Feedback Removal policy is a joke.
Why shouldn’t the following feedback be removed? eBay policy clearly states that extortion is not allowed, yet eBay canned email says my feedback removal request was denied. I guess I should have bowed down to extortion and issued a refund just to avoid this hassle.
“I assume the toothbrush was brand new, but you can't tell. The plastic bag was open. It did not come with an instruction booklet, which is really needed, although the seller said he had one. Instead, he gave me an online link. I suggested he give me a partial refund (leaving the amount up to him). He would not do that, but instead told me to contact eBay.”
The buyer explicitly requested a partial refund for something that was not offered in the listing. The buyer also repeated this request in messages. We declined the partial refund request and instead offered a full refund upon return of the item. The item was clearly listed as “open box” without retail packaging, and the listing included clear pictures showing exactly what was included.
luckythewinner
·4 months agoThe buyer explicitly requested a partial refund for something that was not offered in the listing
I always find this complaint about buyers to be an odd one.
In eBay's policy about resolving disputes, eBay openly suggests partial refunds as a solution for resolving disputes. If eBay encourages a seller to consider a possible solution, why would it be against policy for a buyer to suggest the same possible solution that eBay itself endorses?
powell-collectibles
·4 months agoYou sold an item that might have been used, or at least used in the eyes of the buyer. If you are selling returns, I think of those as used products, unless there is a foolproof way to verify item hasn't been used.
Slapping "open box" and "no retail packaging" on a listing does not mean something is new or not used. There was a day when "open box" was more about floor models or damaged property or absolutely-without-a-doubt-never-used returns. Now, it just seems dishonest - similar to what "NWOT" has become in clothing. Right or wrong, I see NWOT and Open Box sellers a largely a questionable group.
Regardless, is it really against policy to ask for a partial refund? I can't find where that is in eBay policy. For me, it makes sense to allow a buyer to request one - eBay certainly offers it up as an option in selling policy documents.
Sellers that are dead-set against partials often lose out. I just offered that option yesterday. I bought a lot of six records, and they were not well graded - jackets were not "VG" as described, and two of the six had scratches, even though "no scratches" was advertised. I would have taken a $10 discount without argument. Seller wants the items back - no problem. But, he's now down about $12 in the back and forth for shipping.
pickapaper
·4 months agoMy only comment is why you told the buyer to contact eBay? This is something you could/should have handled yourself. No need for either you or the buyer to contact eBay.
inhawaii
·4 months agoThe buyer did not say "If you don't give me a partial refund, i'm leaving you a negative feedback."
mobilekrypto
OP4 months agoBuyer requested partial refund for something that was not listed in listing. That is against policy simple.
inhawaii
·4 months agoI would have to look at the official policy, but I don't think that just "asking" for something is against policy.
"Can you please pack my order well?"
Asking for something and threatening to leave negative feedback if you don't get it is.
christworks
·4 months agoCertain things buyers ask after the sale for can violate policy.
"Can you please pack my order well?" Does not violate policy. It is expected that sellers will pack orders well so they arrive as described. That's part of the listing and part of the seller's responsibilty.
"When will my order arrive?" - does not violate policy
"When will you ship my order?" - does not violate policy
"Can you ship my order UPS instead of FedEx?" - Violates policy if UPS was not offered
"I want a shipping discount." - Violates policy if there is no mention of a shipping discount in the listing.
"Can you ship the package to my cousin in Kennebunkport, ME instead of my address in Jasper, TX?" - violates policy
"Please dont' ship my order until two weeks from today. I'm out of town and won't be home to get it." - violates policy
"I suggest you refund $10 to me to make up for no manual." violates policy
"Please include a charger with the toothbrush." - violates policy if the listing did not mention a charger
"Can I Zelle you the money for the toothbrush?" - violates policy
slippinjimmy
·4 months agoBuyers can "ask" for almost anything, what they can't do is "demand" or threaten to do something "bad" if the seller doesn't agree.
There is a huge difference between "ask" and "demand".
Foe example:
"Can you ship my order UPS instead of FedEx?" - Violates policy if UPS was not offered
Not a policy violation unless it's a demand, if the seller replies "sorry but UPS is not available for me" and the buyer responds "ok, send it FedEx" there is no policy violation.
grann-4629
·4 months agoGood explanation, although I don't agree with a few of them. I know it's eBay's venue and their rules!
atlasesattic
·4 months agoYou have to realize that a robot makes the decision to remove feedback and not a human, robots don't have compassion and don't understand what you are trying to convey.
spacecoastparts
·4 months agoYou can always appeal (speak with a rep). May not work, but it may work just as well. IME it comes down to how the rep sends the message to the "feedback team". There's no harm in trying.
christworks
·4 months ago@mobilekrypto
This was not feedback extortion. There is no mention by the buyer that they would leave you negative feedback if you did not provide a partial refund or physical copy of the instruction book. The feedback itself is factual. It explains what happened during the transaction. The feedback alone does not violate the eBay feedback policy, which is why eBay denied removing it.
It is against eBay policy for buyers to ask for a partial refund. Once the buyer did that, you should have immediately reported them to eBay. You didn't do that. If you had, when you appealed the feedback, you could have stated that the buyer had been reported for that policy violation and their feedback referenced the action that violated policy. You may have been able to get it removed. I would still report the buyer for violating policy. Don't let them get away with that.
You have free returns on that item. Did you respond to the buyer's request for a partial refund by telling them they could return the item to you for free and receive a full refund if they were unhappy? If not, why didn't you do that?
I would respond to the feedback as @inhawaii stated, but I'd also make a line about the buyer violating eBay policy and that their account was reported to eBay. The buyer will see that and they may be more willing to revise their feedback.
I disagree with @oldwestcoins and @inhawaii. You did the right thing by not giving a partial refund. If you are in the habit of doing that, some people will partial refund you right out of business or die trying. It would be different if something was wrong with the listing.
One last thing, because we are all a little stupid, I advise making clear in open box listings what does and what does not come with the item. I spell out there is no box, no paperwork, directions, etc.
I like your responses to your other negative feedback. Very good job.
I would have had the one about Costco removed. Buyers must stick to the transaction when leaving feedback. The one that calls you a horrible seller also removable as that harms your reputation, which buyers cannot do.
inhawaii
·4 months agoI disagree with @christworks disagreeing with me. 😉
I know many sellers refuse to give a partial refund and encourage others not to.
If giving a partial refund will save me time/money vs. a return, whether the buyer is right or wrong, i'll consider it.
At the end of the day, it's the seller's call.
mobilekrypto
OP4 months agoYou wrote a long message but without fully reading or understanding. Extortion is asking refund for something that is not included in listing. Just asking that is against ebay policy. Customer was reported to ebay in advance and offered full refund with return. Costco feedback was also reported with same result and same canned message.
christworks
·4 months agoI do understand what the buyer did. You have a misunderstanding of what extortion is. Extortion is not simply asking for something. It is asking or demanding something along with a threat of what will happen if you do not comply. You made no mention of the buyer threatening you. When you appealed the feedback, if you stated it was because the buyer tried to extort you, this is why it was denied because that's not what happened. Nowhere does eBay define extortion how you seem to think they do.
You are correct. Per the abusive buyer policy, buyers are not allowed to ask for partial refunds. (Here is the policy for those who question this. @powell-collectibles @luckythewinner )
If you want to be technical about it, a buyer can say they will return the item for a 50% refund. Who is going to do that?
It is true that eBay does allow sellers to issue partial refunds and that isn't against policy. The policy is about buyers asking for it, rather than the seller offering it. There is a difference. Buyers do not get to tell a seller how to run their business. Not ever. This is why eBay draws a line in the sand on this issue. eBay also likes to play both sides of the fence as they try to carefully thread the needle to appease both buyers and sellers. This is why often policy can come across as contradictory. Whichever party knows policy is the one who has the upper hand and can win a case if eBay must decide.
snazzplatypus
·4 months agoWait it's really againt ebay policy for buyers to ask for partial refunds?
inhawaii
·4 months agoI would calmly reply to that feedback something along the lines of ... "Item was clearly listed without retail packaging. Your complaint is that it did not come with retail packaging. If you are unhappy, please return for a full refund."
Unfortunately "buyer stupidity" is not a feedback violation.
I agree with @oldwestcoins , I would have offered him a small partial refund and be done with it.
oldwestcoins
·4 months agoAfter reviewing it, I would have just given the person $10 back then blocked them. I fully understand where you are coming from, but at the end of the day, is negative feedback and all the problems it causes worth it? Not in my experience. The buyer was clearly looking for a freebie. I would have told them to return it. I wouldn't worry about it, as you have tons of positive FB, which makes the few you have insignificant.
Oh, I fully agree eBay should have cut you some slack and removed it. I should have won last week's lottery also, but some things just aren't going to happen.
Don't look back. You're not going that way.
tobaccocardyahoo
·4 months agoYour quote does not include the buyer threatening to leave negative FB. It was not FB extortion.
IMO an open box toothbrush should never be sold. Too easy to be a used toothbrush.
pickapaper
·4 months agoThis was a Sonic toothbrush. They have snap-in heads. If I found an open box one on eBay at a good price, the first thing I would do is go to Wally World and buy some replacement heads (they're going to be needed later anyway), then remove the head that came with it and replace it with a new one...just for my own satisfaction.
tobaccocardyahoo
·4 months agoYou would probably consider buying a used toothbrush. Health codes in much of the US would prohibit selling one.
pickapaper
·4 months agoI think you and I are talking about two different things. No, I wouldn't buy a "used toothbrush"; for you to say that doesn't even make sense. But I might consider buying a SONIC unit if it were advertised as "new" (which "open box" is supposed to be), and like I said, I would then put a new brush head on it. Have you ever used a Sonic or electronic toothbrush?