Buyer opened a dispute through financial institution
I sold brand new Tory Burch shoes. Buyer stated that is worn. And provided a side of the shoes, where leather is not completely smooth. Stated is was worn. There is no signs of wear on sole, there is no signs of wear on top of the shoes, no creases. If she would open a return through Ebay, I will accept it it. It fact I sold this shoes on $100 less than I bought. She opened a dispute through financial institution . I contacted to Ebay and they said, she will get a refund and will keep the boots. Is there anything I can do?
98 comments
seastar2010
OP11 months agoHello again! If anyone wants to know the outcome of this dispute. I won the dispute, without any appeal.The Buyer's payment institution sided with me. There were any evidence, that shoes were used. I uploaded a lot of photos of this boots. She didn't any... Because the statement was false.
mam98031
·11 months ago@seastar2010
That is excellent news and THANK YOU for coming back and telling us. Congratulations, not many sellers get this outcome !!!!!
soh.maryl
·1 year agoEven if she had actually opened an item not as described case with eBay, you would still have had to send her a prepaid return label and to refund in full when you received the returned item.
The fact that you sold these shoes for $100 less that you paid for them has no relevance in this situation.
seastar2010
OP1 year agoI guess you didn't read why I sold it for less. Don't worry I don't need you relevance. A lot of good people gave me a good advice already.
kibble-net
·1 year agoYou need tracking information to resolve the dispute. If your item is under $750, delivery confirmation is sufficient. If it's $750 or more, you need a signature too.
Without this proof of delivery, you will lose the chargeback. With it, ebay has you covered. I've had this happen several times. Customers conveniently "forget" about their purchase and call their bank. It stinks that they still get the money back and get to keep the item, but at least we aren't out the sale price thanks to seller protection.
albertabrightalberta
·1 year agoDid you read the OP or the rest of the thread?
This case isn't for non-receipt. It's for NAD (not as described) and there's no ebay seller protection for NAD.
Responding to a chargeback with a tracking number showing delivery won't help @seastar2010 in a NAD claim.
seastar2010
OP1 year agoShe didn't upload any evidence, what she is saying, not even single picture. After this, can I go to small court, in fact, this is a lie and theft.
le-5262
·1 year agoI had a family member tell me they initiated a chargeback
because that's what they thought they were supposed to do.
The business, thankfully, reached out and walked them through a refund
and they were able to cancel the chargeback.
Where do you stand with your customer at this point?
You say that they claim the shoes are worn...
I think right at that point I would have explained the refund policy and offered to initiate the refund.
As a customer...
if I tried to tell someone I was displeased
I would probably start spirally if they started "arguing" with me.
dariudaudery_0
·1 year agoYou can win or you can loose.
Ebay will sometimes cover your loss, really depends on the situation.
eh-919031
·1 year agoThat’s such a frustrating situation — especially since you were willing to accept a normal return if it had gone through eBay. Unfortunately, when a buyer goes straight to their financial institution, eBay has very little control over the outcome. Most of the time, the bank sides with the buyer and issues a chargeback, which is why eBay told you she’ll likely keep both the shoes and the refund.
The only thing you can really do now is make sure you submit all your evidence to eBay for the case — clear photos of the shoes showing they’re unworn, your original listing, and any messages between you and the buyer. eBay can sometimes appeal the chargeback decision on your behalf, but it’s not guaranteed.
For the future, you might want to block this buyer and consider using signature confirmation for higher-value items to have a little more protection if disputes come up.
gurlcat
·1 year agoNo, they're just saying that now, in this post. The item literally said "Seller does not accept returns."
seastar2010
OP1 year agoI sent to Buyer message-why she opened dispute. She could simply open a return request and I would accept it. I mentioned, she can do it now, she doesn't need to pay for the shipping label. This way she will receive her funds much faster. She answered-she is not going to do that!!!
bonjourami
·1 year agoShe cant open a return request since she has gone to her cc.
seastar2010
OP1 year agoShe can cancel the dispute and open a return. Isn't it? I called to Ebay, they said she could do it.
gurlcat
·1 year agoThey told you something that is simply untrue, whether they knowingly lied to get you off the phone, or honestly but wrongly believed it.
The reliability of what the low-paid overseas eBay phone reps will tell you is as good as a Magic 8 Ball. At best. Keep reading posts here, and you will see an endless stream of tragic stories where people did what a phone rep advised them to, and it was actually the opposite of what would work. The next time you have a problem, come HERE and ask, before you do any action whatsoever, even reply to a buyer's message.
seastar2010
OP1 year agoThat is why I am here. Asking for help and the best advice.
jonathanbrightlight
·1 year agoI don’t believe that would be possible, no. Once the buyer goes to their card issuer for a chargeback, all eBay returns or claims are no longer an option.
lonebuck-books
·1 year agoOnce the CC dispute happens, she can't open a return request. Because you had it listed as no returns the buyer had limited choices other than file a CC dispute or a not as described claim through eBay. My suggestion, take it or leave it, is to go through your listings and change your return policy on them. No returns doesn't mean no refunds and no returns forces buyers to get their money back in a way that damages your account the most. It simply isn't worth it.
Oh, I looked at the listing for these boots (nice!) and one suggestion. In your description you have that you bought them at toriburch.com. At some point the eBay bot's will catch this and give you a policy violation warning. They will see this as trying to divert a sale off site. Don't put links to other sites in your listings. eBay really doesn't like that!
albertabrightalberta
·1 year agoWhether the seller has a return policy or not, the option to request a return is there!! The buyer still has the ability to request a return.
If it's a remorse request, the seller can decline but the option IS there to make the request. And often, sellers with no return policies DO accept return requests.
gurlcat
·1 year ago@lonebuck-books acknowledged that in that quote that there is a way to return even with a No Returns policy- "or a not as described claim through eBay."
But the more important point is that even though we experienced sellers know that, a ton of buyers don't, so when they see 'no returns' they THINK "Oh no, I can't return this!" Then they post about it on social media or tell their friends or whatever, and are told, "Girl, just contact your bank and tell them to get you a refund. You don't even have to return it."
And lo and behold, they're right, because eBay cannot intervene and stop the chargeback to insist the seller be allowed to get the item back before issuing the refund, even though the buyer technically could have done an INAD.
albertabrightalberta
·1 year ago@gurlcat
What I used to do may help sellers who want to retain their "no return" policy but still allow buyers to option to request a return.
I've had a return policy for several years but prior to that, I was well aware that whether they were honest or lying, when buyers filed a NAD claims, I had to issue refunds, either with or without returns.
But for remorse returns, I knew I wasn't obligated so I put this statement in my listings and it seemed to help with honest remorse buyers.
"Although I don't have a return policy, I never want my buyers to feel obligated to keep something they don't want or like. As such, I will gladly accept your return request with the buyer paying return shipping. As long as the item is returned in the same condition as received, you will get a full refund of your purchase price."
I never had a buyer question it and can count on a couple of fingers the number of false NADs I received.
gurlcat
·1 year agoMay I ask why you switched to having a return policy?
seastar2010
OP1 year agoExactly, I always accepted all returns , if buyer asked. And paid for the shipping. She didn't ask.
mam98031
·1 year agoYou need to understand, with a No return policy, the buyer may figure, why contact you because you have a no return policy. And the buyer isn't aware that they can still actually return the item or get a refund from you. Not all buyers know how the policy works on Ebay. So the buyer takes you at your word that you don't take returns and files a dispute / Chargeback.
seastar2010
OP1 year agoMany of you said, that is my fault. I don’t have a return policy. Recently I’ve sold 4 bottles of travel size perfume. The return policy was-30 days and the Seller pays for the return label. I received complaint from one Buyer, that she thinks the smell is different and she has the same parfum, but this one is different. I mentioned that she can return it and I pay for the shipping back. No, she continued, she will go to Neiman Marcus store and let then to test it. Is Neiman Marcus authorized store for eBay? I just issued her a refund and I asked if refund was correct? And she can keep it. Don't need to return.Than I sent another message if refund was correct. She never contacted me again.2 other buyers were happy with the purchases. How is the same product be different for 1 and just fine for another 2? I think return policy is not the issue. Who purchase from you is the issue. Scammer or honest person. Even there is return policy-no returns, buyer still can return if he/she will open a case- INAD. This person,who decided to steal my boots from me on eBay for 7 years . I am sure she knows what she is doing.
mam98031
·1 year agoThe reason that a buyer can NOT open any kind of claim on Ebay after a Chargeback dispute is filed is because Ebay won't allow it. It has nothing to do with what the seller's return policy is. It is simply Ebay doesn't allow the double dipping so to speak .
seastar2010
OP1 year agoGood suggestion. I just wanted to say this is authentic boots and I have a receipt from toryburch.com.
mam98031
·1 year agoYou don't need to put the website extension on there. That can get the bots to notice your listing in a bad way. It is unnecessary to do that anyway.
lonebuck-books
·1 year agoThe problem is the seller had these as a 'no returns' listing. It doesn't matter if they were willing to accept a return if asked, the listing was a no returns listing which gives the buyer limited options if they aren't happy.
I really wish eBay would just eliminate the no returns option for sellers. It is clearly not enforced and consumer protection laws favor buyers anyways so the no returns statement has no teeth anyways.
One last thing, if the seller listed them as new, they have to be new. If you bought them for yourself, tried them on and walked around your living room in them and then decided you didn't want them, that is not new. New means new. Un-opened, un-worn, un-used. When you sell a $250 pair of boots for $160, buyers will be wary that they aren't actually going to show up as new. They might be opened, factory seconds, unwanted gifts etc. A crafty buyer will look for this sort of thing to scam a seller because all they have to do is claim they weren't actually new and the seller will lose. If that seller has no returns on it, that makes it even better for a scammer because now they can go to the CC company where they will win 99% of the time.
reallynicestamps
·1 year agoI really wish eBay would just eliminate the no returns option for sellers.
LITERACY IS THE PROBLEM not the policy.
No Returns does not mean No Refunds.
They are not even spelled the same.
If poor packaging results in a glass vase arriving in shards, should the seller be forced to pay to have the (dangerous ) trash returned before refunding?
If the cost of tracked return shipping is higher than the value of the item, should the seller be forced to pay for return shipping?
Returns are an avoidable cost.
There are circumstances (used cosmetics, intimate wear) where No Returns may even be the law, not just a policy.
if the seller listed them as new, they have to be new.
I agree with this.
gurlcat
·1 year ago(Just on that last note, it's against eBay policy to resell used cosmetics and underwear, but not against the law; the only thing that's illegal to return is counterfeit currency -but your point is valid about the seller having no eBay-specific use for some items after they're used).
And your overall point is valid, but I agree with @lonebuck-books that the system is flawed in ways that profoundly confuse both sellers and buyers. In my opinion, the 3 return tiers are fine and make sense, but they are not intuitively LABELED. They all get misinterpreted, but 'No Returns' is the worst of all. Any normal person sees that phrase and thinks it's the same as an "All Sales Final" sign in any brick and mortar store, as in, no refunds under any circumstances. It's actually so much more complicated than that, too complicated to spell out on every item listing, but it definitely shouldn't be stated as simply as "no returns" either.
albertabrightalberta
·1 year ago@lonebuck-books Please clarify: How does one shop for a pair of shoes and know whether they're going to fit? What if a previous customer tried them on, walked over to the mirror and decided in those 50 steps that they weren't comfortable? Are those shoes no longer new?
In your way of thinking, is it even possible to buy new shoes that fit your definition of new?
mam98031
·1 year agoThe return policies options are as follows.
With option number 1, No Returns the seller can completely deny taking a return for a Buyer's Remorse Return Request. Or if they want to, they can accept the return and have the buyer pay the return shipping. If the seller so chooses, they can withhold the original shipping if it was separately stated on the listing [not free shipping] when it is time to refund the buyer.
On options 2 & 3 the buyer is responsible for the return shipping on a Buyer's Remorse Return. Plus, if the seller so chooses, they can withhold the original shipping if it was separately stated on the listing [not free shipping] when it is time to refund the buyer. As of October 1st 2019, sellers that are TRS have some additional protections as well as they can issue partial refunds if they use options 4 or 5 as their return policy.
On options 4 & 5 above, they are also known as Free Returns. If a seller that has either of those policies, they will pay the return shipping even on a buyer's remorse return. A seller can withhold the original shipping value from the refund if the shipping was separately stated in the listing [not free shipping]. Also, Seller’s offering options 4 or 5 have the ability to do partial refunds in certain cases if the item arrives back damaged, missing something or in a condition less than what it was sent to the buyer in, see the policy for more details, the link is below. In the cases where a deduction in the refund is taken due to damage or other authorized reasons for a partial refund, Ebay will protect the seller from negative or neutral feedback.
ALL OPTIONS [1, 2, 3, 4 and 5] are required to process SNAD claims without exception. Even if they are improperly filed and should have been a Buyer’s Remorse claim.
All return policies by sellers must meet or exceed what is stated in the Money Back Guarantee Policy!
14 day return policies are allowed in certain categories: Jewelry & Watches, Collectibles & Art, Cameras & Photo and Medical, Mobility & Disability Equipment.
For those with Free Return and/or TRS members with 30 day return policies, there are some added protection benefits, one of which is the ability to do a discounted refund under certain conditions.
seastar2010
OP1 year agoBrand new shoes. Never even tried them on. Buyer doesn't know how much I paid. We don't have a winter, so I decided to sell them to at least get something. Time frame to return this shoes back to store was over.Now I got nothing. And I am expecting a negative feedback as well.
12345jamesstamps
·1 year agoI would do 'seller takes returns but buyer pays for return shipping'...this might work sometimes.
As far as a dispute with a credit card of a buyer...you are allowed to respond to your claim with 1000+ words in your dispute and post photos which the bank will see.
Writing a one sentence response and / or downloading tracking will not always work if ever.
Not sure how you responded to the claim.
I won my last dispute writing a 1000+ essay and downloading photos and won even without tracking of the items sold to the buyer.
mam98031
·1 year agoWith a Chargeback Dispute you are allowed to attach up to 5 documents / pictures. A year or so ago we were only able to attach one document, so this is a vast improvement
I usually also advise when a seller has more that 5 attachments they want to submit, Create a PDF or other acceptable kind and copy and paste all the stuff you want to submit with the Chargeback. It is especially good when there are messages going back and forth between the buyer and seller. And if they have already left feedback, you can include that as well and much more.
pickapaper
·1 year ago@12345jamesstamps wrote "As far as a dispute with a credit card of a buyer...you are allowed to respond to your claim with 1000+ words in your dispute and post photos which the bank will see.
Writing a one sentence response and / or downloading tracking will not always work if ever.
Not sure how you responded to the claim.
I won my last dispute writing a 1000+ essay and downloading photos and won even without tracking of the items sold to the buyer."
Thank you for this information. This is what I was looking for when I asked above if CC companies will look at documentation or proof submitted by a seller in a dispute. I didn't know if a seller could submit anything or if the CC company just took the word of the buyer.
inhawaii
·1 year agoIf the buyer says they are not as described, accept the return. Simple.
seastar2010
OP1 year agoShe never even asked for return. Of course , I would accept it.
gurlcat
·1 year agoThen why do all your listings say NO returns? Don't you get how a buyer who sees that can assume that doing a chargeback is their only option?
broto_64
·1 year agoI am unclear as to the actual turn of events. Did the buyer contact you first (and explain the shoes are used) BEFORE they opened their case with the financial institution?
If the buyer did contact you first, that is the time for the seller to ask the buyer return the item for a full refund.
Right then and there offer a refund upon return of the item, do NOT dispute what the buyer is saying, and it doesn't matter if the buyer asks to return...
As you may have inclination to believe at this point, it may be wise for you to consider using a "returns accepted" policy since we as sellers have to refund regardless if the buyer isn't happy.
Just my two cents.
tools*
·1 year agoOptions include walking away from eBay or suing the credit card thief in small claims court.
gurlcat
·1 year agoYeah, fix your remaining 94 listings. I look at all those "Seller does not accept returns" with my scammer goggles on ...... and I see tons of FREE STUFF!
reallynicestamps
·1 year ago@gurlcat @seastar2010
Absolutely.
We can have a No Returns policy.
But we cannot have a NO REFUNDS policy.
A No Returns policy means that you will abandon the item and Refund
In many circumstances. Note weasel words.
However, even with a No Returns policy, the seller can demand the return of the goods before refunding.
But refund we must.
broto_64
·1 year agoDemand no, request yes. Unless something has changed, in the case of an INAD (and a No Returns policy) the buyer can simply wait for the case to time out, then ask ebay to step in, and they will be issued a refund while ebay lets them keep their item. In most cases the buyers simply comply with the request, especially if they fail to realize that their refund does not hinge on the return of the item but again unless something has changed they don't actually have to.
It's in the dev
jonathanbrightlight
·1 year agoThat should only happen if the seller does not respond. If the seller issues a return shipping label and the buyer simply refuses to use it, eBay will rule in the seller's favor.
albertabrightalberta
·1 year agoRe red:
You are misunderstanding how it works.
The case will only time out if the seller doesn't respond. If the seller responds with a shipping label with which the buyer is to return the item, it won't time out against the seller.
If the buyer doesn't return the item by the deadline ebay states in the claim, the case will close in the seller's favor and the hold on the funds will be released.
gurlcat
·1 year agoThat's exactly what I thought too, but I am currently in an INAD return situation with a No Returns seller, and first of all I couldn't even get eBay to step in until 4 business days (not 3, and it was actually 6 calendar days). In the middle the seller had offered me a partial refund which I declined. I thought the whole thing would be over once the seller's time was up ..... but no, all that happened was eBay issued me a return label, presumably charged to the seller, but now I have to wait for the item to go all the way back to him, and I wouldn't be surprised if this guy stalls to issue the refund for however long that waiting period is nowadays.
The total time my money will have been tied up is about 3 weeks. Can you go to any bank and get an interest-free loan for 3 weeks? Of course not, but apparently you can on eBay!
tobaccocardyahoo
·1 year agoMany sellers do not head off the problem of the buyer getting to keep the disputed product by including in their response sent to Ebay which becomes their representation in the credit card dispute that they will accept the return of the item and refund.
It sounds like this pair of shoes was not first quality and new. It might have been a second or it might have been worn. In any case, I would have responded that I would accept the return and refund.
It is likely that any merchant will lose a quality of merchandise credit card dispute, with the odds being greater if they are an Ebay seller.
If you do not do all you can to minimize your losses no one else will do it for you.
gurlcat
·1 year agoWhat makes you think that?
seastar2010
OP1 year agoThis is Tory Burch the best quality boots, brand new which I bought for $260 and sold for $160.
pickapaper
·1 year ago@mam98031 and other posters:
I read all the time on here that credit card companies, if a charge back is filed, give the buyer a refund and allow them to keep the item. Is that always true? Do they ever ask for documentation or proof or do credit card companies just do like eBay does and assume the buyer is always right?
an-57470
·1 year ago@pickapaper
This is way too general.
Always true? No.
Usually true? Probably.
Sometimes true? Absolutely.
eBay will forward any evidence you provide to the card company, yes.
gurlcat
·1 year agoPaypal is a lot less lenient on their customers than the card companies (even if the buyer paid with a card via Paypal). What Paypal does is just require the buyer to return.
mam98031
·1 year agoNot sure why this is directed to me. I agree with you and have said so many times. There are reasons to battle a chargeback and in rare occasions a seller can win. Or at the very least get Ebay to invoke seller protection, which usually means Ebay refunds the Chargeback but the seller's funds are not used.
If a Chargeback is filed because the buyer doesn't recognize the charge or if they claim it hasn't been delivered [if it has actually been delivered]. Those are the two types that each seller should provide the appropriate info in effort to get the Chargeback closed in the Seller's favor.
I can't answer for how Credit card companies process disputes. I've never been on that end of a Chargeback. CCCs don't ask for documentation, that is completely up to the seller to give docs that may help their case to win the dispute.
pickapaper
·1 year ago@mam98031
I directed my post to you (and "others") because you had said in post #3 that we need to get Congress to change Consumer Protection Laws. That's all.
I've never been involved in a CC chargeback so all I know is what I read here. Just curious if a seller has a chance of fighting a chargeback and winning. You pretty much answered it when you said "on rare occasions a seller can win". But I have a feeling that is "very rare".
mam98031
·1 year agoIt really depends on the reason the buyer opens the Chargeback. It is extremely important to know and understand what it means. It is always told to the seller when they get the email from Ebay that informs the seller that a chargeback has been opened.
It is INAD Chargebacks that are extremely hard to win. It certainly has happened, but it is not an easy walk.
albertabrightalberta
·1 year agoIt's been many years and my memory of the incident isn't clear but I recall a case from years ago in which the buyer purchased an expensive designer handbag, used the bag on an international vacation and opened a chargeback for non-receipt. (This was prior to routine tracking availability at the time.)
The seller did extensive digging and found Facebook (or MySpace?) pictures showing the buyer using the bag on vacation.
Whether the seller won the chargeback or if she approached the buyer with her findings I can't recall. But the seller didn't lose the money.
todaysstyle
·1 year agoIt depends on how it is filed with the CC. If they say un-acceptable they automatically win the dispute, get a refund and get to keep the item. No, they do not have to prove anything or say what is "un-acceptable" about it. They just have to say the magical UNACCEPTABLE. This is a fact, they will automatically receive a refund and they keep the item. Another one is un-authorized transaction. Does not matter if you check the shipping address matches the CC address and the name matches the CC holder. They automatically get the refund and keep the item. Sad but true.
pickapaper
·1 year ago@todaysstyle
Thank you. I knew about the unauthorized or "does not recognize" and the INR chargebacks, but I didn't know about the chargebacks for NADs and how the CCs would handle them.
"Unacceptable" is a little strange to me. I don't even know what that would mean.
todaysstyle
·1 year agoEXACTLY! I have had that one several times. Lady just recently ordered 4 bottles of Minetan Tanning lotion. Around $200.00 (Can't remember the exact amount of the purchase but in the ballpark of 200.00), she received the order within 4 days of ordering. These were brand new un-opened boxes (This item came boxed). After she received the order she filed a chargeback for the order as un-acceptable. huh what does that mean (changed her mind???) Never contacted me and did not reply to messages. Kept the product and received full refund from credit card. Another one that comes to mind is a girl that ordered several tubes of hair color. After receiving the order she filed un-acceptable with her CC. I sent her a message asking if there was an issue with the color. She did reply with four little words "Didn't like the color". Credit card gave her a full refund. Of course the color was not returned because she used it. Just did not like the color she chose. Un-acceptable and un-authorized is the most common chargeback reason given. If you get either of those reasons don't even waste the countering fee as the buyer wins automatically.
mam98031
·1 year agoNot exactly. End result is correct, but no Chargeback is immediately processed and refunded to the buyer. There is a process that has to be followed. Ebay gets notified and then the seller does.
Now an Unauthorized transaction is one of the easiest to WIN for a seller. Many times when this kind of Chargeback gets filed Ebay will tell the seller that they don't even need to reply if they followed all the rules to have seller protection. Ebay will handle it with the CCC and the seller's money is never touched. Proving this kind of complaint is a piece of cake on Ebay.
todaysstyle
·1 year agomam98031 when I say automatically I mean as in the seller is going to lose so just accept it. I did not mean immediately completed although the money is immediately removed from your account. Yes it takes several months before you are notified the chargeback is complete. I guess I just thought the OP would already know that part. I am not sure how Ebay processes chargebacks by the CC. I was speaking of the direct CC processor. I use the Strip processor and this is how it is on chargebacks. It does take time for it to process but the money and the fees are taken immediately when the chargeback is filed by the buyer. If the seller were to win, which is unlikely, the seller will receive the funds back once the chargeback is fully processed which does take a few months.
mam98031
·1 year agoWell that is what "automatically" means. And that just doesn't happen.
I know there are some unusual situations with a Chargeback that can take months to resolve, but that is the exception, not the rule.
The money is NOT taken immediately from the seller on Ebay. Just like any other claim filed on Ebay, the funds are put on hold until the claim is resolved one way or the other. As for the fees, Ebay collected their fees when the transaction first happened, so there aren't any additional fees held or charged to the seller at the time a Chargeback is opened. Now later if they seller disputes the chargeback and loses, then Ebay may charge them a $20 fee.
The ability to win a Chargeback on Ebay is largely going to depend on WHY the buyer filed the Chargeback. Sellers do NOT lose all Chargebacks. While some are more difficult or impossible to win others are not like that.
todaysstyle
·1 year agoWhen a chargeback is made through the credit card the money is immediately removed from the sellers credit card account along with a chargeback fee of 15.00 and if the seller counters the chargeback another 15.00 fee is immediately removed from the sellers account. The buyer also keeps the product and does not have to return it. This is through the credit card company. Ebay may cover the funds removed, I don't know as I have never had a chargeback go through Ebay. I can only say how it works with the credit card company direct. Then it takes around two to three months for the credit card company to let you know if you will get the payment back or if you will not.
mam98031
·1 year agoI think you meant the Buyer's credit card. And yes, but it is not credited to the buyer, it is placed in limbo / pending until the Chargeback is ruled on. The buyer doesn't have to make payment against that amount if the Chargeback is not ruled on before their next payment is due.
As a buyer or a seller I've never been charged $15 for the mere fact a Chargeback was filed. Ebay charges a seller $20 only if they dispute the Chargeback and they lose.
Dispute fee
If you are found responsible for a disputed amount as per eBay policies (e.g., chargeback), we charge a $20.00 dispute fee, excluding sales tax, for each dispute.
https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/fees-credits-invoices/selling-fees?id=4822#section7
Yes, all too often when a buyer files an INAD type Chargeback, the CCC rules the buyer gets to keep the item and get fully refunded. That isn't or hasn't been in question. I've said it and others have said this many times on this subject.
This big delay in notifying the buyer that they have won a Chargeback I know nothing about nor have I heard of it before except in very rare occasions.
seastar2010
OP1 year agoI also never had that happen to me before. This is the 1st time. Even I have" no returns policy'', if buyer wants to return an item, I always accept return and pay for shipping label back. She didn't even ask to return it.
reallynicestamps
·1 year ago@todaysstyle
Cookie Jar Insurance.
That means adding a small amount to every asking price (or a handling charge) to cover the cost of the occasional Bad Transaction.
These upcharges are not seen by the customer as a line item, just folded into your charges.
You put those dimes and nickels (very small if the problems are occasional, larger if they are constant*) into a Virtual Cookie Jar.
When things go pear shaped, you use the money in the Cookie Jar to cover your costs.
And remember those losses are tax deductible when April comes around.
gurlcat
·1 year agoWhenever I hear of that it has a nice 'ring' to it, but I'm curious, do you actually have some sequestering vessel (physical or virtual) to which you add the nickels and dimes from every sale, and avoid touching for anything other than to cover bad transactions?
reallynicestamps
·1 year ago@gurlcat
do you actually have some sequestering vessel (physical or virtual) to which you add the nickels and dimes from every sale,
Nah it's all virtual.
I don't have enough problem transactions to keep track, maybe one a year, and as likely to be me as my customer.
But a colleague who sells car parts from Vancouver Island (which make their first lap of transit by ferry to the mainland) did keep track and decided he actually made a profit from his Cookie Jar.
albertabrightalberta
·1 year ago^^^This is incorrect. It's one of the instances in which ebay WILL have the seller's back. It's not that the name and shipping address matches the CC address. As long as the seller shipped to the address on the ebay order as shown as the "ship to" address, the seller is protected.
The buyer may get the refund but it's not from the seller's funds.
todaysstyle
·1 year agoSorry albertabrightalberta but that is wrong. Does not matter if the shipping address and name match. I have had this happen many times over the 7 years I have sold online. It does not matter if it is shipped to the address given. If the buyer states the transaction is un-authorized the credit card will return the funds to the buyer and the seller will lose. In the beginning that is what I thought also. I would submit the shipping label with the address but that did not matter. As far as the credit card is concerned it could have been a family member that was not authorized to use the card. It does not matter. Seller will lose on a un-authorized transaction every time. Ebay may cover the loss but the credit card will definite charge someone for that transaction. Someone is going to lose the funds weather it is the seller or Ebay. That payment is going back to the buyer.
mam98031
·1 year agoOver the years I have been selling I have WON every single Chargeback dispute that was filed because the buyer did not recognize the charge. I see we have different experiences, IDK why. This is one of the easiest to win.
ogaugeminiaturefigures
·1 year agoI just won a case, buyer claimed INAD with credit card company, I disputed with eBay and requested in
the response to the credit card company that the buyer request a return for refund through eBay. I sent
many comments to the buyer to return for full refund and buyer never filed a return request. eBay provided this information to the buyers credit card company and after about 60 days my funds were returned to me.
I also used the report buyer and blocked the buyer. buyer feedback was like 15 or so.
mam98031
·1 year agoI am very glad to hear this worked out for you. One issue with that is when a buyer filed a Chargeback, they can't then go into Ebay and open an INAD. They system won't let them.
seastar2010
OP1 year agoCan I go to small court. Technically it's theft. She doesn't want to return my boots and she want her money back. I have a hold on my payments( including Ebay final fee).Do I have to pay dobble Ebay fee?
an-57470
·1 year ago@seastar2010
Precisely why she went directly to her credit card. Sorry. 😞
todaysstyle
·1 year agoNope! On this one she opened it through her credit card. The credit card will side with their card holder every time. The only time you, as a seller, may win the dispute is if it is a 'not received' filing and you can prove the item was received with a signature confirmation showing the recipients signature. Even then it is very iffy that you will win the dispute. This is my biggest gripe about selling online. Also, you more then likely will get hit with a dispute fee. With stripe (card processor), if a dispute is filed you are automatically charged a 15.00 dispute fee. If you counter the dispute then you are charged an additional 15.00 dispute fee.
mam98031
·1 year ago@todaysstyle
It is a $20 fee if a seller tries to dispute a Chargeback and loses.
broto_64
·1 year agoYou are not wrong, but the credit cards most certainly have NOT always sided with me!
(When I was the buyer, and not necessarily ebay).
mam98031
·1 year ago@seastar2010
Sadly no. We so desperately need the Congress to do some work and pass a more updated Consumer Protection laws. Credit cards have the ability to let the buyer keep the item and require a full refund from the seller. Terribly unfair.
We need to voice our concerns to our local politician and get them to move it up the ranks. It is long over due.
msha3839
·1 year agoThis particular issue has nothing to do with CPL…dispute is between seller and buyer on eBay…what seller can do is to be proactive and respond to the claim with ironclad evidence..CC issuers always conduct investigation prior to awarding money to one side or another, and it’s not because of trying to be fair but to avoid legal problems and negative publicity…
mam98031
·1 year ago@msha3839
This may help.
https://chargebacks911.com/chargeback-laws/
reallynicestamps
·1 year agoRequest the return of the shoes. Provide a Return Shipping Label.
I'm not sure how this works with a chargeback, but it won't hurt.
If the label is not used, eventually the cost will be refunded.
If ever you get an eBay claim in future cooperate and demand Return before Refund.
Even if you have a No Refunds policy eBay allows this.