Ebay WHAT Are You Thinking???
This is just a minor rant BUT while I was updating some of my listings today I noticed something on the righthand side of the screen next to my listing I've never seen before. It was a small advertisement to click on another seller's page and check them out!
Now what is alarming is this seller has only sold 5 LISTINGS and yet Ebay wants me to check them out? Why? What do they have that is so much better than what the customer is currently looking at? Do they even have what the customer needs? How much are they being Ebay to be placed in that spot? Are they paying Ebay at all or is Ebay just randomly selecting them to be there? ( It think not on that last question)
So I continued to scroll down just to see if I could find anything else like that in the listing. What I found was disgusting honestly. After two rows of "other seller's listings" a small sliver of page was giving to item details/description area THEN the rest of the page was filled with other listings until you reached the bottom.
Selling on another platform is looking more appealing everyday I log into Ebay. My question is WHY are you overloading the viewer/customer with so many options that only distract from what they are really looking for. Oh wait, I know... TO LINE YOUR POCKETS WITH MORE $$$ YOU DON'T DESERVE. Shameful Ebay.
valueaddedresource
·3 years agoeBay continues to conflate "related" and "similar" in these Promoted Display ads which are being shown with ever increasing frequency across listings.
Every new iteration of these ads I've seen appears to be designed more and more to blur lines and get buyers to click on these ads possibly without even realizing they are being taken to a competitor store instead of more similar items from the same seller.
It's very concerning that eBay has pushed forward with making these new ads live on a wider basis without providing *any* public information about them.
@adsteam@ebay @devon@ebay @kyle@ebay - when will vital, business impacting information about Promoted Display Ads be shared with all sellers?
sumsum70
·3 years agoThis old post never needed any replies, one very true sentence says it all!
Oh wait, I know... TO LINE YOUR POCKETS WITH MORE $$$ YOU DON'T DESERVE. Shameful Ebay.
valueaddedresource
·3 years agoeBay appears to be testing out different Call To Action verbiage for these Promoted Display ads and it's raising even more concerns about how these ads may be confusing to buyers - in this case potentially implying a "relationship" where none exists.
While it may be splitting hairs semantically, there are important differences between "related" and "similar" and I'm afraid eBay is just blurring the lines more and more with these new ads.
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years agoAgree with your point about related and similar....just want to add, the Ads Team is definitely working on this new "ebay stores sponsored" ad type, but , while ebay can do that, the ebay stores team hasn't made any new changes to stores in ages....
ebay, perhaps you should focus on giving us a more robust store feature, rather than finding more ways to create ad revenue?
turnpiketreasures1
·3 years agoIt happens like this on almost all platforms. I'm also on Etsy and it's there, and sellers complain and complain, and it's still there. Ebay is just such a huge platform, I find it extremely hard to sell here, where on Etsy it's a little easier, but harder work to list. And Etsy continually fiddles with everything making it extremely hard not to get frustrated almost daily. And they are so trying to be Ebay. Just this month they are now allowing offers on your listings if you want it. You should hear the ranting about that one on their forums. The whole thing is if you want to sell on any platform you have to accept that it isn't going to be the way you want it, it's the way they want it because they're constantly trying to figure out a way to make more money, and more money...which when you think about it, is the way a business should be run. Usually something that is absolutely horrible will go away if it doesn't work. Showing every available option to a buyer probably works so don't expect it to go away anytime soon. Just don't worry about it. You spent way too much time taking screenshots of all those examples. Think of the things you could have listed in that time. I figure if I want to sell on Ebay, I just need to get a whole lot more listings in order to compete. With Etsy the magic number is around 500, which at one time I had. I think my highest on there was a little over a thousand items, and when I hit that I was selling about 100 things a week. I think the magic number on Ebay is probably way higher, which I doubt I'll ever reach, but I plan to give it a try. The point is you have to figure out how to sell on any platform and with Ebay it's a numbers game. Good luck, and get to listing.
nuclearomen
·3 years agomaybe I was mistaken then, sorry for any confusion, like said, was like 2 years ago I read about it.
joliztoyco
·3 years agoSo you mean to tell me that as hard as a seller works to list and sell a few auctions, Ebay is diverting their potential buyers away to promoted listings? With a direct link that's visible as soon as a buyer clicks on your auction?
What kind of horsebleep is that?
This almost assures the only sellers that will be left on this platform will be those that can afford the 20-30% of their earnings going to ebay through PL's.+ FVF's!!
And sellers not using PL's or even at the bottom range of PL's thought sales were bad now???
Sit tight.
nuclearomen
·3 years agoyeah yeah yeah... ebay advertising biz makes tons, 2 yrs ago they were compared to being the 10th largest advertising company in the world and they have grown since then. Not talking about PL fees or advertising coming from platform sales, they have their own Marketing/Advertising business.
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years ago@nuclearomen Again, can you provide a source?
ebay might be fairly high in terms of overall ad revenue, but I'm sure its no where near Amazon or Facebook or Google....
My understanding is most of ebay's ad revenue comes from First Party ads (Promoted Listings) and the third party ads business has been declining, as ebay builds the first party revenue stream.
So, yes, the ads do bring in revenue, but as a percentage of ebay's overall revenue, it is still quite small.
nuclearomen
·3 years ago@my-cottage-books-and-antiques it was 2 years ago, don't remember, google it. Possibly I'm wrong and things have change, but doubt it. Keep talking about ad revenue from the site...that's completely different from what I'm talking about. Talking about their advertising business, it's a separate entity from the marketplace, from what I understand, it's in NYC.
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years ago@nuclearomen I tried Googling this when you first posted....didn't find anything to support what you were saying, which is why I asked you to provide your source. At one point, ebay owned some Classified Ad businesses in various countries, could that be what you are thinking about?
This is from 2020: "US e-commerce giant eBay has sold its classified-ads business to Norwegian competitor Adevinta in a $9.2 billion deal. The deal includes the sale of recognized brands such as Gumtree, Kijiji, and DBA. It will make Adevinta the world's leading online classified group, with a market presence in 20 countries."
I believe ebay obtained a shareholder ownership stake in Adevinta, but as far as I know, ebay is just a shareholder, and does not have an active role in the business.
@valueaddedresource can you add anything to the discussion about ebay's ad business? I can find nothing to support the original statement made by @nuclearomen , but maybe I'm missing something?
nuclearomen
·3 years agocould be that you mention, in which case didn't know they sold it off.
Huge snow storm here, internet went out twice... see if I'm online in the morn lol.
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years ago@nuclearomen Best of luck with the snowstorm. We've been really lucky here all winter....very little snow.
nuclearomen
·3 years ago@my-cottage-books-and-antiques there is over 20 inches this morn and still going... just shoveled walk pathway to the driveway...not going to be a fun day!
valueaddedresource
·3 years ago@my-cottage-books-and-antiques @nuclearomen sounds like maybe eBay Commerce Network? That came out of the acquisition of Shopping.com and was eBay's 3rd party ad platform.
https://www.ebayinc.com/stories/press-room/au/shopping-com-re-launches-as-the-ebay-commerce-network/
It was shut down in 2019 as part of the Elliott management driven directive to "focus on the core marketplace" and the over all pivot to Promoted Listings/1st party ads.
https://www.pymnts.com/news/ecommerce/2019/ebay-third-party-ad-platform/
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years ago@valueaddedresource Thanks. Yes, that could be the source of the confusion.
nuclearomen
·3 years agonever seen it before? It's been there for going on 2 years at very least! It's something I brought up various times to ebay. Bad enough they flood your listings with sponsored listings other sellers but no that wasn't enough. Fact is majority of ebay's captial comes from promotional ads, not sales through the site, but ads they charge for, promoted listing fees etc... their not in the world's top 10 advertisement companies for nothing.
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years ago@nuclearomen
Fact is majority of ebay's captial comes from promotional ads, not sales through the site, but ads they charge for, promoted listing fees etc... their not in the world's top 10 advertisement companies for nothing.
Could you provide proof of that? My understanding is that ad revenue is a small percentage of ebay's overall revenue. ebay's GMV has been declining, and ad revenue has been increasing, which is one reason ebay touts it in the Quarterly Reports....but I don't believe it makes up anywhere near the majority of ebay's revenue.
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years ago@nuclearomen This is from the Q4 2022 Earnings Call:
Additionally, our total ad revenue is nearing 1.8% penetration of GMV. Promoted Listing Standard was again the largest contributor to growth, both on a sequential and an annual basis as optimization gains from prior quarters continue to benefit ad rates.
In Q4, we also improved our merchandising algorithms to show a greater diversity of products, which improves buyer satisfaction, while also preserving relevance and conversion.
Our newer ad products also continued to scale nicely in Q4 and grew more than 20% quarter-over-quarter. Promoted Listings Advanced, our cost per click product continues to be a standout among the new products. Seller adoption of Advanced has grown, as we have expanded access and automated more elements of campaign management to make this powerful ad unit easier to use.
In Q4, we launched Quick Setup, a one-click campaign creation solution for sellers, where eBay automates and optimizes the campaign structure, ad groups targeting and keyword bids for CPC advertisers. We also introduced multiuser account access across our full suite of promoted listings, which enables eBay sellers to delegate campaign management to trusted third parties like brands or ad agencies.
Also, asked about increasing the percentage from 1.8% :
So on the ad side, like we said at Investor Day, we have line of sight to 3%, which we still feel great about. If you look at the performance, Promoted Listing Standard continues to be the workhorse of the product, and we're continuing to drive additional penetration there, hitting 2 million sellers and 700 million listings. But we're also excited by our new products. They once again grew 20% quarter-over-quarter and we're making it easier for sellers.
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years agoQ4 2022:
Promoted Listings drove first-party ad revenue of $276 million, up 27% or more than 30 points faster than GMV growth.
Also Q4 2022:
We generated over $18 billion in GMV and more than $2.5 billion in revenue.
dhbookds
·3 years ago@nuclearomen
Fact is majority of ebay's captial comes from promotional ads, not sales through the site, but ads they charge for, promoted listing fees etc... their not in the world's top 10 advertisement companies for nothing.
Except for the per click ads........ebay doesn't get paid for the PL listings until they are sold.........so don't know how the above could be true.......
reallynicestamps
·3 years ago@nuclearomen
Made a stupid mistake in my post (referenced in #61)
The biggest difference is that in addition to non-eBay businesses advertising on our listings, eBay is allowing buyers to pay to advertise on listings.
Should read :
The biggest difference is that in addition to non-eBay businesses advertising on our listings, eBay is allowing other sellers to pay to advertise on listings.
siamjane8
·3 years agoi just saw that eBay sent out emails to some buyers saying that they will be testing a new buyer experience page view. it will have larger pictures and move the description and and more seller info higher up on the page before advertising!!
Finally they are starting to understand what we have known all along- the path to a sale is the path of least resistance without all the annoying advertising and promoted listings thrown in your face.
Just dial back the AI and fix the algorithms to just show people the actual items they searched for and we will be golden again.
valueaddedresource
·3 years agoIt looks like eBay is moving right along with whatever this new ad type is - I'm now seeing it advertising real stores, not just eBay test stores.
In this example, the "check out this top seller" call to action has been replaced with "shop similar items" but I think the previous observations still stand - this type of advertising is likely to confuse buyers who will click on that ad expecting to see additional similar items from the same seller only to be directed to a competitor instead.
@adsteam@ebay @devon@ebay now that this is actually being rolled out with real sellers (even if just a limited beta at this point) can we please get some information about these ads?
wastingtime101
·3 years agoThe ad should not be more prominent than store info for the seller that 'owns' the listing. Plus there's virtually zero space between that ad and the seller's info above.
They should be redesigning the box with the seller's info to make it more prominent (or at least equal to) the advertisement.
And maybe make that 'sponsored' text at the bottom lower and centered so that stands out more clearly to distinguish it from the seller above.
How about "shop similar items from other stores" to make it more clear? Not sure if that would make it much better?
valueaddedresource
·3 years ago@wastingtime101 I'm almost always in the "more transparency is better" camp, so while I still wouldn't really "like" these ads, I do think your suggestions would definitely make them "better."
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years ago@devon@ebay, @adsteam@ebay
I agree with @valueaddedresource If ebay still wants to talk about transparency and seller engagement, this would be a good opportunity---tell us just what is going on here.
goodnu9
·3 years agoWhat irritates me is I pay for an eBay store but on my listings, eBay is promoting other sellers listings of the same product! Now I'm competing against myself on my own listings! Wake up, eBay! There's other venues where I can sell my items!
reallynicestamps
·3 years agoNow I'm competing against myself on my own listings!
EBay has been putting other listings on our listing pages for years,if not decades.
Because I don't often buy and rarely look at my own (GTC) listings, I didn't really notice this and I guess you are the same.
The biggest difference is that in addition to non-eBay businesses advertising on our listings, eBay is allowing buyers to pay to advertise on listings.
reallynicestamps
·3 years agoFWIW.
I use HTML coding within my Descriptions.
So those will stand out on my page because they have a pastel pink or pale blue solid background.
The coding was written a couple of decades ago and I just cut and paste the coding into my Sell Your Item form, although I did have a few minutes of panic when first confronted with the new Terrible Horrible No Good Very Bad form. Then I figured it out (top right hand side of description text box).
If your Description is just black print on white, it disappears.
But it doesn't have to be.
lotzofuniquegoodies
·3 years ago@reallynicestamps
That was my observation from the get go with the new listing tool. It makes all new listings being created going forward look extremely bland, unless sellers are doing what you are doing. Even not to have access to RED which we have access to here makes no sense. Sellers used red to highlight information they needed buyers to see. Now any important fine print is going to be bypassed in most cases. And what happened to the spellcheck tool? Should a seller really need to edit their listing in an editor outside of eBay to do ALL the required work?
As for the html editor now included with the new listing tool. No comment!!! ðŸ˜
-Lotzofuniquegoodies
the-hook-and-the-loop
·3 years agoWhat it does is activates all of the other listings to that buyer. If the buyer purchases any of those promoted items in the next 30 days, eBay will get their promoted listings fee and final value fee. eBay is activating/priming 50 - 100 listings with one keystroke from a buyer. Every time a shopper views a listing's page, all of those other promoted listings from other sellers are now ACTIVATED for eBay to receive double fees.
siamjane8
·3 years ago@the-hook-and-the-loop you are absolutely right!!! I did not even think of that but you are right! This is eBay stacking the deck! Just flashing any old PL up on our screens to "activate" as viewed. This is so unethical! Promoted listings as a whole are just destroying eBay and the search.
5594shelleys
·3 years agoSomething odd as this is a 12 year old store with feedback over a year old.
pburn
·3 years agoNot sure where you're seeing that, since the OP doesn't seem to even have a store.
valueaddedresource
·3 years ago@pburn I believe they were referring to the store that was shown in the ad, not the OP.
@5594shelleys that store is a testing account presumably operated by an eBay employee, which is why you may see some odd things.
axiombody
·3 years agoThe items you show look very similar. If I am a buyer seeing many similar items is helpful to choose
valueaddedresource
·3 years ago@axiombody - that may be true...until it isn't.
Some very smart people have done studies on the psychology involved and for the most part they have found it turns out at a certain point, too many options can actually lead to confusion, frustration, and anxiety that may cause buyers to give up all together or experience lower satisfaction with their eventual purchase.
While it may provide immediate benefits to eBay to pursue this course (increasing ad revenue) there's a real potential for long term negative consequences too.
ittybitnot
·3 years ago...too many options can actually lead to confusion, frustration, and anxiety that may cause buyers to give up all together or experience lower satisfaction with their eventual purchase.
@valueaddedresource
Wasn't that the same old excuse eBay used to use for NOT showing all the items available for a search query??? .. providing the buyer too many choices caused "buyer confusion". Though many buyers were not happy that eBay considered them so easily confused, most were not happy to see only those eBay chose for them to view. I guess providing too many options that causes buyer confusion is now A-OK so long as eBay gets paid ad clicks.
siamjane8
·3 years agoYep... Do as I say not as I do. There is definitely but frustration and confusion now on eBay. The entire platform is completely cluttered up with ironically he ads and promoted listings. It's tiring to look for anything on eBay. I just wish they would go back to the basics and show people what they search for and just reap the benefits of seller's success. We struggle to be successful now because of all the manipulation and bad AI programming.
dakotasnowshine
·3 years agoIt is getting pretty obsessive. Let's compare it to walking into a fast food restaurant and in the lobby a competing fast food restaurant is handing out free samples.
turnpiketreasures1
·3 years agoI don't see it as the same at all. Ebay wouldn't let Etsy come in and have ads on your page, but with another vendor ad, it all goes to Ebay. They're not stupid, just as greedy as a company like Ebay has to be in order to stay on top of the heap.
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years ago@valueaddedresourse
Do you think this might be a beta test for the sponsored store ads ebay talked about ages ago?
valueaddedresource
·3 years agoGood call @my-cottage-books-and-antiques ! I'm not 100% sure, but that does sound likely.
@adsteam@ebay - can you confirm if this is a beta test and if these are the ads for stores that VP Ads Alex Kazim was talking about in his presentation at Investor Day back in March?
my-cottage-books-and-antiques
·3 years ago@valueaddedresource
Here's a link to the "Yug&Yara" store:
https://www.ebay.com/str/yugyara?_trksid=p2047675.m3561.l2563
If you do an "advanced search" for ebay store using "Yug&Yara" the result says "this is a test store."
1 store found with Yug&Yara in the store name.
Showing 1 to 1
Yug&Yara
This is a test store
So, yeah, I'd say the adsteam is beta testing something, and I'm guessing its the store ads that Alex Kazim was talking about....
valueaddedresource
·3 years ago@my-cottage-books-and-antiques another good catch! So putting this all together, my guess is that the store ads Kazim was talking about may in fact be the same thing as the Promoted Display ads that GM Ad growth Elisabeth Rommel was talking about in June.
https://community.ebay.com/t5/Selling/New-Promoted-Listings-Ad-Types-Coming-Soon/td-p/33000051
In an interview in MediaPost, she said:
eBay will launch an ad unit -- code-named Promoted Display, based on a cost-per-click (CPC) pricing model. The company will test it in September, with the goal to roll out the ad unit in a closed beta during the second half in 2022.
The ads will serve up on eBay’s “View Items” page, where merchants highlight their products.
“We have a test and learn culture and always think of a placement with high visibility above the fold,” Rommel said. “It will be targeted at a higher level above search. We learn and make changes before rolling it out more broadly.”
This Promoted Display ad unit will target repeat customers, the type of consumer who knows, for example that Adidas sells shoes and sportswear.
It wasn't exactly clear what she meant by "view items page" - I had guessed she may have been talking about ads that would be served on actual store pages or a seller's "view other items" page - but it could be she was talking about the listing page itself and just didn't know what sellers commonly call that page (it wouldn't be the first time an eBay exec wasn't tuned into terminology/how users actually use the site).
But based on the screenshots, what @Anonymous saw would certainly fit the "high visibility placement above the fold" and showing a store selling jewelry on a jewelry listing would fit with the concept of showing repeat customers similar items, like Elisabeth's example of shoes and sportswear.
So to answer @ittybitnot's question about how these ads would be paid - my very strong guess at this point would be Cost Per Click.
moondogblues
·3 years ago" "high visibility placement above the fold""
I LOVE this...taking an almost vintage (how many print papers are left) phrase and making it their own. Above the fold refers to the way most people read the newspaper back then. My Mama was a columnist and had reporters as friends (back in the 60's) that's how I know this. Sunnyvale Standard and San Jose Mercury News. Now we just read the news on Yahoo. Well, I do. I do miss the huge Sunday paper and would spend a whole afternoon reading it. Better editing back then too.
valueaddedresource
·3 years ago@moondogblues it does indeed come from the old newspaper days, but you'd be giving eBay far too much credit for making it their own. 😉
It's a common phrase in the web design and marketing world to refer to anything on a page that is immediately seen and can be interacted with without having to scroll.
Those who are in the business of selling digital ad space know that is the most valuable real estate for the same reason those reporters all vied to have their byline appear there in the newspaper too - that's where the eyeballs are.
ittybitnot
·3 years agoWHY are you overloading the viewer/customer with so many options that only distract from what they are really looking for.
@Anonymous
I would think that so much of eBay's income now is from "promoted listings" as opposed to actual final value fees, they have to stick those promoted products somewhere. What better place than on a page of (other people's listings) like items to put them. The more that sellers are convinced that they NEED to promote in order to be even be seen, the more those "rows" of other people's stuff will increase.
As suggested, for eBay it is a "short term" solution to other more serious problems. Even Amazon has a discreet link to see "like items" or provide more choices of same as opposed to STUFFING a seller's listing like this. It used to be and is still said "you don't like it, leave".... It is not that difficult to diversify now days. Contrary to the popular spiel, eBay is NOT the only place that has buyers and sales.
isaiah53-57
·3 years agoAnother great post in this thread!
FYI - Just read that ebay only had a 3.5% market share in 2022 - I believe its time to go shopping and let the apologists continue to pay for the sinking ship...
siamjane8
·3 years agoEbay is the shortest term thinking company I know. They will do anything and everything for the fastest quickest cash grab possible whether or not it hurts sellers/buyers/or ebay in the long run.
These promoted listings are destroying the buyer and seller experience and driving our customers aaway or worse yet to bad sellers that are willing to give ebay promoted fees- even if they provide a substandard buying experience.
What puzzles me is that its is such a woke/ left leaning company in almost everything..... but when it comes to profit- they sell their soul for a dollar lol...... very hypocritical if you ask me.
isaiah53-57
·3 years agoBRAVO!
To your concise and colorfully expressed opinions!
miyasamaco
·3 years agoAbsolutely nothing about eBay gives me the impression that they are woke or left leaning. All I've seen is a bunch of corporate fools squeezing blood out of pennies. Their goon squad tactics against the Steiners prove they are anything but woke.
joliztoyco
·3 years agoFunny how the term "woke" has become what the right thinks is an insult.
Hardly.
Lately we have been referring to the right as the "unwoke".
Suits 'em to a tee.....
turnpiketreasures1
·3 years agoI don't think it has anything to do with being woke. Name me a company these days that isn't left leaning. They are simply trying to sell at any cost to keep their stockholders happy. When they find something doesn't work, they'll not do it anymore. I think companies right now are simply trying everything to keep their profits high, and I can see that showcasing like items in search is probably a win for them. They don't see sellers as anything more than what the CEO of Etsy calls churn. Doesn't matter to Ebay who sells it, as long as it sells.
coolections
·3 years agoThat just means the seller has enough money to pay an ad rate. No one told you that you had to click the ad. You searched the seller's original item so you can decide to buy it or not right from that page. Hit the back button next time.
s.scharmu0
·3 years agoHi!
"That just means the seller has enough money to pay an ad rate." CORRECTION: It means people want to pay fror an add. There are many out there who have enough money, myself included, however we decide not to waste our money on adds😊🦃
ladyjade77
·3 years agoHey though, the seller may only have sold 5 items, but you gotta start somewhere. I've only been selling on Ebay for about 2 years. I do have a little starter store subscription, but I'm a casual seller at best. I promote some of my listings. It seems like most of the time my items are invisible if I don't do that. I wish I didn't have to.