Got My First Bootleg DVD Today!
Received burned copies of a tv series with no markings, no printing on the inside of the cover artwork, and completely different from the studio released legitimate set. I don't want to even watch them as I would feel guilty when the 'Pirating Is Illegal' message pops up knowing that I'm seeing it on a pirated disk. 😎
Rather than report the seller to the studio who owns the rights, or to eBay, I have asked the seller to 'advise' before I do this. I will wait a couple of days if I don't hear back before I put the hammer down.
My questions:
1. Can I put the bootlegs into the round file after getting a refund, or do I have to send them back to the seller?
2. When all is said and done, what should I do about feedback? The seller gave me a positive as soon as I paid.
Thanks, as usual.
pastimpressions
·5 months ago@gator08041971 wrote: "Good luck, sorry for the book."
No. Thank you so very much. I greatly appreciate your taking the time to give such a thorough reply.
You have offered a lot of valuable information which will be of great assistance to a tech-challenged individual such as myself.
mudshark61369
·5 months ago@grann-4629 ,
If this is about one of the last two sellers you bought from, both of whom are located in your country. Hopefully when you reported the counterfeit issue, you did so on your Home site ( ebay.ca ) and not this one. You should leave a negative for the seller as well, rather than relying on ebay to remove the seller.
If you reported the seller on this site, the U.S. based site reps might not be able to pass the info on to the Canadian reps. As others have posted so far reporting items often does not work, but filing Not As Described disputes does. If you do that and the seller sends you a return label, you need to do that. If you get a refund you can toss them.
Have you considered posting about this issue on your home site's community?
https://community.ebay.ca/t5/Buying-on-eBay/qa-p/q-80000002
grann-4629
OP5 months agoNow that eBay removed the item that I already have, they are telling me I am requesting a return on an item that has been removed for a violation!
I am just going to take the loss ... not worth the hassle. Seller can keep selling and keep the $13 or so that I am out.
Thanks all 😎😎
jonathanbrightlight
·5 months agoAgain, you reported the listing, but you have to open a return request from your Purchase History (which you can STILL do, even though the listing has been removed), to get your money back. They are completely different things.
Return an item for a refund
grann-4629
OP5 months ago@mudshark61369 I don't bother to post/visit the Canadian site very often. I have posted questions there that remain unanswered and there is very little to 'talk about'. I am just caught in the eBay AI runaround maze and may or may not find the exit. The seller is in Canada, where I purchased, received and reported the item. The seller also pulls in a lot of money for the venue, so I doubt anything will happen to him/her for selling policy prohibited and illegal items. 😎
mudshark61369
·5 months ago@grann-4629 ,
I've heard the Canadian site's community isn't a busy one, but still this whole situation could have easily been handled by filing an Item Not As Described (INAD) dispute to get a refund, then reporting the item for being a counterfeit one.
As for the seller being a high volume one, it is possible that they are actually located in China and ship from a Canadian based but Chinese owned warehouse. Having lower or much lower prices for popular items is one of the indications of that being the case.
grann-4629
OP5 months agoThe package came in a mailer from a Canadian address with a Canadian stamp. Those clever Chinese ...😎
As stated, I thought I was filing an INAD!
ETA: I doubt the item is from China as they do a much better job when making illegal DVD sets. This one was really sloppy as you can see from the pics. Unfortunately, these pics were not shown in the listing.
grann-4629
OP5 months ago@mudshark61369 Understood, thanks.
Packing up these disks and getting them to the post office creates a big problem for me. When (if) I am told to return these disks, who pays for the packaging, the packing materials, the tape ... all stuff I have to purchase ... and the Uber to take me to the post office and back?
Thanks again.
kathiec
·5 months agoThe seller pays for the return label. For the infinitesimal number of returns I've done I always just reused the packaging the item came in. And a quick Google search reveals you can schedule a Canada Post pickup for $3.50 (with USPS pickups are free), which is certainly cheaper than an Uber. In any event, anything beyond actual return postage is on you.
grann-4629
OP5 months ago@kathiec
Thanks. I had to cut the package open, and tossed it in the trash after pulling out the DVD. I don't have any packing tape or packing materials and the Uber ride alone would be around $30 plus another $3.50 for the post office graft - they walk past my home everyday, but only deliver.
It would more expensive for me to return it then to just take the loss. It will be interesting to see how the 'bots handle it when I explain this to them and remind them just how good their MBG works.
I gave the seller a neutral and explained why - this won't have any affect on this seller although eBay did remove the listing for a policy violation after I had received the product - my fault for doing the steps in the wrong order 😏
kathiec
·5 months agoIt would more expensive for me to return it then to just take the loss. It will be interesting to see how the 'bots handle it when I explain this to them and remind them just how good their MBG works.
I would suggest you actually read the MBG before you start opining on how "good" it does or doesn't work. The MBG allows you to return items that are not as described for a full refund of original purchase price and shipping. It furthers dictates that if the seller wants the item returned they will pay return shipping postage. It in no way, shape, or form states that any related expenses will be covered. Them's the rules, like 'em or not.
Think about it. Can you imagine the utter cluster it would be if eBay got into the business of trying to figure out what other expenses were 1) valid and 2) covered for every single return???
grann-4629
OP5 months agoAppreciate your comment about me screwing up ... first time I have ever been in this situation and it is nice to be reminded of it.
Thanks.
Can anybody guess what the seller would do with the illegal disks if I did send them back? They may end up in your mailbox one day.
grann-4629
OP5 months agoUpdate: Refund issued by eBay. No contact from seller yet. Interesting to note that the feedback I left for the seller mentioning the illegal disks has disappeared from their page, but it still shows up on my 'left for others' page.
albertabrightalberta
·5 months agoThe passive-aggressive sarcasm isn't necessary especially when you come to the boards looking for advice from people who don't know you and owe you nothing. (I know.....I told you I wouldn't be offering advice to you after you similarly criticized me when you didn't like what I said.)
The fact is that you DID make a mistake and if you don't learn from it, mistakes will continue to happen. And you may find yourself hard pressed to find people willing to help.
albertabrightalberta
·5 months agoYou won't end up happy if you "see how the bots handle it." Bots don't listen to (nor care about) explanations.
If you want a refund, you need to file a claim per ebay protocol and unless the seller wants to issue a refund without a return, you MUST return it to get a refund.
While I understand your difficulty in getting to the post office, that's neither the seller's nor ebay's concern.
pastimpressions
·5 months agoI am a little in the dark as to how one discerns copyrighted /authorized vs. bootleg since the advent of "print/burn on demand" services where the items are not pre-produced and held in inventory but rather created to order.
I have, in the past, purchased such "authorized" copies on demand and was frequently unimpressed as the overall quality/appearance of the finished product did give one a "cheap imitation" impression as opposed to the silk-screened discs, heavier cardstock 4 color printed inserts and heavier clamshells typical IMHO of pre-produced inventory.
Any tips (beyond the obvious that even a novice as myself might discern) from experienced media people out there would be greatly appreciated.
grann-4629
OP5 months agoIt's not hard to tell if you have been at it for awhile. In this case it was really easy. All I had to do was compare the real set (several listed on eBay) with the set I received.
gator08041971
·5 months ago@pastimpressions
To be honest, I have never purchased a copy of anything from a print on demand service. I didn't even know those existed.
The thing is, its true. Most people aren't going to be able to tell many bad duplicates from a genuine. I have seen some really good fakes before that even got by me at first. But there are a few caveats to keep an eye out on:
Packaging. Often bad copies will have fuzzy, faint, or smeary looking materials included. They also might have some noticeable differences from an original or even similar movie from the same studio. Like the Disney fakes I got that had asian writing and on the spine it said iPad for some reason. Real Disney movies never have that for example.
Then the disks. The printing on the label side often can look very good and convincing. Only when comparing it to a real one do the differences stand out. Fonts might be a bit blurry, or sized wrong for example.
And the written/read side will either be an odd color instead of a factory color (but this isn't always the case) the disc will have a strong odor about it that's pretty pungent. Then, if you examine the disc contents, there will often be a discrepancy.
Take DVDs. Most modern retail DVDs are dual layer. Meaning they can carry two individual layers of data instead of one. So instead of only holding 4.7GB, they hold around 8.4GB or more. That way they can provide up to a 6ish GB movie file that would have a higher quality bitrate of 5-6k. Compared to Bluray that can have a movie file size be between 20-40GB and a bitrate of 20-30k (non HD vs 1080P HD).
Another clue is the drive reading the disc may make excessive noise and/or take a long time doing things when selecting stuff in the menu, assuming the menu even works properly. Sometimes the show will glitch and stall like the disk has a scratch, but you won't see any damage.
Bootlegs often only use single layer discs/disks (whatever you might call them). But they will have the same number of shows, or the same (or should) files. But to get over 8GB of DVD file to fit, they lower the bitrate of the show or movie so it fits on the smaller sized disk. Same with Bluray. They will use a single layer 25GB disk and crush the show down to fit. At least with blurays the difference is harder to see. On a DVD its easily spotted visually. Its like watching a VCR recorded at SLP/EP instead of SP.
With a computer used to view the contents, this gets a bit easier to see. For one thing, if the movie is a bootleg, there will be no copy restrictions. I will be able to simply stick the disk in any computer, find the video file and just copy it to my desktop and it will run without having to decode the disk using an authorized player or special software.
I can also view the bitrate of the files on the disk and see that they are less than half what they should be.
Sure, its a bit of technical gobbly **bleep**, but I have had plenty of experience with all this for the past couple years. Fakes can be caught. The trick is catching them before you buy one, and that's a bit harder. One tip:
Good luck, sorry for the book.
soh.maryl
·5 months agoWhy would you not simply open an NAD case? The MBG is there for you to use. If he wants it returned, he will need to send you a prepaid return label.
grann-4629
OP5 months agoI thought that's what I did! I went to the bottom of the list on my purchases page for this item and clicked on the report button as others have suggested here on other threads. I completed the info on the form presented.
Now I really have no idea what will happen 😎
soh.maryl
·5 months agoIn order to open an item not as described case, there's a set procedure: Find the item in your Purchase History. Click on "want to return". Clock on reason: Not as described. Your seller will have 3 days to respond, either with a prepaid return label or with a refund, signaling that you don't have to return.
Please read the MBG.
grann-4629
OP5 months ago@soh.maryl Did that, thanks. That's when I got this:
I am just going to hang back and see what happens ... let eBay AI figure it out 😎😎
kensgiftshop
·5 months agoIs that the seller with negative feedback for selling fakes?
grann-4629
OP5 months ago@kensgiftshop I count not find any negs referring to fakes. See my previous post.
kibble-net
·5 months agoIf the seller wants them back, they will supply you a label to send them back. Worst case scenario, if the seller does not respond, you can open an INAD case and ebay will give you a return label to use at the seller's expense. If this seller does respond, I have a feeling they will simply give you a refund rather than spend more on shipping, that would be the wise move for them. But you are not on the hook for any more shipping costs as the buyer.
If the seller is able to take responsibility for this and resolve it quickly, they deserve at least a neutral feedback in my opinion. Selling pirated media is something you really need to be careful about, as a seller you risk losing your account if you get caught.
grann-4629
OP5 months agoas a seller you risk losing your account if you get caught.
That's why I am giving the seller an opportunity to respond - I don't want any seller to get axed because of me 😎
simba6
·5 months agoYou have to file an item not as described case. If the seller provides a paid return label , then yes , you will have to return them for a refund.
Are they burned copies? They are not silver in color?
grann-4629
OP5 months agoThanks for response.
These are definitely burned copies and they are silver. They are also not dual layer format as described in the package artwork. This is a Netflix series with all kinds of warnings about copying etc on the original artwork. Don't know if Netflix is a VeRO member, but I assume they don't like their stuff being stolen.
I will do the INAD thing if I don't hear anything from the seller within a day or two - i mentioned that in my message to the seller. I hate to do this - it's an extra hassle for me in an otherwise perfect buying environment.
btw, the only picture shown in the description is of the front cover of the artwork - if it showed either one of the two DVD's, I would have passed. If the description said it was two DVD's, I would have passed - the real set has three DVD's with full artwork on each disk.
The seller stated that the buyer would receive the exact item in the picture(s), so I guess I'm a bit happier that I didn't just receive a copy of the picture 😎
gator08041971
·5 months ago@grann-4629
File the INAD. The seller will most likely just refund. This is the common practice when they get caught. These bootlegs are a plague, especially with regards to shows with multiple season "sets".
Look up Star Trek Voyager for example. Pretty much all the ones showing the set in one box with the Captain on them are fakes. I mistakenly ordered a set last year, not only were they fake, they stunk, and when inspected they had no CC protection, and were single layer discs, pretending to be dual layer, but the shows had less than half the bitrate they should have. I instead bought the original seasonal versions, which were all sold separately in nice fancy slide open boxes.
To date, that show has never been re-released on Bluray either. Nor has DS9. Only STNG has. I have encountered a total of 3 shows that were bootlegged. Voyager, Clone Wars, and Picard. Two of the three just refunded immediately. The third had me send it back. All of them were verified to be bootleg, which isn't hard to do. I have also gotten two disney movies that were blurays, but were also bootleg versions. Had Asian printing, and none of the artwork lined up with a real example, including the print on the disk. Plus the read side of the disk was dark blue, which is a disk that is manually burned, not factory printed.
grann-4629
OP5 months ago@gator08041971 Thanks for that info. The series I thought I was buying is the first season of 'Wednesday'. There are real sets issued on DVD for a very few series' from Netflix, including this series. They have a form for reporting bootlegs of this and other series like 'Stranger Things', but it's long and they want too much personal information. They do take down bootleg listings on eBay, but this one only had one pic of the cover art so I don't know how they could determine it's a fake.
There are listings for the real set on eBay, at higher prices, of course. I don't want to buy a Netflix subscription as this is probably the only thing I would watch.
gator08041971
·5 months ago@grann-4629
Yeah, I now run my own Jellyfin video server for the home here. We don't even have DVD or Bluray players anymore. I just buy the shows/movies I want and add them to the server and I have my own personal "Netflix" that I can access here at home. Not only that, you can add photos, home videos, music, etc to it. And then you can watch it on any device, TV, phone, tablet, computer, etc.
Only catch to it, is you need a dedicated computer that is running 24/7 with a lot of storage space, especially if you want the videos to be of decent quality bitrate. I think mine currently is using around 20TB of space. Legally, you can do this with anything you already own, and only if you are using it for your personal private use. Same as if you had bought music CDs and made a personal disk with a mix of songs from different CDs or put them in iTunes and played them on your iPod/iPhone. No different really.
Obviously there are steps and software and some learning needed to do all that, but once set up, its easy to do.
grann-4629
OP5 months ago@gator08041971 Sounds like a cool set up, and as long as you are not sharing this stuff with others outside of your home, you should have no problems. Nowadays you can get a monster size drive at a reasonable price ... lots of storage space for quality copies.
I am using an iPad for everything on-line now. I think I saw every Microsoft error message at least twice when I was using a PC. Only thing I really miss is 'Flight Simulator'.
gator08041971
·5 months ago@grann-4629
Nowadays you can get a monster size drive at a reasonable price
Unfortunately, not anymore. The large drive prices skyrocketed not long after the memory prices did. I bought an 8 and 10TB drive last year for less than a 100, now you can't find them for less than 300-400. Fortunately I was able to get a supply of 4TB drives not too long ago. (28 of them) for about 300. For over 100TB of space, not bad. Can't even get those that cheap now. Ugh.
But it will go back down eventually.