Corporations now asking for disclosure of online eBay Selling business
I'm not sure if this is news or not... supposedly there's been lots of articles about people having multiple jobs making lots of money (and not working very hard at any of them from what I read).
At my work we have a "code of conduct" to fill out, it's pretty standard, how to deal with things like gifts, keeping information confidential, and making sure your family goes through the proper channels to do things if they are customers of ours.
New this year, they have said we have to disclose any:
1. Job working for another business
2. Owning your own business
3. Ad hoc online business (like eBay selling).
They did previously ask about working for somewhere else... but in 2008 when I was hired, I was told if it's not for one of their customers or in the same industry, they don't care. At some point a few years ago (like during COVID) they started to care and people who work as hairdressers on Saturdays had to disclose it. My supervisor knew of the online selling but told me I had to disclose it, that was 2 years ago. (So I did, I work for a brick and mortar store, and the items I sell are mostly for them).
What I'm interested in knowing about is why they think it's their business to get disclosure on sellers who have a part time eBay gig, or sell on FB MP, or the other e, or the River, or any of those, why does it matter? We're not allowed to do "other business" on our work computers or during work time, so if we're not doing that, why does it matter?
The way it was written it sounds as if even if you only make $25-50 a week from time to time, you still have to disclose you're doing it. They also expect you to disclose it later if you aren't doing it today, but start doing it before the next disclosure form comes out.
I'm only asking because if our company does it, surely many others are too. Would like some input from other people on the subject, since I'm sure it's come up in many online articles in the past couple of years, but this seems to be a new requirement since the COVID situation.
C.
soh.maryl
·2 years agoHow seriously have you pursued this with your company?
Like: "Just wondering . . . is there some new Labor Dept ruling that an employer has to know if his employees have another job?"
When I was employed at a local healthcare facility, there was at least one employee, a Radiologic Technologist, who managed both a Girl Scout troop and a birthday cake baking business while clocked in on her regular job. Her immediate supervisor didn't seem to know or maybe didn't care.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoI'm likely to find out tomorrow of some goings-on at the company that caused them to put this in their "code of conduct". Like they found out about people during COVID with not enough to do having two full time jobs that they did concurrently. The IT in charge person would know from evidence if people were using their company paid laptop to do another job, and he'd know if people were fired as a result (by having to cancel their network access).
I just know when I got hired it didn't matter as long as it wasn't actually a conflict of interest, and then sometime during COVID it became important to know about "other jobs", and this year they've modified the code of conflict to definite "other jobs" as including selling in online venues. Disclosing that on my form probably means someone will check to see if I accessed any said venues with my company laptop, and perhaps they're cleaning house and looking for a good reason to fire people.
I still say if I have some online side thing it's none of their business because it doesn't concern them (so long as I'm not using the resources at the office to do my online business). My immediate supervisor knows I sell online, so there's no point in trying to hide it, she reviews all the forms before they're submitted to HR.
C.
gloryglorygifts
·2 years agoI was in banking for all of my 35 year career and when this business started back in 2008, it was a fully functioning flea market business on weekends, but I had registered with the state to pay sales tax. I had to disclose that information to my employer as it was part of the employee/employer contract, which was an at will employer btw, meaning I could quit or they could fire me without cause. I was not allowed to conduct any business through our work computers. I could, however, do my thing with my lunch hour (which I was not paid for) and after hours. I just had to give them the details of my hours, my name and even my resale certificate number, so it was on record. As long as I wasn't in competition with them, they didn't care, they just needed it on record.
ebeths_eclectic_collectibles
·2 years agoPerhaps it really isn’t about selling on EBay or Amazon as it is about creating a level playing field for all of the companies employees. It could be a requirement that ensures every employee is treated exactly the same in regards to reporting.
What I find frustrating is when a low level worker say a stocker at target is never given more than part time employment and then told they are prohibited from doing similar work at another similar establishment.
ten_o_nine
·2 years agoI think there are too many cheaters that would do their own business on company's time, most rules get created because of abuse.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoI'm in the office tomorrow and the main IT guy is coming by for a chat... he'll fill me in on what was going on to make the change (from conflicts of interest, to other employment, to now ad hoc online retailing). He's aware of everyone who gets fired and why, and their laptop might have been the reason. I'm sure I will learn a lot.
C.
turtles-trading-post
·2 years agoI once worked for an evil company that officially barred additional employment. One of the guys I worked with was helping his son start a painting business, and would help him on the weekends. That caused a problem. The "official" reason in the company propaganda was that they felt you should use your time off to rest and be ready to work for them. Real reason was that they were pushing people way over 40 hours and into weekends. It wasn't uncommon to get that 3pm call on Friday to provide some difficult to produce nonsense report for first thing Monday morning! So bad that it's mentioned in employee reviews on Glassdoor!
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoIf my company was like that I'd let them fire me.
I had a minimum wage job once where I was called in on all my days off so much that I wouldn't even answer the phone on my days off (this was when we didn't have caller ID and no cell phones). They got mad at me for that, I said too bad, you want people who show up for work, hire people that are interested in working. You hire people who want to call in sick a lot, you can come and work their shift because I don't work on my days off. It caused a great deal of conflict, they wanted to get rid of me, I said "great I'll collect unemployment until I get a better job" (because if they let me go, that's what would happen). So they decided to NOT fire me so I couldn't get unemployment and search for better work. After they started forgetting to pay me for shifts (which happened 5 times in 6 months), I found another job and left. Three months later EVERYONE in the store got fired because of employee theft. Apparently when I wasn't there gossiping and ratting everyone out for breaking the rules, it became a free for all until corporate fired the entire store. I think it was justice (I mean after all, they did forget to pay me and the assistant manager was paying herself for shifts I worked).
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farmalljr
·2 years agoSince it's a Canadian issue, I have no idea. In the US, those questions would most likely never be asked of most workers. I can see the point if you are issued company equipment or have access to company tools/supplies. Theft is a real issue.
In the US, most everyone would not disclose it, as it's none of anyone's business what we do outside of work. I would find it offensive if an employer asked and I would not answer their questions about it. When I am on the clock, they can worry about what I am doing while on the clock. My time is mine, I can do whatever I wish.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoI got the actual form today, and it's not as bad as I thought it was when I originally made the post... the code of conduct I did talked about it and made it sound like a very intrusive questionnaire was coming, but in the end it was basically "what are you doing" (under their criteria of "working for someone else") and "what steps are you taking to ensure it doesn't conflict with your work duties here".
In my questionnaire I mentioned the brick and mortar store, and the "no conflict" answer was to disclose my work hours and confirm I had my own hardware and software needed to do my other job, so I would not be using company equipment to earn this extra income.
As for how most people won't disclose this stuff... I didn't disclose every detail, just the general gist of working in the evenings on my eBay stuff (for which I'm employed by the brick and mortar store, I referred to what I did was "selling items on online venues" without specifying the venue). I'll post on this thread again if it comes back that my answers weren't good enough, but I think it should be fine.
C.
gloryglorygifts
·2 years agoIt depends on which industry you are in, if they can ask you or not. Also, it's getting very hard to hide anything with the internet and social media. All one needs to do is google your name and they can find lots about you on Official USA, Check People, White Pages, Fast People Search, etc...... US employers can easily find out that you are lying.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoI never used my real name on social media (and the account I had is kind of inactive... no posts for almost 10 years). There was a background done on me for a special project at work and they found nada for online records.
Not everyone feels the need to broadcast their private life for the whole world to read.
C.
tex-421
·2 years agoThe reason they ask, is to know whether you have a "conflict of interest". In general if a company hires you full time, it needs to know whether there is something that stands in the way of you doing your job. For example, say you are hired as a senior manager and the expectation is that you will be working 24/7 (and you are paid for that level of commitment), but you also have an eBay store that is earning you $1k/month and requires you to spend at least 20 hours/week. That's a conflict, and the company needs to know about it.
But, seems to me, for a company to ask all employees regardless of level, to disclose any eBay selling activity, is serious overkill, if not flagrantly stupid. I can't even think of a good reason why Etsy or Amazon needs to ask that question, perhaps by its senior VPs, but not from average employees.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoI'm right at the bottom of the corporate ladder (and have stayed put for 16 years with no interest in moving up) specifically to avoid making the 24/7 commitment the VPs have to make. I can't let a job run my life, it's just a job, it's a means to an end. It pays my bills. And if I'm lucky, I like doing the job too (I do like my current job which is why I've stayed for 16 years, but I've had jobs I liked a lot less in the past).
There are people who are pretty close to the bottom who were working weekends and starting at 6am and working until 10pm to get the job done. We're all salaried. We're audited. If we don't get our work done in the timeline there can be serious financial consequences for the company (like the opposing party winning their lawsuit by default). A big mistake can cost us a million dollars. I don't want to be responsible for such consequences for the company so I stay at the bottom, and I go home and do something else when my work day is over.
My boss is one of those weekends/early morning/late night people and had health problems from having this sort of schedule going on for a few years. She doesn't overwork her team, even though she overworks herself, and we all appreciate her. This is one reason for staying put, she lets me leave when my work day is over and doesn't tell me I'm responsible for "getting it all done through any means necessary, even if it means staying late".
I had a friend who had a job as a reporter. They wanted him in the office from 8 to 5pm to be at his computer doing his writing, and he was allowed to leave his desk during the day to cover daytime stuff. He was expected to cover evening and weekend events and show up with his camera to take pictures of someone in town being arrested. I wrote those hours on his timesheet and got a reprimand for working too much overtime. So he stopped doing the evening/weekend stuff and kept to the 40 hours he was told to work. Then he got a reprimand for missing covering things. He said "how do you expect me to work all those hours if I can't bill any overtime?" The boss said "I don't care what you do, no overtime and get your job done."
C.
simba6
·2 years agoThey often feel any other work will only tire you out and make you less effective at their job.
Wait until they find out about bronies........
rileydone
·2 years agoBronies...I just had to Google it. Sorry that I did, now I can't get those images out of my head!
Learn something new here almost everyday.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoI have lots to say against that statement. Such as "if you feel so strongly about me holding down two jobs then pay me a livable wage". I'm not poor by any means, and I don't work for minimum wage. But due to expenses I have I need to supplement my income with something. If I do a good job at that, then I can afford extras too.
I'm sure I could go out anywhere and find work, so I don't worry too much about what my employer is or isn't doing. I just found it interesting that this year they're asking about ad hoc online business income, which is kind of where eBay selling fits in for most of us.
C.
simba6
·2 years agoYou think that's bad......Many now hold you to an NDA and you can't work in the same field for five year upon leaving them.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoWe've signed NDAs for working on specific projects (which means also don't talk to other people in the company about it).
If they were doing NDAs for the same field that would be really terrible because tons of people left our company to go work for our competition. (And there's nothing we could do about it... they left because they were tired of being overworked).
C.
retro_entertainment_collectibles
·2 years agoCould by much anything folks mentioned and more.
I read an article short time back towards what @powell-memorabilia said about retail theft and tell ya' what its not just "it fell out the back door" but literally happening at the registers. For example customer has question about an item brought to the register, say an electronic. Call that dept up comes an associate answer the questions, whilst another person distracts the cashier and off they go with the item. The associate saying, "Oh I thought it was paid for."
It was amazing some of the theft scams happening in retail. As I said in another thread went to Walmart few weeks back get a few Chicken Pot Pies. Figured as long I was there I'd get a pack of underwear only to find it locked away as if it were Solomon's Gold. I mean the entire isle like the Fort Knox of men's underwear!
So an associate opens it and I choose my treasure toss it in the shopping cart only for this female associate to grab it back out as if I were going to run off with the Crown Jewels. Yeah, I was shocked alright only to be told it'd be waiting for me at a numbered terminal checkout.
With all the horse-hockey going on in theft on all sides the equations I'd not at all be surprised if a year from now a Walmart associate is going to want to sniff my shoes to make sure they are not hot off the shelf.
I work for a very large corporation, and we are only required to disclose business interests or personal relationships that would be a conflict of interest, or a potential conflict of interest.
I can absolutely see why a brick and mortar retail store would want to know who is selling on eBay. Employee theft is a big thing, and if things come up missing, they should look on eBay to see if anyone is selling them.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoThe Brick and Mortar store is the other job that my corporation (that I work for) wants to know about. I sell on eBay for the brick and mortar store, he knows I have some of my own items, he also can log into my eBay account and look at what's going on if necessary (it's a business account registered to my business name, I work for the B&M store on contract).
I have a full time job working in the legal department of a corporation, and they're the ones who want to know about eBay selling, and FB selling, and fruit stand selling, and all that.
C.
valueaddedresource
·2 years ago@sin-n-dex is this something that is only in the company code of conduct or other internal policies or is it
part of their HR/payroll/tax obligations?
The IRS made significant changes to the W4 form (used to determine withholding) in 2020, which would line up with your timeline, and the most significant changes had to do with requirements to list side gigs and other employment/sources of income to "improve the accuracy of withholding."
https://www.paychex.com/articles/payroll-taxes/2020-w4-changes
What Other Income Must be Accounted For?
This step is the most significant change from previous W-4s, and it calls for employees to account for money earned from other jobs, as well as a spouse’s salary. This step will enable an employee to get the most accurate amount to withhold, and there are several options to take.
Employees should only do one of the options, which include using the IRS Withholding Estimator (most accurate) or the Multiple Jobs Worksheet (roughly accurate). Self-employed individuals also should use the estimator
The employees who would complete this step include those who hold more than one job at a time or are married and filing jointly (and the spouse works). The filer would then complete steps 3 to 4(b), and to get the most accurate withholding it should be done for the highest-paying job.
More info:
https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/improved-tax-withholding-estimator-helps-workers-target-the-refund-they-want-shows-how-to-fill-out-new-2020-w-4
https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/faqs-on-the-2020-form-w-4
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoI'm in Canada, so the above doesn't apply. One of the rules that came out of COVID is that we were not allowed to leave Canada with work property and do our jobs from outside of Canada (including the US), and THAT was tax related and related to work visas and such.
They didn't ask me how much I make at my other gig, but I actually haven't seen this year's form yet. I did the code of conduct and checked off the "something to disclose" box and was told I'd get an email with instructions (like a form), to fill out. If it varies from last year I'll come back and share, but last year they just wanted to know "what is it you do" and "how are you going to ensure it doesn't interfere with your work for us".
On my form I stated that I worked for a B&M store selling their goods, I put what hours I work on it, and stated I had my own laptop, software, printer, etc, to do my duties for the shop. (And it is mine, the shop will not provide equipment for my home, but they will lend a computer if I needed to borrow one for a while). That was the limit on what they asked, but I expect this year's form will be a bit different.
C.
msmaggie060
·2 years agoI wonder if it could also have to do with if you are injured or become ill at some point in your life. May have to do with the sickness and disability insurance plan that your company has.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoI thought of that. Back when I started at my company, going on disability is a rare thing... but now I work with an entire office of people who've made disability claims of some sort (and mental health is becoming the new disability claim for everyone). I've made two short claims, one for a broken foot, and another for a broken elbow. In both cases I couldn't drive myself to work, and this was before COVID when I couldn't work at home. Nowadays they would have me work at home if I'm able to sit at a desk in my house. I can get by typing with one hand to do a few of the jobs (but that was only of help once I could drive back to work, I had to be able to hold the steering wheel with my injured arm before I was allowed to drive, and where I live there is no public transit to work).
But that's in 16 years, for a grand total of 11 days missed work on a disability claim.
If someone has a side gig and makes a disability claim, the rules of the insurance provider is that you cannot "work for wage or profit" while being on the disability. They pay out our full salary for the first 10 weeks, and then it goes down to 70% indefinitely (as long as the claim is approved). So this could possibly by why they want to know about alternate income sources, to make sure that's not what you're doing while the claim is being paid out.
I've decided I'm going to go to part time hours as my health declines to avoid "rules" of what I can and can't do in my time off. If I'm part time, and I'm earning the money they pay me, I don't see what I'm doing on my own time as any of their business. If I get up and feel OK and want to do listings, I should be able to do that, but other days I'll be in bed all day. (For the record this is not a mental health issue, I actually have a chronic condition, but I have not missed very much work as a result and have not made a disability claim... If I have to make a disability claim, I won't be capable of any work anywhere).
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gloryglorygifts
·2 years agoNo, it doesn't. I started my business in Spring 2008 and got sick in early Winter 2009. The only thing that matters as far as sickness and disability is the company that is paying the benefit into it on your behalf. A side gig has nothing to do with the initial filing.
It becomes income after you are fully on disability with the government, after your short term disability with your employer is done with.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoThat might be a US rule regarding disability claims. It's possible in Canada it varies by company, but the company that does disability where I work has a rule that no "working for wage or profit while receiving salary continuation". If I get a disability claim (which is an eventually with my health problems), they will have to review to see if payouts after the start of the disability claim (for items sold before) create a payment withholding situation with income replacement. It goes without saying I won't be allowed to continue to sell while receiving funds from them, at least not without approval, which likely includes review of financial documents and bank statements.
C.
stainlessenginecovers
·2 years agoSeems they simply want it 'disclosed' because Many are 'full of beans' when it comes to what they REALLY do.
This way, they can 'research it themselves and determine if what you state is what you state.
Why can they do this?
Because they can as MOST jobs are Not Contracted and can 'end' at ANY moment.
reallynicestamps
·2 years agoBecause they can as MOST jobs are Not Contracted and can 'end' at ANY moment.
Most US states are "at will " employment.
So any company can fire any employee at any time without notice or severance.
Canadian law is different.
I agree that it is likely that employers realized that "work from home" employees could in fact be holding down two jobs in the time they took to do one in the office.
Because travel, sick days, coffee gossip, chit chat, and those clandestine Candy Crunch or solitaire games because the efficient employee had completed all her tasks and covered for Fred-who-is-a-bit dim's work ,too.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoI think there's severance in Canada, but I don't know what the rules for this are... it's never come up. Any time I've been let go I've been within probation period, but generally speaking I quit my jobs, not the other way around.
At our office we're busy and have enough to do there's no time to do a "second job", even from home. When we're done our tasks we help out other people on theirs, when we're too busy someone helps us. Basically the whole team is cross trained on all the things we do as a group.
C.
postcardcountry
·2 years agoIt may go back to COVID days, when a lot of people starting working from home.
Some found they could do 2 full time jobs, 8-5, working from home. One company didn't know about the other company. There were several articles on how to do it.
I think what has come out of it is not so much nosiness as ensuring they are getting the hours of work they are paying for.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoI think that's the reason they're asking. I know when I was hired if it wasn't a conflict of interest (I was selling jewellery at a local market, they didn't care about that and I didn't have to disclose that). I was told the reason they want to know who you work for is if the company is a customer. They also want to know if you're related or dating anyone in the company (there are lots of family members that work in our offices, it's actually very common... I'm one of the few people that didn't get a referral from a family member, I went in as a temp and got hired). I kind of get that, they don't want family members working together on the same projects.
But this year they were very specific that eBay selling counts as something that needs to be disclosed. Last year they just asked generally speaking if there was something to disclose (and last year I was told by my supervisor to write down the name of the shop I work for).
C.
1786davycrockett
·2 years ago@sin-n-dex
In 1987, I was hired by a very paranoid and stingy retailer, who required all his employees to declare their other employers (if any), in order to determine whether there might be conflicts of interest. Since his store carried a wide assortment of items, he wanted to ensure that his employees were not using the company discount (or out and out theft) to re-sell similar products through another employer.
So that pre-dates COVID by over 30 years.
When I began selling on eBay in 2011, I informed my (newer) employer (a national retail book seller chain) of my intentions, just to confirm that they were aware that I would be selling primarily old, out-of-print books and magazines. I even showed off my dinky little eBay site from that time, so that they could see for themselves that my items were definitely not competing with the newer books which my employer was selling -- and they were quite satisfied that I was not working against the company's interest.
So this doesn't seem to be a "new" intrusion into the personal lives of employees (brought upon us by COVID), but rather an extension of what has been going on for many years, in other fields of employment.
And, with more and more folks working from home since the first outbreak of COVID, I suspect that it will simply grow more intrusive.
And we thought that 1984 was thirty years behind us. . ..
oldwestcoins
·2 years agoYeah, I would disagree. If I am NOT on the clock for the company I work for, it is none of their business. They don't own me on my time. That's an invasion of privacy. An eBay business? Big deal for any company or even the Feds. I worked for the Federal Gov't for over 33 years. I was by the book while on their time, but they didn't own me on my time.
fashunu4eeuh
·2 years agoThe above poster works for a city government so there may be some basis for needing the data. But a corporation? That seems more like an invasion of privacy. Curious what others have to say. Thanks for posting @sin-n-dex —haven't heard of this.
The only thing that comes to mind about the purpose of such a demand is the business is trying to keep a handle on those who may be using company resources for personal gain, or theft of company-owned property ending up on online marketplaces.
I know my spouse’s company regularly examined online selling sites for evidence of company-branded goods. (I know of a couple of employees who were let go for selling company-provided iPads on eBay.)
luckythewinner
·2 years agoThe only thing that comes to mind about the purpose of such a demand is the business is trying to keep a handle on those who may be using company resources for personal gain, or theft of company-owned property ending up on online marketplaces.
{snip}
(I know of a couple of employees who were let go for selling company-provided iPads on eBay
So it probably didn't just "come to mind", because you have direct knowledge of a real-world situation that explains why a company might do something like that. 🤣
It is also legal for a company to put a clause in an employment contract that prevents you from having a second job.
mtgraves7984
·2 years ago@sin-n-dex
At my work we have a "code of conduct" to fill out, it's pretty standard, how to deal with things like gifts, keeping information confidential, and making sure your family goes through the proper channels to do things if they are customers of ours.
I've worked in many fields (Sales/Communications/For-Profit Fundraising/Public Relations/TV Broadcast) and may have filled out such a form upon hire, but not annually.
I'm only asking because if our company does it, surely many others are too.
I'm leaning that either 1) your work and my work must be very different - or- 2) it's just us good ol' boys in Nashville. 😉
68barbie
·2 years agoI work for a municipal government and we are required to disclose all outside income. They are primarily looking for things that could present a conflict of interest but I dutifully declare sales from online marketplaces. We also have to attest we are not using city property to generate this extra income.
-C
toyhutt
·2 years agoI've been selling online since 2008 and my first two years of doing eBay/Amazon, I worked for the Dept of Defense (retired 25 yrs). I had to disclose that I was selling online & that I wouldn't use any Gov time or computers to do so while on the DOD job. This was 2008-2010.
yuzuha
·2 years agoYeah, that's standard and always has been. My father works as a contractor for the government sometimes and he's not allowed to do any sort of other work while on the clock for the government.
sin-n-dex
OP2 years agoWe're not either (or to use our work computer at home to do our personal stuff). Reading the news is the limit of personal stuff done on my work computer (and that's allowed because we need to read the news sometimes to stay informed).
Ironically at the B&M store, since I work on commission, I can literally do whatever I want in the store, as long as it doesn't disrupt the others from doing their work. I have to set a good example, so I do, by not taking lots of breaks and staying on whatever task I'm doing for the day. It's the legal dept corporation job that wants to know all my business about other income sources.
And for the record, I have 45 vacation days a year, so I do have time to go into the B&M store for the day and work, without being on my company's time.
C.