreement / contract you agreed to [or accepted] and/or signed to is not a legal defense. IDK if you numbers are right or not but I would bet they are close.

monroe67

·2 years ago

199 View listings

"Problem is, in the real world, no one reads the legal speak of Privacy Notices and TOS's - They are designed the way they are purposely - If people read these things, they would likely not opt in to most TOS contracts - "

Have you read eBay's User Agreement? Specifically Item 5, Fees and Taxes? When you do, be sure to click on the hyperlinks within it, which redirect to more detailed info.

For the most part, eBay's User Agreement is written in simple English and without legalese.

In this thread alone, two people have copied and pasted eBay's chart that explains when a Final Value Fee (FVF) is charged when an auction is ended before its scheduled time.  I honestly believe a 10-year-old child could read that chart and understand why the OP was charged a fee by eBay.

isaiah53-57

·2 years ago

961 View listings

@monroe67 wrote:
"Problem is, in the real world, no one reads the legal speak of Privacy Notices and TOS's - They are designed the way they are purposely - If people read these things, they would likely not opt in to most TOS contracts - "

Have you read eBay's User Agreement? Specifically Item 5, Fees and Taxes? When you do, be sure to click on the hyperlinks within it, which redirect to more detailed info.

For the most part, eBay's User Agreement is written in simple English and without legalese.

In this thread alone, two people have copied and pasted eBay's chart that explains when a Final Value Fee (FVF) is charged when an auction is ended before its scheduled time.  I honestly believe a 10-year-old child could read that chart and understand why the OP was charged a fee by eBay.

What does this have to do with the reality of the matter? That people dont take the time to slog through most of this stuff and RIGHTLY assume (whether right or wrong), they should have at least the bare minimum of protections and common sense fairness when dealing with a publicly traded company

Posting these "charts" here where likely 3% of ebay sellers come is doing little to help - and can actually be detrimental due to the judgemental attitude of the full-time posters here...

Assuming 8 out of 10 sellers are aware of this money grab that was once a common right and protection that has been slowly degraded over the years where it is now gone as a protection - In my opinion, thats EXACTLY where the company likes it, because I believe, from experience, they have NO PROBLEM taking money undeservedly out of seller pockets..

golfingaddict

·2 years ago

27172 View listings

This is not a money grab by eBay. It is a deterrent to sellers that use this as a form of fee avoidance. (reserve auctions)

Before eBay started charging sellers when they cancelled an auction, it was common for some sellers to cancel an auction if it was not getting the bids/attention that they wanted. Since Reserve auctions were expensive, they just counted on cancelling if they did not get the bids they wanted.

For a long time, eBay also allowed sellers to cancel listings in the last minute of the auction. So buyers thought they were winning an auction only to have the seller cancel bids and pull the listing at the last minute.

This was really disappointed and frustrating to buyers and I would guess it caused a lot of buyers to distrust eBay.

There were lots of rules like this implemented over the years and most of the rules (and that loss of fees the OP is talking about) were really about keeping buyers happy and reining in rouge sellers that used cancelling listings at the last minute as a way to avoid paying for a reserve listing or selling an item too cheaply.

farmalljr

·2 years ago

1880 View listings

@isaiah53-57 wrote:
@broto_64 wrote:
@isaiah53-57 wrote:
@inhawaii wrote:
I have some bad news for you ... you did authorize it.
Perhaps you should read up on cancelling auctions early.
No rip off here.

Nope no rip off, no way, no how - If its written somewhere in the tos, its no harm no foul - its just the site taking deserved funds to stay in business right? - Brings to mind a current thread where a poor soul had 2 bidders in a bidding war of an item he had a $40(approximately) "Buy It Now" on - These crazy bidders take the price up over 13,000 and the worried seller kills the auction - He gets a bill from ebay to the tune of $1500 or something like that - Yeah its just the site doing what they do - no harm no foul right Hawaii?

Considering, in my opinion, the EXTREME lack of protection this site offers its sellers and the very few tools you have to protect yourself from bad buyers, don't you just love it when the site cashes in on one of those few tools left? To the tune where anyone who hasn't slogged through the TOS trying to protect themselves gets caught in the trap... Yeah they got your back alright - though, from our experience, seems they don't have a problem sticking the knife in it - Happy ebaying everyone...

While I do agree that $13,000 is enough to concern a seller it still doesn't warrant ending the auction. What that seller should have done is allow the auction to complete, then await payment and either ship the item once payment is received or... When payment isn't received (because this is the most likely scenario) 4 calendar days after the listing ended, the seller can cancel the order by selecting the Cancel order button and choosing Buyer hasn't paid in the drop down menu. At this stage unless the buyer pays shortly ebay cancels it in the seller's favor without fees of any kind... Granted it involves waiting and being patient so if a seller can't wait there is always the option of cancelling instantly and paying the fees.

As was already stated you really do need to read up on policies, things on ebay work in a particular and sometimes a very peculiar fashion but they do work and if you work them correctly you will not come out the loser.
Problem is, in the real world, no one reads the legal speak of Privacy Notices and TOS's - They are designed the way they are purposely - If people read these things, they would likely not opt in to most TOS contracts - Some TOS's have been outed on National news with warnings, but it doesn't stop many, because seems people are more interested in watching Tik-Tok or YouTube videos rather than being concerned about their personal well being and willing to literally signing away their God given, assumptive rights for a FREE service - Yeah FREE for a FEE - there is always a cost.

Most people are going to assume at least the bare minimum of protection and rights, and rightly so, but we are talking about corporate America here, who's only concern is the next quarterly report - What was once common and expected protections and rights have vanished in the legal speech of TOS's - and people are unwittingly paying the price for assuming any amount fairness in business...

You may know these things, because you have been here a long time and have a presence on these boards, but I would bet dollars to donuts, 8 out of 10 people selling here won't know about this money grab until it hits them upside the head...

While I hear what you are saying....

THE PROBLEM IS, you as a user are AGREEING to a CONTRACT. It's your sole responsibility to understand the contract you are agreeing to. None of the excuses matter, as to why someone might not read it or fully understand it. If contracts were not binding and did not have real meaning, law would fall to pieces and all contracts would be meaningless. It's the user's job/responsibility to understand the contract and to follow the terms. If it's too much or too hard for them to grasp, then they probably have no business entering the contract. But because they do, they ARE bound to the terms, regardless of how anyone "feels" about it.

isaiah53-57

·2 years ago

961 View listings

@farmalljr wrote:
@isaiah53-57 wrote:
Problem is, in the real world, no one reads the legal speak of Privacy Notices and TOS's - They are designed the way they are purposely - If people read these things, they would likely not opt in to most TOS contracts - Some TOS's have been outed on National news with warnings, but it doesn't stop many, because seems people are more interested in watching Tik-Tok or YouTube videos rather than being concerned about their personal well being and willing to literally signing away their God given, assumptive rights for a FREE service - Yeah FREE for a FEE - there is always a cost.

Most people are going to assume at least the bare minimum of protection and rights, and rightly so, but we are talking about corporate America here, who's only concern is the next quarterly report - What was once common and expected protections and rights have vanished in the legal speech of TOS's - and people are unwittingly paying the price for assuming any amount fairness in business...

You may know these things, because you have been here a long time and have a presence on these boards, but I would bet dollars to donuts, 8 out of 10 people selling here won't know about this money grab until it hits them upside the head...
While I hear what you are saying....

THE PROBLEM IS, you as a user are AGREEING to a CONTRACT. It's your sole responsibility to understand the contract you are agreeing to. None of the excuses matter, as to why someone might not read it or fully understand it. If contracts were not binding and did not have real meaning, law would fall to pieces and all contracts would be meaningless. It's the user's job/responsibility to understand the contract and to follow the terms. If it's too much or too hard for them to grasp, then they probably have no business entering the contract. But because they do, they ARE bound to the terms, regardless of how anyone "feels" about it.

I certainly can't contend with what is a given - We ALL know there is a TOS we are bound to, even those who choose not to read it - Its a given - Nothing new in what you wrote there...

My contention is that some offensive corporations(not mentioning any names) take advantage of KNOWING people dont read this carp - They add unfair rules and asinine regulations contrary to common sense, they reduce or remove protections and rights that are generally assumed and expected by level heads, they sell your personal information, they take away services and tools that were once there with no notice other than the TOS that hardly anyone reads... And the saddest thing of all, much of it is by design to trap and snare unaware users into paying for things no reasonable person would think is justified.

We were the victim of a similar situation here at ebay - It did not have to do with a TOS issue - we have always been vigilant with contracts and TOS's. One day the site simply decided to make BOLD LISTINGS the default listing - You actually had to uncheck the obscure box if you didnt want it - If I recollect properly they did this for several days to a week or maybe more until the uproar had them roll it back - At .50 cents a whack back then, how much undeserved revenue do you think the company hauled in on that despicable plan??

farmalljr

·2 years ago

1880 View listings

@isaiah53-57 wrote:
@farmalljr wrote:
@isaiah53-57 wrote:
Problem is, in the real world, no one reads the legal speak of Privacy Notices and TOS's - They are designed the way they are purposely - If people read these things, they would likely not opt in to most TOS contracts - Some TOS's have been outed on National news with warnings, but it doesn't stop many, because seems people are more interested in watching Tik-Tok or YouTube videos rather than being concerned about their personal well being and willing to literally signing away their God given, assumptive rights for a FREE service - Yeah FREE for a FEE - there is always a cost.

Most people are going to assume at least the bare minimum of protection and rights, and rightly so, but we are talking about corporate America here, who's only concern is the next quarterly report - What was once common and expected protections and rights have vanished in the legal speech of TOS's - and people are unwittingly paying the price for assuming any amount fairness in business...

You may know these things, because you have been here a long time and have a presence on these boards, but I would bet dollars to donuts, 8 out of 10 people selling here won't know about this money grab until it hits them upside the head...
While I hear what you are saying....

THE PROBLEM IS, you as a user are AGREEING to a CONTRACT. It's your sole responsibility to understand the contract you are agreeing to. None of the excuses matter, as to why someone might not read it or fully understand it. If contracts were not binding and did not have real meaning, law would fall to pieces and all contracts would be meaningless. It's the user's job/responsibility to understand the contract and to follow the terms. If it's too much or too hard for them to grasp, then they probably have no business entering the contract. But because they do, they ARE bound to the terms, regardless of how anyone "feels" about it.
I certainly can't contend with what is a given - We ALL know there is a TOS we are bound to, even those who choose not to read it - Its a given - Nothing new in what you wrote there...

My contention is that some offensive corporations(not mentioning any names) take advantage of KNOWING people dont read this carp - They add unfair rules and asinine regulations contrary to common sense, they reduce or remove protections and rights that are generally assumed and expected by level heads, they sell your personal information, they take away services and tools that were once there with no notice other than the TOS that hardly anyone reads... And the saddest thing of all, much of it is by design to trap and snare unaware users into paying for things no reasonable person would think is justified.

We were the victim of a similar situation here at ebay - It did not have to do with a TOS issue - we have always been vigilant with contracts and TOS's. One day the site simply decided to make BOLD LISTINGS the default listing - You actually had to uncheck the obscure box if you didnt want it - If I recollect properly they did this for several days to a week or maybe more until the uproar had them roll it back - At .50 cents a whack back then, how much undeserved revenue do you think the company hauled in on that despicable plan??

And who's fault is it if you are charging in, rushing through listings? It's the lister's job to make sure everything is correct and how they want it, before they hit submit. Are glitches here new? Are the games programmers and eBay management play, new? If a seller fails to pay attention every single time, you are only passing the blame if you didn't catch something, right?

I'm not arguing it was right of eBay to do that, but ultimately, it is up to the seller to look things over before submitting a listing. Seller are here to make money too. You don't think if buyers knew what was paid for inventory, they would not "feel" like sellers are here screwing them over too?

broto_64

·2 years ago

0 View listings

@isaiah53-57 wrote:
@farmalljr wrote:
@isaiah53-57 wrote:
Problem is, in the real world, no one reads the legal speak of Privacy Notices and TOS's - They are designed the way they are purposely - If people read these things, they would likely not opt in to most TOS contracts - Some TOS's have been outed on National news with warnings, but it doesn't stop many, because seems people are more interested in watching Tik-Tok or YouTube videos rather than being concerned about their personal well being and willing to literally signing away their God given, assumptive rights for a FREE service - Yeah FREE for a FEE - there is always a cost.

Most people are going to assume at least the bare minimum of protection and rights, and rightly so, but we are talking about corporate America here, who's only concern is the next quarterly report - What was once common and expected protections and rights have vanished in the legal speech of TOS's - and people are unwittingly paying the price for assuming any amount fairness in business...

You may know these things, because you have been here a long time and have a presence on these boards, but I would bet dollars to donuts, 8 out of 10 people selling here won't know about this money grab until it hits them upside the head...
While I hear what you are saying....

THE PROBLEM IS, you as a user are AGREEING to a CONTRACT. It's your sole responsibility to understand the contract you are agreeing to. None of the excuses matter, as to why someone might not read it or fully understand it. If contracts were not binding and did not have real meaning, law would fall to pieces and all contracts would be meaningless. It's the user's job/responsibility to understand the contract and to follow the terms. If it's too much or too hard for them to grasp, then they probably have no business entering the contract. But because they do, they ARE bound to the terms, regardless of how anyone "feels" about it.
I certainly can't contend with what is a given - We ALL know there is a TOS we are bound to, even those who choose not to read it - Its a given - Nothing new in what you wrote there...

My contention is that some offensive corporations(not mentioning any names) take advantage of KNOWING people dont read this carp - They add unfair rules and asinine regulations contrary to common sense, they reduce or remove protections and rights that are generally assumed and expected by level heads, they sell your personal information, they take away services and tools that were once there with no notice other than the TOS that hardly anyone reads... And the saddest thing of all, much of it is by design to trap and snare unaware users into paying for things no reasonable person would think is justified.

No.

Most corporations are not single entities so there's no real thought process involved here.

Lawyers draw these things up, they get paid for their services... It's a whole process, board members vote on it, the list goes on, it takes a lot of work and time to process all the rules and regulations but ultimately I doubt very much the mindset of "we know they won't read it so we're going to slip them a few mickey's" truly goes on here.

I will not sink to the level of conspiracy theories because there's a much simpler explanation that doesn't involve voodoo:

You see, it is our responsibility as members to read it, and if we fail to do so we suffer the consequences.

It is that simple.

mam98031

·2 years ago

Owner / Operator19752 View listings

@isaiah53-57

"They add unfair rules and asinine regulations contrary to common sense..." I get it that this is your opinion, but that is not likely the reasoning behind Ebay's creation of the rule. Ebay created the rule regarding charging sellers for cancelling auctions that have bids on them because they had too many sellers doing this and creating unhappy buyers. It was also an indicator that the seller took the transaction off Ebay. Now while you may disagree with that, it won't change the fact that Ebay sees it differently.

I remember that issue with the Bold titles. As I remember it, it was a glitch / bug and Ebay fixed it and refunded the affected sellers.

mam98031

·2 years ago

Owner / Operator19752 View listings

@isaiah53-57 wrote:
@inhawaii wrote:
I have some bad news for you ... you did authorize it.
Perhaps you should read up on cancelling auctions early.
No rip off here.

Nope no rip off, no way, no how - If its written somewhere in the tos, its no harm no foul - its just the site taking deserved funds to stay in business right? - Brings to mind a current thread where a poor soul had 2 bidders in a bidding war of an item he had a $40(approximately) "Buy It Now" on - These crazy bidders take the price up over 13,000 and the worried seller kills the auction - He gets a bill from ebay to the tune of $1500 or something like that - Yeah its just the site doing what they do - no harm no foul right Hawaii?

Considering, in my opinion, the EXTREME lack of protection this site offers its sellers and the very few tools you have to protect yourself from bad buyers, don't you just love it when the site cashes in on one of those few tools left? To the tune where anyone who hasn't slogged through the TOS trying to protect themselves gets caught in the trap... Yeah they got your back alright - though, from our experience, seems they don't have a problem sticking the knife in it - Happy ebaying everyone...

This is an issue easily resolved. All that seller needed to do was contact Ebay and explain what happened. It is highly likely Ebay would have refunded the fees unless the seller has a track record of cancelling auctions with bids.

brightlightbookseller

·2 years ago

24784 View listings

Yes, that would be the seller's fault. They didn't know and probably didn't even read the terms and conditions. You can cancel a bid at any time without penalty, but you cannot cancel an auction with bids on it without incurring FVFs.

slippinjimmy

·2 years ago

4 View listings

Perhaps you did not comply (or understand) the rules for ending Auction listings early.

https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/listings/creating-managing-listings/ending-listing?id=4146

What was the reason for ending listings and then relisting them immediately?