38-19 on an AZO RPPC - is it the date?
I don't collect many RPPCs, just not my "thing." But I know enough about them to be "dangerous" as the old saying goes.
I have a question about a RPPC (AZO). I recognize AZO as a top line RPPC maker and pay attention to them when circumstances warrant so. I found one and the seller (who is no doubt much more knowledgeable about RPPCs than I) lists the card as 1919. On the image side it has some text including "38-19." Can anyone that knows RPPCs confirm that the date is 1919? Part of the listing title is "Real Photo 1919 Seaplane at Naval Training..." if you want to look up the listing. Or if you need more complex clues to find it I can probably help and remain within ebay policy guidelines.
Any assistance appreciated, as always....c*me
6 comments
c*me*4*lefton*info
OP1 year agoCatalog or serial number - The 19 fits the time period I belief (1919) but offering a different interpretation of the number (other than a "date") is helpful.
I believe there was a military aviation (not necessarily specifically Naval) presence in San Diego before 1923. But I have not gone down that rabbit hole yet. Naval military history in San Diego goes back 100+ years now and I have gone down that rabbit hole almost to the bottom.
I'm not sure what type of plane although I did go down that rabbit hole for a time. Wikipedia was significant help with IDing the plane but there were so many different ones the task of identifying a specific plane is time consuming and tedious. With your suggestion of Martin I will narrow my search and I will likely once again find Wiki very useful with a narrowed-down search. Thank you, your comments have enlightened me.
No idea if the image is from a photo - but I can safely say the RPPC and the other type of card I purchased (Albertype B&W is my belief) have identical images (other than masking).
The image is most definitely not "common." I have "dealt with" lithos in the past that were marked as to photographer and always pay close attention to photographers when possible. This image was not reprinted over decades. My personal opinion is the image dates to circa WW1. According to my records the (non-RPPC) card I bought with the same image is datable to this time period.
I will investigate the AZO stamp box but have not done so yet. The stamp box was something that I had not considered but I will consider now. I am thinking the RPPC stamp box is a common AZO and the time period AZO used it will be over a long time period. As I say not checked by me yet, but I will check and I appreciate the suggestion.
All for now.
c*me*4*lefton*info
OP1 year agoThanks one and all. You have given me some good info and I appreciate it. I'll be back sometime in the future (when I have more time) to answer the questions from above that I can....It is indeed a complex story but I have done my research to some degree.
Meantime this may interest. A recent purchase I made prompting this conversation. 187217310678 has the same (masked) image.
wolfsvintagepostcards
·1 year agoIf someone already said this please disregard, but the AZO stampbox should identify the date range. Check the stampbox if not covered by a stamp against the Playle image db https://www.playle.com/realphoto/photoa.php
dogchow747
·1 year agoRemember - Many RPPC's were "commercial items" of the time.
Depending on how well they sold, they may have been reprinted many times (even up to the 50' maybe early 60's on Kodak paper). They may have been a one time deal.
Sanborn - Colorado/Wyoming RPPC's are a good example. Early photo's reused for years.
It can be a bit tricky to date these things in general.
I would always try to place the photo and time frame of the subject. (If possible)
Photos with several cars are great. Search for similar items with good keywords.
You might find that image is common, or a find a postmarked one that gives at least a known date.
It takes time to get comfortable with a guess. It can be a hard call.
deltilogical
·1 year agoI agree, its some kind of cataloging number. Logically assuming a year is involved makes sense, but who knows! It could mean Box 38 roll 19.
A quick review shows the San Diego Training Center wasn't even commissioned until 1923. Was there other Navy flying there before during WW1? Is the plane a 1915 U.S. Army Martin Model S hydro-aeroplane - and looking at the image in the rppc, I was wondering if it was an image of a photo - its tough to tell not in hand?
njrtsr
·1 year agoThat looks like a catalog or serial number from the photographer. It's not unusual for the photographers to write numbers like that in the negative (showing up as white on the positive image). They weren't really for the public to be concerned about, but today collectors can use them to differentiate between different cards in a series. It's not a date number, and the card and airplane certainly look like they're from that time period.