Am I being scammed?
Got an order the other day and because I’m cautious I sent it with a signature confirmation slip. This morning I got a message, as I expected, from the buyer saying they “forgot†to add their apartment number, USPS is returning it to me, but they still want it so can they pay me for shipping it again. I just find it hard to believe you buy a $50 item and forget your apartment number and are willing to spend on shipping again, I don’t know what to do? I’m assuming I will lose my own money on shipping fees now as well? Just a sad feeling I’m going to get screwed by eBay on this deal. Also the buyer has 1 feedback.
By the way I’ve been a member of eBay since 1999 and have 307 transactions with no negative feedback. I just started to sell more because I need help to pay for my daughter’s school trip to another country and right away I feel defeated 😞
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you
M
bonanza125
·2 years ago@mam98031
I already know that. My comment was directed towards another helper. That's not what I was referring.
mam98031
·2 years agoI know you were responding to another poster, however that doesn't change the fact the statement was not accurate. It may have just been how you worded it, but we can only go by what is actually posted.
I'm glad you are aware that it is something you aren't responsible to do.
kraftique
·2 years agoyou can update the address with the US Postal Service.. Contact them. I had a Priority that went to Austrialia and the person did not give me the complete street address. I sent the item out not knowing - thinking it was rural and then was told she gave me the wrong address.
I expected it to be returned. NOPE I called up the Post Office and they were able to translate all the updated address information and get it right to her. Talk about amazing. By the way this was the 1 800 number.
You should be able to find out from your own Post Office if there was an attempt made for the signature- the Post Master looks into his system and can see all the mail and what goes on. (I know the secrets because my daughter works there). If they attempted then you know. If that is the case I would Not do business with them again.
mam98031
·2 years ago@kraftique
When a seller changes the address from what is on the transaction order, the seller voids their Seller Protection. In this specific case there is no need to do that or risk it.
So be very careful when changing a buyer's ship to address on an order.
marc_tarrington
·2 years agoyes .............i got scammed for a return sent me a small envelope with a packing slip , to show proof of delviery
12345jamesstamps
·2 years agoI can get my mail without an apartment number...doorbells usually go by a name on a building.
And if there is a service desk in the building or complex they will know the name. and apartment number.
Did you google the address to see what the building looks like?
It sounds strange.
Wait until package is returned to you before you do anything.
I get Amazon, USP, Fed Ex,and USPS who ring everyone's doorbell until someone lets them in our building.
And there is usually a notice left that shipper couldn't get in by the door on the building...don't need an apartment number.
It sounds like to me it might have been refused...just a thought.
I do signature confirmations a lot at my own expense $$$ for my safety and never ever a buyer complained and never had a problem.
I would ship it again with signature confirmation only...and make buyer pay for both shippings...no matter the how much it is worth.
Sometimes a buyer's feedbacks and such make a seller do a signature confirmation.
reallynicestamps
·2 years agoWhile the apartment building across the street from me is only five stories and fifty apartments, there are several downtown that are 15 stories and over 200 apartments.
And the mailboxes would be in numerical order, not by the name of the tenant.
I'm now wondering how the buyer was notified that their item was being returned as Undeliverable, since the postie couldn't have left a notice.
With SC, the notice would tell the tenant where and when the item could be picked up. And your POs are open on Saturdays.
Did the buyer actually see the shipment and refuse it? Did the buyer decide to add a couple of weeks before getting the purchase so they didn't want to sign?
I'm missing something here.
Maybe the boyfriend refused the package because it was addressed to the buyer?
mam98031
·2 years ago@m.ant
We are all human and we all make mistakes, some are really simple mistakes that most times they would have caught. It is sad that we are always on the lookout for someone trying to scam us that we forget sometimes people just make honest mistakes.
One caution I would give you is to NEVER ship anything with a signature required unless you have informed the buyer that is what you are doing. Never do it as a SURPRISE, that will certainly cause some upset buyers and understandably so.
I'm unsure how you think this buyer would be committing a scam. Sellers are protected when the tracking shows the item to be undeliverable. So if the buyer were to file an INR, they would not win, you would.
As for the buyer wanting you to reship the item, you need to tell them that once you get the item back and it is in the same shape as you sent it, you will be happy to reship the item at their expense. You can invoice the buyers through PayPal as Ebay does not have a vehicle in which to do this.
The amount you invoice them should me the amount you originally charged them for shipping PLUS the fees you will be paying to PayPal.
Then when you go to reship the item, DO NOT create the shipping label in Ebay as the new tracking could over-write the original tracking and you do not want those details to get lost. Go to PayPal and do the shipping from the transaction there. Oh, make sure they got their address correct this time.
You will be protected by Ebay on this with these steps.
iart
·2 years agoWe wouldn't send signature confirmation without the buyer's approval - especially for a $50 item. This is probably what messed you up. The carrier probably couldn't easily tell the apt number and so simply returned it. Or maybe the buyer simply wasn't home. It's not a part of the deal that the buyer has to waste their time going to the post office.
mam98031
·2 years agoI agree. The OP got lucky on that part of this transaction. That could have really caused them problems. The bad address was kind of a favor in this case. The carrier didn't have the apartment number as the buyer admitted they didn't give it on their ship to address.
m.ant
OP2 years agoMy listing stated that I was sending the item with signature confirmation. The buyer knew and even asked that I package it a certain way because it was supposed to be a gift for her boyfriend. She said she was going to be out of town and didn’t want him to sign and open it and I informed her that it would be in a priority mail envelope.
I know you said I got lucky but if this was an intentional scam, and I didn’t have the required signature, I feel like my package would be lost right now. I’m not saying this was definitely a scam but it just feels odd that someone would forget their apartment number on the eBay address page. Only 1 feedback on their profile and I’m hoping like someone else mentioned that they moved and forgot to add the apartment number.
Thank you though for the reply.
mam98031
·2 years agoScam is such an over used word. You do not have enough evidence to know anything for sure except that it appears the buyer made a mistake when giving the address to ship to.
The fact that you did signatured required has NOTHING to do with the package getting returned to you because it wasn't deliverable as address. There are many of us here that have received packages back due to a problem with the address without any type of signatured required. I've got one on my desk right now.
I understand you don't know "definitely" it is a scam, but you also have ZERO evidence it is even potentially a scam. But really it doesn't matter, you have Seller Protection on this transaction and the buyer will not be able to take advantage of you financially unless you were to let them, which I don't believe you would do.
chariot_badges
·2 years agoThen it should be part of the deal that they waste their time going to Target to buy their stuff.
Buyers choice.
Either make things easy for me ... or NO ROCK BOTTOM CHEAP PRICES for you.
Speed and profit.
Here's yer stuff.
Gimme your money.
NEXT!
oh, it's more complicated than that?
step aside ... have a seat in the BBL Purgatory Waiting Room, we'll be right with you.
NEXT!
iart
·2 years agoWe see it the opposite. It's up to the seller to make things easy on our buyers.
But you're welcome to your opinion. Just don't be one of those who come in here to complain about poor sales or 'undeserved' negatives.
mam98031
·2 years agoWhen you send a package via USPS that requires a signature. If no one is home on the day of delivery, the carrier leaves a Pink [I think it is pink] form in their mail box notifying them that they have a package that is Signature Required. It will tell them that they can pick it up at the PO on the next day OR they can fill in a date on the form for RE-delivery. So the buyer can select Saturday if that would work for them.
They don't have to go to the Post Office unless that is what they prefer.
reallynicestamps
·2 years agoWith an Undeliverable address, eBay does not require you to refund anything at all.
https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy?id=4210#specialcoverage-inr
I agree that refunding the selling price but not the shipping cost (including the added cost of Signature Confirmation) is reasonable.
EBay will back you on that action.
Then relist, allow the customer to bid, and if they buy, check that address again before shipping.
I did have it listed as No Returns because the item was NWT
Even with a No Returns policy a seller is allowed to demand the return before refunding.
A No Returns policy is allowed (not a good idea in my opinion but allowed)
We cannot have a No Refunds policy.
bonanza125
·2 years agoIt's all part of business. When you receive the item back just issue a refund "wrong address" and relist it for higher to recoup your shipping cost. Then tell the buyer to make sure they edit the address to where it shows there apartment number. Then when that is done then the buyer purchases the item. Make sure everything is correct and you can confirm with the buyer before shipment as well. Had this done many of times to me as a seller. The buyer might have move to that apartment and either forgot to put the apartment number or didn't know they had to in the first place. It's not hard to believe it's actually very common mistake.
albertabrightalberta
·2 years agoThe buyer's error of not putting the complete correct address shouldn't be part of the seller's "cost of doing business." Although the seller isn't obligated to refund the buyer for the incorrect address, he certainly should refund the portion of the buyer's payment but retaining his own costs.
And if I were the seller, this buyer would be on my BBL.
bonanza125
·2 years ago"The buyer's error of not putting the complete correct address shouldn't be part of the seller's "cost of doing business." Although the seller isn't obligated to refund the buyer for the incorrect address, he certainly should refund the portion of the buyer's payment but retaining his own costs. And if I were the seller, this buyer would be on my BBL. "
Well yes I would ask the buyer to pay for the extra shipping cost it took to ship the item for the first time when relisted to recoup the cost. For my book work for taxes I refund the full amount for that. I do "Free Shipping" so I just add that amount to the cost when relisted. You have a position where you wouldn't deal with the buyer and want to block them in this particular situation. I don't do that and it works out for me and the buyer just fine.
mam98031
·2 years ago@bonanza125
If you are talking about sales taxes, sellers do not ever pay sales taxes on Ebay nor can they refund them. Ebay refunds buyers sales taxes if it is appropriate.
I'm not sure you understand the subject we have been discussing. Ebay has seller protection for the type of issue we have been discussing when a buyer gives the seller an incorrect or incomplete address. IDK why you would even consider eating costs associated with this happening, it is so unnecessary.
chariot_badges
·2 years agoI would wait till I get it back, then block the 'buyer' and put the item in "Drafts" for a week or so.
You are either:
Dealing with a rip-off, or
an idiot.
My rule in life, poker and eBay is ... "Fold early, fold often."
Who needs the kvetch?
fbusoni
·2 years ago@m.ant
How can USPS not know what apartment the buyer lives in?
Surely buyer gets other mail with his apartment number indicated.
Sounds to me like delivery was attempted, but the buyer cannot be bothered to go pick it up at the post office.
How did the buyer communicate this information to you? eBay message?
Does tracking show that the package is being returned to you?
From what you have shared, something does not add up.
Nor am I sure that I'd deduct shipping fees upon a return, but that's another story.
First see if you get the return and it's the same item that you sent.
mam98031
·2 years agoSome apartment complexes have a handful or units, others have thousands.
glorybells
·2 years agoDefinitely! I used to deliver for Uber Eats, and imagine driving into a large apartment complex, there’s 3 floors in 6 buildings, and all you have is an apartment number, nothing further than that. It can quickly get very frustrating!
heckofagame
·2 years agoWhen it comes back, refund minus the shipping costs. Then the buyer can purchase it again with the correct address.
m.ant
OP2 years agoSo I wait until it’s returned then cancel and it will allow me to refund minus shipping? I did have it listed as No Returns because the item was NWT and as I said I just don’t trust people particularly with no feedback. I did pay my own money for the signature confirmation slip but if I’m only out $3 that’s better than $11.
Also what should I tell the buyer? Should I explain the situation above that I need for it to be returned, I’ll cancel minus shipping, and I can re-list if they want to purchase again?
Thank you for the help.
zoda99
·2 years ago@m.ant asked: can re-list if they want to purchase again?
Yes. As long as the product is in your possession you may re-list it again.
mam98031
·2 years agoNO, do not ever "cancel" a transaction that was actually shipped. That is a specific process for specific reasons, but this isn't one of those reasons.
When you refund someone, Ebay refunds your fees, but in this case you would not refund the shipping fees. So if you decide to refund the buyer, you would refund them the Product amount less your non refundable fees. There is no reason for this transaction to cost you money. Heck Ebay wouldn't even force you to make a refund of any kind to this buyer, but I never advise that.
A No Return Policy does not protect you from INRs or INADs. The ONLY thing it will protect you from is Properly Filed Buyer Remorse returns. If a buyer files an INAD because there was a problem with the item, you would need to process that INAD. To deny it would, in time, end up with Ebay forcing you to refund, not refund your FVFs and give you a Defect on your Seller Dashboard. So make sure you learn what you can and can't do with a No return Policy. Do NOT assume you are immune to having to process INADs.
First find out if your buyer will still want the item. If they do, let them know you will notify with when the item is returned to you. I personally would not do a new transaction of ebay as all the risks now come back to you as you had in the original transaction up until the tracking showed it was undeliverable. The new transaction would also allow them to leave feedback.
IMHO I would encourage you to process it as I stated in my previous post. It is the safest way for the seller.
m.ant
OP2 years agoI don’t understand what INR, INAD, and FVF mean so I’ll have to do some research. That being said I have no problem issuing a refund minus the shipping costs. I’ll lose money because I paid for the signature confirmation myself, but it’s not as much as the entire shipping cost so I’m okay with that.
Regardless is your advice that I wait until the postal service returns my item, then I issue the refund minus shipping, and re-list it here? I’m reading conflicting messages where it seems like some are saying I should just get the package, ask for shipping costs to be sent again through PayPal, then send it off without going back through eBay. Either is fine with me and I guess it would make no difference for eBay since they have already made money off the original transaction.
Thanks for the information!
mam98031
·2 years agoThey are things you should commit to memory as they are important here in the community.
INR = Item Not Received
INAD = Item Not as Described
FVF = Final value fees
Your signature confirmation costs is the only costs you should eat. You should withhold shipping and any other non recoverable FVFs. So that would be your 40 cent transaction fee and the FVFs on whatever the amount you are deducting from the refund. Ebay will auto refund your FVFs on whatever amount you refund and if the buyer paid sales taxes, Ebay will auto refund that to the buyer.
YES, do NOTHING until you actually have the package back. Personally I would wait a few days to relist it or even a couple weeks, unless you put this buyer on your BBL [Blocked Bidder List].
Yes, different sellers sometimes have different ideas. It doesn't always mean someone is wrong and someone is right. It can mean there are different ways to accomplish the same thing.
If you allow another transaction on Ebay with this buyer, then you are exposing yourself to another transaction in which the buyer can leave feedback on the transaction. If you feel this buyer is somehow trying to scam you, I'm unsure why you would want to expose yourself to a new transaction with them. But you choice of course.
Doing what I described with PayPal does not create a new transaction on Ebay and keeps you safe from any additional problems a new Ebay transaction can bring. Just make sure you create the shipping label in PayPal NOT Ebay. Do NOT create the new shipping label in Ebay. I explained this in my other post.
Whatever you decide to do I hope it all works out for you.