ebay not following their own policy regarding seller protections
sorry this is a long one .....so i've received three negatives in the last two weeks after years of having 100% positive...lets start with this latest one i received yesterday because the buyer hasn't received his item..no contact..never let me know there was an issue..no case opened... just right to a negative...i then checked feedback left for others and he's left 7 negatives for others over this same issue.....ebay clearly states right here in announcements that they are aware of shipping delays, and that they would protect us which i didn't believe because they have dropped the ball lately on our so called protections....i reached out to usps and they stated that they closed 16 hubs in georgia and have been combining them into 1 huge hub...so its a complete disaster and nightmare right now..but they are working on tracking down the package and that they will get everything moving again shortly ...meanwhile ebay has this on the board dated 4/10. I chose to give them the benefit of the doubt and i called them and they stated they would remove it under this known issue ...of course i wake up to a denial with an answer that has nothing to do with the reason for request for removal...once again we have ebay stating that they are going to do something and they fail to do it......moving on ....the other photos Ive included is their own policy that states what the "top rated seller protections" have been since they implemented them in 2018...even with providing this, they allowed the negative to remain after i followed everything in the policy and qualified.... this one didn't come off when it should have automatically because it malfunctioned just like anything else on the site... in the past when the system did not work, id simply call and they verified that i qualified and removed it...now i keep being told that i have to offer free returns in order to qualify for "top rated seller protections" when that is false.....the fact is, that the first bout of seller protections that were implemented required free returns. In 2018 (at the last real ebay open in las vegas) they implemented "top rated seller protections" which stated, that as long as we were top rated, accepted returns, and did everything required that we now would receive these benefits as well. Lately, for whatever reason, we are being told by new ebay reps, that this only applies when free returns are offered and they seem to have no knowledge of the top rated seller policy I just described...they are mixing up top rated seller protections with the protections for above standard and others.....i have copied and emailed them their own policy where it clearly states what is required for top rated seller benefits which i also included below. Nowhere under this policy does it state that i have to offer free returns....i also then sent them a copy of the protections for others and above standard abusive buyer policy which shows i would only have to offer free returns if im above standard not top rated... they are mixing up the two. Once I show them this, I am thanked and told that they are going to give it a second look ...and then they stop responding and disappear. The system has gotten beyond stupid... in this same negative that should have been removed, the buyer went on to call me names and ebay also saw that they were clearly lying because none of the things stated in the feedback rant are true at all... however they still did nothing ...i got some ridiculous response something like 'we understand he called you names and that he told untruths but hes not violating policy"....not those exact words .....I want to know why you state you are going to do all of these things to protect your sellers from abusive buyers when you know very well thats not true at all. You have policies that you don't follow, however if any of us try that same thing we are suspended or kicked off the platform. My simple solution...just do what you say you are going to do...not sure what is so hard about that.
broto_64
·2 years agoThere is one thing I would change if I were in your shoes, and that is to reply more carefully to those feedbacks. While your replies are not terrible they do point fingers, if I may suggest something more along the lines of:
"I am very sorry this transaction did not go as expected, please contact us immediately so we can resolve this issue in your favor."
The most important reason for replies to be so worded is that most buyers who left that negative do not return to read it, but future buyers who look through your feedback will see that here is a seller who has done everything they can to resolve an issue... And this is where the blame game is detrimental, as it shows a failure to accept responsibility (even if it isn't your fault, buyers don't have much sympathy in that regard anyway).
Should a buyer actually contact you that would be a good time to haggle for a revision request as well but in most cases those buyers never will contact you, they have left their feedback and that is almost always the end of it from their side. The real "bonus" of a reply to negative feedback is to shine in front of future buyers looking through our feedback.
dbfolks166mt
·2 years agoParagraphs are your friend.
fern*wood
·2 years agoBased on the plethora of unhappy sellers over the newish lack of removing bad feedback, it is more important than ever for sellers to practice writing good follow-ups for their future buyers. That time may be better spent now than wasting time with ebay reps and policies that may or may not now be valid.
meme6253
·2 years agoSeller protection I believe to be a thing of the past, Very Unfortunately!!
mam98031
·2 years agoNo true. While I'm confident that some sellers do not get it when they think they should, often times it is because the seller doesn't understand the policies or didn't even bother to do the research.
Ebay has excellent Seller Protection on INRs. INADs are far more complicated and on a case by case basis as the details are important to the outcome as well as how the seller handles it.
dhbookds
·2 years agoOne other thought............Ebay warned us about the possible USPS delays........if we (I'm not), are experiencing delays, perhaps a good idea to put warnings in descriptions or after sale emails to buyers.........being proactive may stop at least some questions/negs..........
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agoalso good idea...but i have 7,000 plus listings ......i feel faint just think about the possibility of adding tht to each one...i could bulk edit i guess but i find that when you bulk edit and add things to the description box it never quite comes out right
buyselljack2016
·2 years agoOn my listings in the "condition section" I have "carriers are experiencing some delays -please be patient with eBay's estimated delivery date"
That is what goes in my listings "condition". As may be warranted, some individually get additional cautionary info for the item on a limited basis.
"Condition" can be "bulk edited" to add such a statement.
Potential buyers/buyers see that without having to scroll on by the extensive nonsense (other listings) inserted in the middle of the listing to get down to the actual description.
There are some that don't get down there.
mam98031
·2 years agoHumm. But shipping delays due to USPS issues doesn't have anything to do with the condition of the product being sold. As a buyer, I'd likely never see that warning.
True it is something you can edit through the Bulk editor, but still I don't see how it is very effective in that spot of a listing.
buyselljack2016
·2 years agoWell, I don't care if it has anything to do with the condition of the item. It gets that point front and center to be seen before they even scroll on down. So, as a buyer, you would not see what is front and center right there in the condition box? Good to know.
Just a shot at the fact that the estimated date may not be the exact date.
Effective, as it has a better chance of being seen when right there at the beginning. YMMV
mam98031
·2 years agoI think that is a great idea, but one Ebay should do, not the seller. That for many sellers would be an enormous amount of work to place that in their description. You can only do that one by one. Very time consuming for many sellers.
But I really like your idea but with Ebay providing the warning on listings, not the sellers.
dhbookds
·2 years agoI doubt Ebay is going to do it, simply because not every seller is being affected........again......sellers, as individuals, need to be proactive...... I just scanned 200.......took less than 30 sec.... granted most were delivered, but I don't buy the "no time" excuse.....
And (another post), you haven't in the past had to check deliveries......but if you begin to have problems, I predict you will........
klhmdg
·2 years agoI could not read the whole wall of text either.
Break it up with paragraphs or just do bullet points.
You do understand that you are not speaking to eBay?
I always do as I say but I am not eBay and eBay is not here. This is a forum for buyers and sellers like yourself. We cannot change eBay policies or make CS be helpful.
I personally think FB should be done away with but eBay likes it and is even now allowing pictures. eBay doesnt listen to sellers.
Best of luck to you.
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agoyeah i think i know that...im venting because im **bleep** ......or i was **bleep**...its a new day and although im not jumping up and down im moving forward and kinda over it...i cant go through my life **bleep** off because ebay did this....its gonna happen again and again and to be **bleep** every waking moment of the day because of ebay ...not fun and not gonna get anywhere...and im not gonna allow anyone including ebay to have that kind of power over my life.....good day to you as well
mordecai8614
·2 years agoReceiving negative feedback is definitely a bummer, but it shouldn't make you feel "**bleep** every waking moment of the day". That's just not normal
fashunu4eeuh
·2 years ago“…My simple solution...just do what you say you are going to do...not sure what is so hard about that.â€
But it is hard now.
The quality of eBay’s customer service has deteriorated since Covid. They shut down their call centers during the pandemic. But once it was safe to go back to work, eBay never reestablished customer service to its pre-morbid functionality.
As a result, users can no longer rely on getting accurate advice and information from untrained, script-reading reps. Worse, they sometimes give ill-advised directions to unsuspecting sellers that can be damaging to their performance metrics/account standing.
The way things are now, eBay is making it more difficult for some sellers to get negatives removed, TRS or not. We hear the same concerns in the forums nearly daily now. These changes are apparently the direction the platform plans to head in, as you have experienced.
Currently, one of the few places to find highly-qualified customer service reps is thru eBay for Business Facebook page. Another is a online form one can submit for feedback removal, bypassing the need for any back-and-forth. Hopefully another poster will come along with that link. Out of curiosity, how have you been contacting eBay?
So sorry for your ordeal.
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agoi called and i also contacted fb for business...they use to be helpful before i was concierge so i went back to them when things started taking a turn...i want to have everything in writing whenever possible..because i find now that one person will tell you one thing and another will say something completely different about these policies...so i can easily go back and say hey....this rep said this at this time and now what you are saying contradicts that...little good it does...they just apologize say thank you...say they are gonna look into something and then vanish ...when u call back a week later giving them time to do what they said suddenly no one knows what you are talking about
mam98031
·2 years agoIf you have a Concierge, why in the world would you go to facebook. Your Concierge would be far more effective in chasing this issue.
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agoby the way all of the bleeps above that ebay put in were not swear words....it was the words p off....apparently thats offensive now? lol
mam98031
·2 years agoYou and I usually agree on most things @fashunu4eeuh , but this time we disagree a bit.
Sometimes Ebay members have memory lapses about what is accurate info and what isn't. "The quality of eBay’s customer service has deteriorated since Covid. They shut down their call centers during the pandemic. But once it was safe to go back to work, eBay never reestablished customer service to its pre-morbid functionality."
While CS did get real tricky the first several months or year of the Pandemic while Ebay scrambled to get hardware to employees at home and proper / secure internet connections, that was a real hardship on members needing help as it was very limited.
But CS before the Pandemic and after is about the same. We have always complained about the bad info coming out of many CSRs and causing harm to members for one reason or another. It is not a new situation since the Pandemic. It is a problem we have struggled with for a great many years.
IMHO it is why we get more and more members coming to the Community for help.
fashunu4eeuh
·2 years agoBeautifully said, @mam98031 .
It has become a rare quality, one you possess— to be able to respectfully disagree, without eroding the dignity of any concerned party.
If more posters employed such an approach, much good could be more effectively accomplished in the forum, especially where impassioned conflicting viewpoints exist.
mam98031
·2 years agoWow, not sure I deserve that, but thank you.
carlmarxx
·2 years agoI read the Negative feedbacks on shipping delays ,The weather issue claims aren't the problem for most part . It is the postmaster Gen Dejoys and his push to use small sorting centers that is the reason for the delays not act of god weather . Ebay has said the buyers can give any feedback they want because it is their opinion . As long as they don't violate the feedback policy . You make to ship Priority mail or UPS and FedEx full time .Since USPS is going keep having delivery delays.
mam98031
·2 years agoI apologize, but I'm an old broad and my eyes are what they use to be. I have great difficulty reading a wall of text, so I did not read your post beyond the first couple of lines.
Did Ebay determine these were false INADs? Did they close the INADs in your favor?
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agoi was told when talking to ebay for business that the one guy who first left me a negative that went on to call names and state false facts and actions that didnt happen was not like any buyer that they have seen before..that he was odd and i need to block him.....they also verified what i was saying about this guy leaving other feedback similar to what was said about me on others accounts...being accused of being a thief over 7.50 is lunacy....at any rate they dont ever tell you if they agree that something is a false inad...i simply report....accept the return ..make deductions if needed and it closes and these defects never go on my account..and before like i said any negatives were removed because you followed the top rated seller protections...in this case i reported him after he opened a return stating all of his false facts and told them to look into the pm he was sending....i refunded and closed the return and for once i did not force him to send it back to me...under the advisement of a rep on the phone who stated it would prob be in my best interest to just refund and close the return as the return label i provided would cause me to lose money..
mam98031
·2 years agoIt is clear that under the TRS protections, the FB should be removed. Through your other posts on this thread I learned you have a Concierge. IDK why you would go any other route except using your Concierge to resolve this issue.
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agobecause concierge isn't acting like concierge anymore either ....they don't even say concierge when they answer the phone now either...actually they did last month and i almost fell out of my chair from the shock..it had been months since they said it.....not sure how true it is or isnt but i heard they are doing away with that department too....again i can't confidently confirm or deny...everything is always top secret at ebay...everything is always a guess....if they were more transparent there wouldn't be such murkiness about important issues.......
mam98031
·2 years agoNow that is news to me. The only perk that some sellers had with a Concierge was to get a certain number of negative FB removed in a quarter. The only thing a seller needed to do was ask. That perk is retired, but the Concierge services should be the same, other than the FB point.
robbie31415
·2 years agoSo for your first screen shot, it doesn't say they will remove feedback. They will do things 'as needed'. No guarentee. The negative feedback by the buyer is their experience and isn't a violation of policy.
The false INAD requires reporting and for eBay to determine it was actually a false INAD. If they don't then the feedback sticks. The CS reps you speak to could lie and tell you what you want to hear, but the internal team doesn't feel there is enough evidence to support a false INAD.
The only one that you showed where it would happen is with the Abusive buyer/TRS altered condition policy. This needs to be applied before a return gets escalated to a case, you must follow the steps appropriately or the protection wont be applied.
The easiest way to get feedback protections is by offering free returns.
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agoive been in this program since it was implemented in 2018 and it was always the case...an yes it does say in the policy that feedback will be removed and it was always removed as long as i provided the return and refunded regardless of the reason....and especially in the false inad case where it clearly states it here...they have changed some of the language to these policies recently but its still there....doesn't say anything about there's no guarantees...and what happened was not that they didn't determine it wasnt a false inad in my case so not sure where you are getting that .............please dont tell me what my experience has been with the policy and the program because what you stated in not the case...for 6 years this is what they have always done until a few months ago when they dropped the ball for everyone. Again i do not have to offer free returns under the top rated seller program to get a feedback removed for false inads.... i would only have to do that if i was above standard or under protections for others...and before suggesting that ebay is going follow the policy when free returns are given you should think again ..there are tons of sellers who offer this and they are still not getting ebay to remove negatives under any circumstance lately.....and side note while the buyers experience is important it is not a real experience if the buyer lied to force a free return, damaged an item then open a return..its a lie not an experience.....asking ebay to follow their own policy is not to much to ask ...just like this policy that they will protect us because of shipping delays in an announcement on the board and then not doing it ...when i called i asked the rep in trust and safety what that meant about updating seller protections and she stated if we get a negative because of this or damaging metrics they would be removed...why would i get a negative over something that was out of my hands and known issues and be expected to be punished for it and it stand just because it was the buyers experience ..i mailed it when i should have and didnt even know the buyer didn't receive it until i got a negative
carlmarxx
·2 years agoDynasty Ebay isn't great at fighting false Snads do not wanting to deal with the 50 day dispute process.
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agohi carl,
im not sure what the 50 day dispute process is regarding inads...can you elaborate so that i understand 🙂
fashunu4eeuh
·2 years ago@dynastysfashionboutique wrote:
â€â€¦why would i get a negative over something that was out of my hands and known issues and be expected to be punished for it and it stand just because it was the buyers experience ..i mailed it when i should have and didnt even know the buyer didn't receive it until i got a negative.â€
The reason a seller sometimes gets hung out to dry is because eBay considers the carrier to be an agent of the seller, acting on the seller’s behalf. More importantly, eBay considers that a seller’s responsibility doesn’t conclude when the item is shipped, but only when it is delivered.
Until the moment the package arrives at its intended destination, the seller remains accountable to his/her buyer, including for matters occurring during transit.
dhbookds
·2 years agoAgree with the above.......but would add.......
ALL Mail order (not just ebay) is predicated on the buyer receiving the item.........without that guarantee.....why would any buyer use mail order?
You, as a seller, are given a very easy way to check that items are delivered in Ebay Seller Hub on the ordered/shipped page...... part of "preventative maintenance" for a seller is checking that site to be sure items are delivered and putting in mail questions to carriers when no delivery shows.
After that, there is always a debate among sellers as to what should be done.......contacting the buyer or not......and am not going to get into those weeds.......but the fact is, as a seller, you SHOULD be proactive enough to check the status of your packages so that you aren't surprised if one is not delivered.
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agoi can not go and check and make sure every package was delivered...sorry..there is not enough time in the day...i am stretched thin enough and can barely get my listings done .......most buyers including myself will usually reach out and say "hey wheres my stuff" if they didnt get it...in a nicer way usually depending on the day....i have no issue tracking down what happened to a package or giving a proper refund when needed...after all the item was 5.99..its not like a huge loss to just refund.... but why on earth would i get a negative over something when something simply could have been asked first..then if i ignored you or was a jerk then you give me the negative...my main issue here though is ebay saying they are going to do this or that and then not doing it...the agent in trust and safety told me that this negative would be removed because the memo meant that anything negative that happened as a result of these known shipping delays would be removed and as per usual lately ...nope....i wouldn't have such an issue with negatives if the algorithm did not slow traffic to your listings when you get these ....if im going to get a negative i want to get it because its something i deserved and my sales should suffer as a result...but stuff like this..blatant lies that are verified to be lies or stuff like closing 16 hubs and combining them and leaving packages to sit for days and weeks i shouldn't be getting punished for that...its not like my car broke down on the way to deliver the package and i simply threw my hands up in the air and threw the package in the dumpster and went home...anyway today is another day...lets hope its sunnier than yesterday
dhbookds
·2 years agoPerhaps the buyer didn't have the time or inclination to get into a discussion about a $5.99 item.......they don't know/care about what your neg means to you......... which is the reason we need to be proactive about stuff....because it does mean something to us..........
buyselljack2016
·2 years agoi can not go and check and make sure every package was delivered...sorry..there is not enough time in the day...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Seriously?
I am not the big seller that you are , but I cannot imagine that it would take more than 2-3 minutes a day scrolling down in the seller's hub (Manage all orders) to spot a status that looked out of line.
 
It's taking care of business.
Would take less time than contacting eBay CS, or posting here.
Beyond that................................. just reply calm and factually, move on with life without getting stressed over things that will happen no matter what you do.
mam98031
·2 years agoI'm with the OP. I do NOT check the tracking on every package I send for the rare occasion that one is having issues. I've been selling online here and elsewhere for over 25 years. It isn't anything I've ever done, nor will I be starting. It is a waste of my time.
But when a buyer contacts me that there is a problem. I'm all over it ASAP. I communicate with my buyer and keep them updated as I file a trace on the package and if that gets me now where, I file a Missing Mail Report. And if that doesn't work out, I refund the buyer in full.
mam98031
·2 years ago@robbie31415
You can see in the policy pages the OP posted that the TRS protections does not require free returns. Just 30 days or longer.
noja-27
·2 years agoThank you for pointing that out. It's essential to refer to eBay's policy pages for accurate information Regarding seller protections, as they may vary depending on the specific circumstances. In this case, TRS protections may indeed be available with a 30-day or longer return policy, without the requirement for free returns. Understanding these nuances can help sellers make informed decisions about their policies and practices on the platform.
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agothe policies can be very long and murky...hence why my post was so long...i dont want to say things without evidence to back it up...but the policys can be confusing...and theres so many many...i totally expect to find a breathing while listing on ebay policy somewhere lol
robbie31415
·2 years agoOnce Again you don't read what I said.
mam98031
·2 years agoIDK with this "once again" stuff since it isn't correct.
You stated in your post, the closing statement "The easiest way to get feedback protections is by offering free returns." And that is not a true statement. There isn't any added protection because you offer Free Returns.
Protections for Top Rated Sellers
Top Rated Sellers sellers are eligible for these protections when all the following criteria are met:
https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/seller-protections?id=4345
However there is a clause in Seller protection that reads as follows:
If a buyer reports that an item isn't as described
If the buyer submits a return request because an item isn't as described in the listing, we'll remove any related negative or neutral feedback if you offer free returns, accept the return, and give a refund.
https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/seller-protections?id=4345
Maybe that is what you were referring to, IDK. If so, I stand corrected.
robbie31415
·2 years agoYou don't read what I said. You should know very well once again.
You misquote, pull pieces out of context.
I never claimed anything the OP posted required free returns.
What I said is true. That doesn't mean what the OP posted required free returns.
This is like the 5th time. I called you out on it with the being able to respond to chargebacks.
There you did the same thing and doubled down on a bad position due to not actually reading and going off if pieces.
dynastysfashionboutique
OP2 years agoi realize that...i apologize...i was an angry very mad woman at the time...im sure you realize that that combination is never a good thing....all i wanted to do was fight at that time.....not fight you but at that moment just forget it....so many things were running through my mind that i couldnt get it all out the right way...so for that at least ill apologize ...at any rate today is a new day and im moving on....still annoyed but life is short and at the end of the day wrong or not ebay will be ebay...i cant change that.....ive had some positive experiences with the company...bought a house....had an office space at one time....but now things are getting very ugly...maybe its time to move on.....prob is..prob will.....not gonna quit but maybe its time to way downsize until i can leave if thats where its leading because if i don't like something i can always walk away....
mam98031
·2 years agoOh stop this is nonsense. I didn't pull anything out of Context as it was a one sentence paragraph.
This post shows how you feel compelled to try to create conflict between us and it simply is unwarranted and unnecessary. It come from a disagreement we had on another thread. It simply is not necessary.
YES, my post said that you were correct. But apparently that isn't enough for you for some reason. You just keep wanting to make it more than it is.
I have no idea what this means "This is like the 5th time. I called you out on it with the being able to respond to chargebacks." True on another thread on chargebacks we had some differences of opinion. But even on those I eventually saw your side and stated that I did and that I was mistaken on some point or points. But again that doesn't seem to have any impact on you. You continue to post stuff like you did above.
🤣 Oh good grief. Maybe you should read my post again !!!!
***************************************
Here is my entire post you are responding to:
IDK with this "once again" stuff since it isn't correct.
You stated in your post, the closing statement "The easiest way to get feedback protections is by offering free returns." And that is not a true statement. There isn't any added protection because you offer Free Returns.
Protections for Top Rated Sellers
Top Rated Sellers sellers are eligible for these protections when all the following criteria are met:
https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/seller-protections?id=4345
However there is a clause in Seller protection that reads as follows:
If a buyer reports that an item isn't as described
If the buyer submits a return request because an item isn't as described in the listing, we'll remove any related negative or neutral feedback if you offer free returns, accept the return, and give a refund.
https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/seller-protections?id=4345
Maybe that is what you were referring to, IDK. If so, I stand corrected.
It is my hope this allows you to see that I said you were correct and I gave the policies for ALL to see and to support your position.