ALERT: Fraud and home invasion
Do not purchase any high value items such as jewelry, coins, or collectables on eBay. Bad actors have been known to study the purchases and patterns of high value buyers, attract the buyers attention with items based on this open information, and create a fraudulent sale to garner said buyers address. This address is then targeted for home invasion as these bad actors calculate the buyers purchases and assign a value to the targeted home. The fraudulent seller is paid a fee based on the information provided to organized criminal gangs. eBay is desperately trying to stifle any reporting of this growing crime. another example of eBay putting commissions above the safety of your home and family. #eFraudhomeinvasionscam
55 comments
mudshark61369
·8 months ago@pemur-7509 ,
"Bad actors have been known to study the purchases and patterns of high value buyers, attract the buyers attention with items based on this open information, and create a fraudulent sale to garner said buyers address".
With millions of ebay members in the U.S. alone it would take a lot of time and effort to cull trough buyer's feedback profiles to TRY and discern who the mostly high end buyers are.
Why would they bother listing high end items on ebay to get addresses, all they have to do is search for cities with a high percentage of wealthy residents. They can search realestate sites to identify them. Even of some were to buy from their listing(s), it doesn't mean there will be more expensive swag in those homes.
There are several multinational theft rings active in the U.S. mostly from South American countries, and they target those communities. They do comb through social media posts from those areas, to find out who is posting about going away. If they notice a high number of people from one area will be away they scout the neighborhoods to get an idea of the residents habits, and when they change from normal activity they strike, mostly targeting homes backed by wooded areas or empty spaces where entry can be gained with less chance of being seen. Those theft crews are known to use advanced tools such as Wi-Fi jammers and surveillance equipment to evade security systems and track homeowner routines as well.
All of those Social media links you posted don't mean squat. If you were to ask the ones posting them if they actually use ebay, they probably wouldn't reply. I'd be willing to bet that those people advertise on their sites, and like news stations they get more views when info about bad news is posted than their daily happenings.
You replied to @mr_lincoln yesterday writing:
"And if you think the Chinese sellers/swindlers aren't organized gangs I got a Bridge for sale on eBay for you...".
You are right about a high percentage of scams being perpetrated by China based sellers, but they do not have to break into houses to pull them off. Unfortunately the most common one, The fake tracking scam, is hard to beat because of Federal postal privacy laws. IMO those scams are tacitly approved of by the CCP govt. who own those warehouses where I believe the label addresses are changed.
There's no secret about China being the home of international brand, counterfeiting and trademark/copyright laws. It's a lot safer to sell someone a counterfeit high end watches, jewelry, sneakers, electronics, and other goods that might not be discovered until its too late, than to send crews out to rob homes who might get caught in the act.
Your assumption that many of us are ebay apologists is way off base. Yes many of us do sell on the site, but we also buy on it as well and are as susceptible to being scammed as anyone else. Except that we have learned what to look for to avoid being scammed. As sellers we do not want ebay's reputation dropping, it means fewer customers for our items. That's not greed but a principal of online selling. Marketplace, Craig's List are examples of that.
le-5262
·8 months agoI don't know...
my takeaway is a reminder to not be complacent about security.
Years back, we had a guy who was a Kirby Vacuum salesman
who was casing houses during his demonstrations
and then coming back and robbing them.
The OP doesn't sound all that crazy...
people do all sorts of weird things.
gone.c-33
·8 months agoThat’s just the thing though, people like OP take one real life example like yours then extrapolates on Facebook with like minded individuals using all the same buzzwords, ie “bad actors†and lazy nicknames ie “eFraudâ€, wastes taxpayers money with FOI requests whose results they are ill equipped to understand and you end up with a country wide network of organized criminals who watches every purchase you make while eBay know and does nothing about it.
Thanks a lot, Zuck…
r_lresale
·8 months agoI'm betting this story stemmed from someone who made a eBay purchase and then coincidentally had a break in and are convinced the two are related. Correlation doesn't equal causation and often the vague "proof" is nothing more than confirmation bias.
FOI requests don't waste taxpayer money because you have to pay an employee to pull requested info and redact personal and sensitive information.
christworks
·8 months agoYes, they do. However, the OP is alleging that "organized criminal gangs" are engaged in this activity. Not only is there are ZERO public evidence of this, from a practical standpoint is makes little sense when there are many other ways to achieve the same goal with less risk and a higher likelihood of paying off.
They could easily use public information that is accessible to find someone's home to invade. Take sports athletes, for example. There have been recent cases where some athletes have had their homes invaded while they were away. Certainly a sports athlete would have a higher probability of good payoff over a random buyer on eBay who bought some high end jewelry. Criminal organizations can easily track said athlete's schedule and daily habits to know when they were away from home. They would also likely have a good idea what is actually in the home. No need to involve eBay, where there is some security protection, or a random seller who may or may not be affiliated with them.
There are all sorts of scams they could run on platforms like eBay, but this isn't one of them.
christworks
·8 months ago@pemur-7509 What you are describing is not something gang organizations would do. There are way too many hoops to jump through, too many things that can go wrong, and absolutely no guarantee of a payoff, much less one worthwhile to make it worth the risks.
There are actual public records out there, including people's social media, that results in people being vulnerable to scams and to a lesser extent a home invasion. Rich people like to brag. Auction houses, like Christie's, would be better suited for what you describe as not only are there higher dollar items sold, but also because it is less anonymous and sometimes buyer names are published publically. Still, auction houses do not suffer from this problem.
I don't doubt a prosecutor told you this, but it wasn't because it is actually true. It is because you went into their office with this idea already in your head, and the quickest way to get you out of the office is to tell you what you want to hear. I've used that tactic many times.
mudshark61369
·8 months ago@christworks ,
You replied to the OP writing:
"I don't doubt a prosecutor told you this, but it wasn't because it is actually true. It is because you went into their office with this idea already in your head, and the quickest way to get you out of the office is to tell you what you want to hear. I've used that tactic many times".
I'd be interested to know if the OP asked the prosecutor if they used ebay often and were familiar with how the site works and what info is available to others not involved with a transaction.
bonanza125
·8 months agoYour warning goes for anything which is purchased online or sold online. This kind of behavior can happen anywhere. This is a forum to help buyers and sellers with questions and give advice. All information is private between buyer and seller. If anything suspicious does happen then it will be addressed at that time. Yes there is a risk. I think its more riskier as far as home invasions to do transactions in person though than say a shipping situation. Where it is always wise to meet in a public place to avoid situation which you described.
r_lresale
·8 months ago@bonanza125 Yes and I think it would be more plausable to be a target for home invasion by being in a wealthy neighborhood and/or porch pirates and thieves notice a lot of boxes stacked up on your porch from places such as eBay, @mazon, and other online stores.
bushda
·8 months agowell at least you shouldn't have anything to worry about Since you're not going to be selling any high value items and according to you you don't want to be buying them either so you're covered Bushda says
annadryl
·8 months agoOh, Buh-ruh-ther.
kathiec
·8 months agoNope, I can see everyone else's "feedback as a buyer".
Yes, you absolutely can see everyone's feedback as a buyer. Now, go to my feedback page and tell me the last five items I purchased. Not whom they were purchased from, the actual items. I'll wait.
To quote Buffalo Springfield, " Paranoia strikes deep, into your hearts it will creep".
ccomic
·8 months agoWas it a Hallmark Keepsake Ornament - KOC Member Exclusive - Fruit Dove - 2025 for $38?
The issue is the "feedback left for others" tab. I just hid my feedback because of this thread, lol
kensgiftshop
·8 months agoOnly you can see what you bought in your feedback.
ccomic
·8 months agoWell, hopefully I convinced @kathiec otherwise at least. One step at a time ...
I created a new thread describing the privacy hole. People can use that info for what they like. As I said, I just turned off my feedback.
I will say that for the average buyer, random people aren't going to know our account names, so its not a huge issue. Its not until we come here and post on these forums that we reveal everything we purchased for which we also left seller feedback.
kathiec
·8 months agoOh my, oh dear, be still my fluttering heart!!! 😮🙄 Now I'm absolutely terrified that a horde of masked hooligans is going to storm my house and steal my fairy tree!!!!!
ccomic
·8 months agoI wouldn't have dropped it in a public message if I thought it was important to keep private. I just wanted to show everyone here that their purchases as not as private as is generally believed. (And you specifically asked to have your purchases uncovered. ðŸ˜) If its not a big deal that there is a way to uncover them, then why does eBay hide them at all?
I was just trying to help people out. There is a definite contradiction here in the ebay feedback system. Things that are "hidden" on one page can be discovered in other ways. I really don't believe eBay wanted this information to be snoopable. Maybe they'll see it and change something. Maybe they won't. For me personally, I see no benefit in making my feedback public so I turned it off.
gone.c-33
·8 months agoSomeone with a lot of time and determination can often easily trace feedback left to purchases.
gator08041971
·8 months ago@kathiec
Now, go to my feedback page and tell me the last five items I purchased.
There really isn't a direct way. Though with some digging I have dug up one or two based on buyer feedback, but it has to be recent, and the seller that is linked would have had to have feedback from you. I can sometimes line up a purchase, but its time consuming and not exactly accurate. Just saying, its possible, but very difficult.
On that note, I do see the full seller ID that was purchased from on your buyer feedback, which I thought was odd, but maybe its always been that way when looking at buyer feedback, not seller feedback. Seller feedback hides the buyer ID. But the Buyer feedback doesn't hide the seller ID. lol
Ooof. I think I was late to the party. OH well.
kathiec
·8 months agoNot only late, but missed my point. The OP seems to think that anyone can easily go to someone's 'feedback as a buyer' and immediately see what that person purchased, a misconception borne out of the fact that they can see that information on their own feedback. I'm well aware that with some digging a particularly nosy person can *maybe* discern a few purchases on someone else's feedback. I hardly think a crime ring is going to go to that much trouble. And crime rings are, after all, the original subject of this thread.
roccotacodad54
·8 months agoWere you a target of a home invasion? Just wondering if you made a purchase on eBay and were then assaulted.
If that is the case it could have been one of many other reasons to be targeted not related to an eBay purchase.
Strengthing ones home and habits are the best way to avoid such things.
sammiea1460
·8 months ago"The fraudulent seller is paid a fee based on the information provided to organized criminal gangs."
Yes, in theory this could happen. This scenario or a variation thereof could also play out through a B&M store.
It seems to me selecting a target by neighborhood would garner a better payout.
wri-8727
·8 months agoThis thread made me think eBay was up for sale then I read about the home invasion in British Columbia Canada where an individual boasting about cryptocurrency investments led to exactly the same thing the OP suggests. How many eBay sellers use Google Street View I wonder?
soh.maryl
·8 months agoLet me answer that: Quite a few evidently according to posts we see here. Evidently it's fairly common for some sellers to street view their buyers' addresses prior to shipping.
r_lresale
·8 months agoI daresay we all have at some point but not for the reason the OP is implying. As others have said, a gang of sellers selling high dollar goods (that will mostly go to authentication) and cancelling just to get your address just isn't feasible or realistic. I preformed the search OP suggested and it's not there and OP hasn't provided 1 article of evidence.
Now it's the Chinese sending knock off electronics to spy on us?? Geez I thought that was what the Tok was for....
wri-8727
·8 months agoWell soh.maryl I understand there is an impulse in some people to take a peek at the eBay users home, (whether they like it or not.)
It is sort of like when trusting people used to share their email addresses on these very boards.
That ended when eBay deemed it unsafe because unscrupulous people were using eBay users email addresses to take a peek at computer activity, or something, without permission, (I am clueless about such things, thankfully.)
If there was only a way to keep your mailing address between the buyer and eBay for safety.
bushda
·8 months agoYeah Ebay will Continue to do everything they can to protect our privacy Do you know why because they too a part of this community And we're all better off for it too
ccomic
·8 months agoI tend to agree it could done on a "one off" basis by listing a $10K diamond necklace for $1000, sell the buyer's address once you have it, and then walk away from the seller account, but it could only be done once or twice per account and I think eBay has significant limits on the value of items that can be listed on new accounts.
Also, on items that need to be authenticated, does the seller even get the buyer's address? Or do they just get the address of the authenticator?
kh-urvashi
·8 months agoHi everyone,
This discussion has gotten a bit heated. Please remember that, while it is fine to disagree with others, discussion should always remain friendly and respectful as required by the Community Guidelines.
Thank you for your cooperation.
kensgiftshop
·8 months agoI think those bad actors would be more interested in the sellers that have hundreds of those items listed, then a buyer that might buy 1 or 2 items.
pemur-7509
OP8 months agoRemind me of the credentials that entitle the moniker of mentor. Is it your expertise in contract law? Or is it your background in consumer advocacy? No, you sell your wares on eFraud. If you want to know more about where this happened, review my purchase history in feedback, offer an item for sale or auction that is attractive to me based on your review of my interests and spending habits, make the sale, get my postal address and later cancel said sale. The details you ask for are available to any nefarious actors. There are much more sophisticated operations that criminal organizations employ to target high value assets and individuals, yet rockstars, superstars and mentors will pile on here to save their bread and butter. "Impossible" response is knee jerk and laughable. This is exactly the philosophy eFraud advocates, sales and commissions full speed ahead, **bleep** the torpedos. You've all experienced this when you began on eFraud. They know you're a newbie and this platform exploits inexperience. They will defend their platform to sell at any cost and it will become an organized effort. If you have any doubt, just watch it happen.
kensgiftshop
·8 months agoOnly you can see your purchases in your feedback.
pemur-7509
OP8 months agoNope, I can see everyone else's "feedback as a buyer". At the aforementioned meeting the question arose; why did Facebook marketplace get such bad press, albeit only for a short while, about armed robbery, murder ect. while conducting these anonymous transactions? So much so that safe exchanges were set up at police stations while the majority of LE complaints comes from eBay. I speculated that eBay will misdirect complaints to the eBay community who's main purpose is to shame the victim en mass with their collaborators("mentors") calling the victims stupid, misinformed, that can't happen, and your at fault for not knowing their secret little handshake. If you do get lucky enough to talk to a rep in the Philippines they sweet talk you into 'everything will be alright' and you never hear back. People new to the club will identify with this M.O. out the gate. The whole purpose is to get victims not to report by delay and victim shaming. Thank you for proving the point. Is that Natalie Merchant I hear singing in the background?
kensgiftshop
·8 months agoRight, but you don't see what the buyers bought.
ccomic
·8 months agoDidn't you just respond to my new thread? Look one message above yours in this thread. I can very much see what people bought if they left feedback for the seller. Its the real reason (other than snooping) that I turned mine off.
soh.maryl
·8 months agoYou have set your feedback as "private". No one can review it.
"Rockstars", "Superstars", "Mentors" -- No "bread and butter" involved here. None of us are paid.
soh.maryl
·8 months agoSo can you explain exactly how anyone, other than the actual seller, could obtain a buyer's information?
And, for this to work as you describe, wouldn't these folks have to have access to every single city, town, village and hamlet in the entire US?
If you want a chance to be believed, how about more details or a citation of where and when this has happened?
pemur-7509
OP8 months agoThe meeting I had was the result of a FOI request at my county prosecutor's office. Instead of pretending to be an expert, I suggest you do the same with keyword eBay. It happens on Facebook, everyone knows that, but this community is organized to suppress any negative information. You prove it with your ignorance." It's impossible on eBay" right.......
r_lresale
·8 months agoWell I did just that and nowhere did this alleged scam using keywords home invasion & ebay:
gone.c-33
·8 months agoPlease step away from the cesspool of misinformation that is Facebook, stop inundating your local offices with frivolous FOI requests and take a deep breath.
This is how Pizzagate started.
redmodelt
·8 months agoThe only person that can see the ship to address is the seller so the "bad actors" would not have that information. Could you really imagine the bad actors/sellers having contacts in every city and town in order to pass on that information! NOT! LOL
pemur-7509
OP8 months agoEvery town and city? You are small minded. Bad actors don't need contacts in every Hamlet, all they need to know is if you keep jewelry, collectables ect. to make it worth the trip to your home. They even know when you go away because you list that too. I sell a lot of gold bullion but I can't ship to you until next week because I'm going away. Criminals are much more sophisticated than you can fathom, especially for high value targets. Were not talking about selling your old sneakers. This site is full of acting out children pretending to be responsible community mentors. YES! LOL
klhmdg
·8 months agoI just dont believe this -
There is zero way that this could happen.
"bad actors" and "home invasions" from "fraud sellers" what a script.
This might make a movie of the week but most people would know this is way far out in left field.
There is no "open" buyer information. Organized crime gangs targeting buyers who got nothing seems pretty farfetched.
pemur-7509
OP8 months agoI had a meeting with county prosecutors office this week. This is the prosecutors office warning. Purchases are available for public view. Addresses are available to sellers, obviously. So how is it not possible? just another shill for eFraud because you have an economic interest.
kibble-net
·8 months agoCitation needed.
lacemaker3
·8 months agoNo, purchases are NOT available for public view. Nobody but the buyer can see all their purchases. Anyone else will see a masked ID like a***b, which is not the same for each buyer for different displays and different transactions. Each buyer will have a different masked ID on different pages, which makes it impossible to track a buyer from one purchase to another.
The only thing you can see on a buyer's feedback is the user ID of the sellers who left them feedback. There is no information at all about what they bought. For example:
Buyers can also set their feedback pages to private, which completely blocks anyone from even seeing what sellers they purchased from have left feedback for them. This would make such a scam completely impossible, with a buyer as the victim.
Each seller will be able to see the buyer's name and address only for their own transaction with that buyer. Even sellers cannot see a buyer's other purchases or transactions with other sellers.
The people you spoke with at your county prosecutor's office are slightly misinformed about this.
Sellers are more likely to be the victims of a scam such you describe, because the seller's return address is available to all of their buyers, and their inventory of items is visible on the site. This has been known to happen. Many sellers use a DBA and/or a PO box as their return address, to prevent this.
bushda
·8 months agoHey "economic interest" That part I understood is that what they mean by that they're compounding interest? You smart man
pemur-7509
OP8 months agoThis forum is designed to mitigate negative information. "Mentor" is a euphemism for stakeholder. Any negative information is castigated for your own economic stake which makes you a valuable member of the eFraud community.
kibble-net
·8 months agoCounterpoint: You have provided nothing but hearsay and anecdotes.
mr_lincoln
·8 months agoHi @pemur-7509
Well, first, the Mentors here are volunteers, that I will attest to since I am one and do not get paid for my services nor have any share in any eBay profits.
As to the topic of your thread all I can say is that what you described with Buyer information is completely plausible. Criminals are just that, criminals. If they can find a way to steal something valuable they will do it. Many criminals operate on the internet with various scams with little protection for those being targeted.
Buyers using PO boxes would of course have some protection against what you describe but the vast majority of Buyers simply use their own physical address. The problem is also not limited to eBay.
pemur-7509
OP8 months agoBut you do sell on eBay and you have an economic interest in preserving a platform that has alienated responsible parties and left a bunch of swindlers, fraudsters, and thieves to duke it out amongst themselves. When they see fresh meat, they pounce. eBay will tell you there's no way to police the millions of daily sales but they put zero effort into it because a commission is a commission. So, I get where your ethos comes from, let the buyer beware. What troubles me is that so many here dismiss the criminal element that thrives in your little club. Just look at the responses, not a one saying we need to do something about this. A slow death is inevitable. Youre all so blinded by greed, just whistling past the graveyard. New advertisements to make it look hip to the kids won't work, they're the most irresponsible out here. They have no idea about the obligations to contract after you hit that buy or sell button. "It was a good idea but we were so self interested, we did nothing to save it." Its an old story.
mr_lincoln
·8 months ago@pemur-7509
We started as Buyers in 2007 then started to sell in 2015. As to having any direct affect on preserving the venue I wish I could but the reality is that an individual Seller is currently only one of over 1.7 million Selling accounts.
I can tell you that in this space, The eBay Community, nowhere near the 1.7 million are active here. This is actually a very, very small sampling of the total eBay population, both Buyers and Sellers. Most members that come here arrive with a problem they need help resolving.
stephenmorgan
·8 months agoNot sure about that.
There have been many of complaints within these forums of sellers getting their accounts banned. Sometimes all the seller was doing was selling multiples of the same new items but they had no chain of custody to prove legal ownership of the items. Often people have stated their account has been banned with the only explanation from eBay is that they determined their account was unsafe for eBay members.
pemur-7509
OP8 months agoAnd if you think the Chinese sellers/swindlers aren't organized gangs I got a Bridge for sale on eBay for you. All the warehouses they've set up across the country to distribute the substandard, non UL listed electric devices, batteries, cameras, inverters items that access your wifi while they monitor your devices should alarm all Americans. Have you ever read the permissions you need to agree with in order to operate a device? They put kill switches in their systems (Google it) and after we saw what the Israelis did in Lebanon, I cant believe eBay facilitates these sellers with no oversite. BTW These sellers take their direction from the top down. Its all the same product, divided into little companies. That's how Communism works. And everyone here in the community will try to kill the messenger in a mad scramble for that cash. New eBay motto;
"we'll make a buck at any cost the rest is you and your familys problem when it blows up in your home or armed robbers show up at your door"
klhmdg
·8 months agoBet you have a stake in tinfoil.
I have zero stake in eBay and dont get paid by the company.
I dont care about negative information BUT fake and false information should be corrected.
Your information is false.
There is no way for people besides the seller to get the buyers address.
Now the seller could pass the address on to others but there was no sale, as you stated.
So what would they take?
Now pretend, just for a second, that I sold you a pretend 24k gold chain for $5000.
There is no chain. I just want your address. I cancel the sale and give your address to criminals.
When the bad actors show up at your house, do you have the gold?
This whole premise is ridiculous.