Sellers need partial refund ability on INAD cases as 30-day remorse return settings are irrelevant
Heres the issue/logic problem.
Two items. One has 30 day remorse returns enabled, one doesnt. If both are sent back for INAD reasons, and there are problems with the item return (damaged, missing parts, not the same item, etc) only the one with the 30 day remorse returns enabled will allow a seller to do a partial refund.
But in reality, the remorse return setting is irrelevant in these cases because the item is returned for an INAD reason. Whether or not 30 day remorse returns is set never enters the equation. It has no bearing on the return situation but it incorrectly and unfairly prevents a seller from issuing a partial refund for an INAD item that has problems and requires deductions.
This is a huge loophole. It needs to be closed. All INAD returns have to be accepted whether or not the seller also takes remorse returns, so whether or not the item has 30-day remorse returns set, is not relevant. Therefore, all INAD returns should be enabled to allow sellers to provide partial refunds when they encounter problems with the returned item.
Its actually severely illogical. If a buyer returns an item for an INAD reason, and the seller also listed the item for 30 day remorse returns, the seller can do a partial refund if there are issues with the return item. But the very same item is returned for an INAD reason, but the seller didn't list the item with 30 day remorse returns enabled, they can't do a partial refund if there are issues with the return item.
30 day remorse returns never enter the equation with INAD returns, so whether remorse returns are on or off, it shouldn't take away a sellers ability to do a partial refund with problem INAD return items.
house*of*paws
·8 months agoHi @rugerskick
The reason a seller cannot do a partial refund for an INAD return is because the seller cannot prove that it was the buyer … and not the shipping company … who made changes to the item.
The seller can offer a partial refund on an INAD claim … but they cannot automatically deduct up to 50% of the refund like they can on a remorse return.
On a remorse return … the buyer is acknowledging that the item was received ‘as described’.
rugerskick
OP8 months agoThat is not true for all INAD cases. Also, my statement "we should trust sellers they sent an intact working item because we can't know if it was the seller or the carrier" is the same logical-weight statement as yours.
christworks
·8 months ago@rugerskick Why don't you go start your on selling platform where you can run it how you want? I mean, if I thought something was so unfair about eBay that I spent my evening debating others about it rather than listing items that make me money, then I'd just venture out on my own.
I'm sure you can do it.
rugerskick
OP8 months agoThis is the typical response when someone brings up a problem to discuss. Stockholm Syndrome and attack the speaker. There's no rule you havve to read or reply to anyone's posts.
robbie31415
·8 months agoNo one here actually thinks a seller can refuse all returns.
People know its for remorse reasons.
But you are moving the goalpost.
Have fun complaining about it, its not changing.
christworks
·8 months agoIt would be unfair if eBay forced you into the no return policy. They don't. They give you the ability to choose your return policy, then base certain perks on that. If they were to do as you wish, you'd lose a lot of the motivation behind sellers offering free returns. What would be the point?
eBay, understandably, wants buyers to have a great experience. eBay makes their money off buyers (I realize many sellers will disagree with that assertion). This is why their site is buyer friendly to a point, and they want sellers to have buyer friendly policies in areas where they give sellers some control.
You choose to not accept returns. I don't see why you think eBay should reward you for that.
lakefor94
·8 months ago@christworks I looked at one of the OP's listings, it was returns accepted, buyer pays return shipping
christworks
·8 months ago@lakefor94 They may have a mix or are in the process of changing them. The ones I looked at before I posted were all no returns. I did see a couple just now that were as you said, but then I found more that are seller does not accept returns.
rugerskick
OP8 months agoAnd I would say, so what? I discuss the issue because its an issue bigger than any one person. Every seller here is affected by it. If you offer 30 day returns you're affected because ebay's cornered you to do it to get protections (do this or else negative consequences). If you don't you're affected because ebay has withheld protections because you only take INAD returns (which don't even need 30 day returns enabled).
lakefor94
·8 months ago@rugerskick
So what, you say? You were complaining that ebay does not provide the 50% return deduction for INAD's when in fact, ebay does provide that.
I do free returns here the same as I do on AMZ. It is a no-brainer for my business as they are ~mostly~ business buyers and expect a liberal return policy if they need it. I have only ever had to use the 50% deduction 1 time over the years. 700 sales per year. I get a dozen or so returns a year, so what, this is an online sales in the 2020's.
I sell some expensive items, every week. The Free Returns repels the professional scammers because they know, when they see Free Returns, and they file INAD, they are open to a 50% refund. The pro-scammers want the whole enchilada refund, 100% without having to beg eBay for the other 50%.
The Free Returns also draws more business to my listings. Lot of return buyers that have confidence that they won't be hassled if they do need to return something. I don't even care what their reason is for the return, just send it back and I will deal with it according to eBay policy.
rugerskick
OP8 months agoNo that is not true, there are still incentives for free returns/30 day returns.
You will still get higher placement in searches than those who dont offer that. I mean that is huge considering people pay extra for promoted listings to do the exact same thing for them.
robbie31415
·8 months agoYou are right, its not fair, but the logic is sound and consistent.
The unfairness is by design.
Ebay doesnt want No Return sellers.
Ebay wants you to be more vulnerable so you may change over time to have the policies they want.
When you align to what they want you to offer, then you get more protections.
rugerskick
OP8 months agoEbay does not have a single No Returns seller. You know it and I know it.
There are countless posts from people here saying what we all know. You have to take INAD returns.
So truly, by definition, all sellers here have to take returns.
To be more correct and accurate, what we are talking about is whether a seller has a liberal return policy or not.
Not every seller wants to take returns for any reason, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't have seller protection for the returns they will have to accept. Do you not think this is fair and right?
wastingtime101
·8 months agoSellers need to meet a lot of requirements to have the ability to withhold part of the refund, and many of those requirements are buyer-friendly policies. "No returns" is not a buyer friendly policy and eBay chooses to not extend the added level of seller protections in that case.
rugerskick
OP8 months agoIt doesnt matter in an INAD case, all sellers have to take them, so all sellers are going to be providing that level of customer service regarding returns. And because its mandatory, sellers should always have the ability to not get screwed over if there is a problem with an INAD returned item (stuff missing, empty box, new now used, abuse of MBG by buyer) they have to take back.
Remember, an INAD return doesn't care if 30 day remorse returns are enabled. An INAD return also does not need a seller to have 30 day returns enabled, because those reasons are not INAD reasons. Sellers are just automatically going to provide the proper level of service for INAD returns, because ebay requires it. (If sellers do not, ebay will step in and decide in the buyers favor.) Ebay should therefore always protect sellers from INAD MBG abuses and INAD return item problems. Otherwise ebay is exposing sellers, who have to and do provide customer service for INAD returns they must handle properly, to chronic bad buyer problems (false INAD claims, incomplete returns, damaged items) and scammers (no item returned, different item, label switch scam, etc), and by not providing seller protection, ebay enables this behavior to occur to sellers. They enable it because the system they have built, encourages and supports it occurring, because if an INAD return is fraudulent and has issues, the seller cannot deduct any loss/damages. So ebays system is responsible for this. All for not having a return setting set, that doesn't even come into play for an INAD return. It absolutely makes zero sense.
lakefor94
·8 months agoAll my listings are TRS+, as in, Free Returns. I can issue a deducted return of up to 50% on INAD returns.
The return deduction is available on any return I receive.
rugerskick
OP8 months agoNo Returns is actually not accurate and perpetuates a false reality.
It really means no remorse returns, everyone knows every single seller has to take INAD returns, even ebay knows that, its their policy. So that status is not a true reflection of what is going on.
wastingtime101
·8 months agoThe question of "fair" isn't all that relevant here.
If eBay changed it to extend protections to no (remorse) returns sellers, then sellers that accept returns for any reason could say it's "not fair" for eBay to reward sellers that aren't losing money on remorse returns throughout the year the way they do. And yes, every return is a money loser in some way, even remorse returns that come back in the same condition. Sellers might stop accepting remorse returns because why should they when they don't get any extra protection, right?
One could argue the current policies are "not fair" because why the heck should we have to refund a penny when the buyer returns an item in trashed condition - why can we withhold a max of 50% under seller protections for TRS (or free returns)?
eBay wants buyer-friendly policies. eBay is concerned about lining their own pockets. Sellers are a dime a dozen. It's expensive to acquire and retain buyers.
I don't think anybody on this discussion is saying they like the current policies, but I think some of us are saying we understand why eBay structured it that way.
rugerskick
OP8 months agoExplain logically why sellers shouldn't always have protection against fraud/return item problems, regardless of whether they have enabled remorse returns, as fraud/return item problems can occur on any kind of return.
What is the logical argument for denying it.
lakefor94
·8 months ago@rugerskick
There are as many liar sellers as there are liar buyers. We see a minute fraction of these knucklehead sellers come through here on a daily basis.
eBay processes how many transactions per day? Is it a million?
If ebay even attemped to mitigate the seller's complaints/cases as what they would claim as a fraudulent return, ebay would have to employ another 500 people to weed thru what, ~10,000 cases per day? Who knows how many?
Wondering what it would cost us in additional final value fees on every transaction to have ebay play judge and jury to figure out who does not know ebay policy and/or who the liar may be?
I for one don't want to see ebay try to do that. I can handle my buyers and any cases they might open according to ebay policy.