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A problem with USPS you need to know about!
Recently eBay was fooled by a Mail Fraud Scam. In effect eBay became part of the scam, because they didn't track the package and request a proof of delivery. instead, eBay heeded to a fake Poof of Delivery that the seller sent them. eBay became aligned with this fraud scam because they in effect perpetuated and advanced the efforts of the fraud. Here's how this scam was done... the seller sold me Fender Electric guitar. He was a Zero 1st time seller, but the listing "looked" real. He used eBay shipping tools to create a label. He then used the tracking number from that label to create another (cut and paste label) The label he got from eBay was set with a weight of 22LBS. The Cut and Paste label weight was 2 LBS / 2Oz. (not 22 LBS) The cut and paste label was not addressed to me, however it was addressed to a real address in the same town as where I live. So what was done was a label with a tracking code depicting my address and a written address that was not mine. The label was placed on a small envelope (not a 42" x 16" x 9" guitar box. Here's why this worked...the USPS uses the tracking number to route packages to the final post office, THEN...uses the written address to deliver the package, then they scan the tracking code and Wella, they just delivered a fake package to a different address and tracked the package as delivered. The seller followed up by sending a fake Proof of Delivery which included a forged signature. The Post office did a full trace and was able to step by step reverse engineer exactly how this was done. The provided me with a FULL REPORT and LETTER from the Post Office Inspector. I submitted this to eBay and they still settled the case against me, in effect calling me a Lier. It was a huge effort for me to research all of this, I have been with eBay for 25 years, have 100% feedback and 5 stars in all ratings on over 3200 transactions. The seller was a Zero Feedback 1st time lister. I'm very disappointed. Happy news!!! I submitted the USPS repost to PayPal who checked the details and got my money back for me. eBay Totally Failed. Lesson... Do your transactions with PayPal as your funder! Don't get run over by eBay. There are better ways to protect yourself!
kh-stanley1
·1 year agoHi everyone,
Due to the age of this thread, it has been closed to further replies. Please feel free to start a new thread HERE if you wish to continue to discuss this topic.
Thank you for understanding.
stulto
·1 year agoI met a few times exactly.
For my case, I could track and visited USPS office of delivery day and I got the Real Label which has a wrong name/address with same tracking. I sensed it seemed a scam and I ran to USPS station that day.
I filed as not received but ebay ruled it is delivered spite of the proof (photo copy of wrong address).
Appealing brought just "ebay is keep original decision"
ON calling, CS repeated cannot cage the case. Ridicules ebay reaction.
The tracking tells different time stamp and delivered location (door or mail cluster), then ebay never listen and commented.
Day after day, scammer modified USPS label keeping same Zip.
No Proof ebay accepted.
Weird ebay, part of scam.
ittybitnot
·1 year ago@stulto
You have posted to an OLD discussion from last year. The mods are going to close it to responses. You may wish to start your own discussion to get the latest information on this same scam that has been going on here for over a decade.
For a quick overview of your options available, read this one:
https://community.ebay.com/t5/Buying/Seller-is-a-Liar-and-Cheat/m-p/35108131#M522799
mudshark61369
·2 years ago@1765gt,
This is the 4th topic you have written about this issue since February 15th. In two of them I have given you the information, you need to either win an appeal, or to contact ebay through their social media sites, where the reps can overturn a lost appeal and issue a refund.
However, all you want to do is blame ebay, or the USPS and argue with people who have given you good info and in some instances even called them names.
I will tell you one more time how to find those topics so you can see what you need to do to get resolution.
Go to the upper right corner of this page where you will see your avatar. Click on it and a drop down menu appears. Select My Profile, which will open your community board history. Below the banner you will see Posts and Replies with Post titles as the default. Click on the titles to be taken to those topics, so you can read what people have written.
1765gt
OP2 years agoWhat I'm hoping for is an answer from someone who works in eBay Managment who would be able to fully explain to me how and why eBay screwed this up so badly and how they plan to become more diligent and careful that they truly comply with their own policy.
soh.maryl
·2 years agoIt's very, very seldom that an eBay employee frequents these Boards so don't get your hopes up.
You've asked about this multiple times, have been given reasonable replies by knowledgeable people but continue to tilt at this particular windmill.
Unavailable member
·2 years agoSome would say that you are better off filing an INAD and sending back 22 pounds of trash. Not that I would recommend something against policy.
mudshark61369
·2 years ago@powell-memorabilia,
The label for the original item sent should have had a weight of 22lbs, not the 2lbs, 2oz, weight of the package that was sent someplace.
So if someone were to take your advice, the return label would be for the 2lb, 2oz weight and the 22lb. package would be returned to the buyer for insufficient postage. Since the scammer was able to alter the original label chances are they altered the return address, possibly to a vacant lot or closed business, so it could not be delivered, negating ebay's protections.
tobaccocardyahoo
·2 years agoSherlock Holmes is not on the Ebay payroll.
The Postal Investigation Service has some would-be Sherlocks, and rooting out postal fraud is one of their responsibilities.
When you take above average risks, you are more likely to have above average losses.
Why do I believe that this Fender Guitar from a brand new seller was priced at an irresistibly low price?
Con men have taken advantage of the greed of their marks for centuries. Most cons require that to succeed, those that don't require only ignorance.
gator08041971
·2 years agoI think they could probably curb the issues somewhat by simply not allowing you to create a label anywhere but on eBay, and that way the information related to the tracking number can't be changed. That doesn't help if they're manually editing the label though.
I was thinking that for the scam to work they were printing the label elsewhere and just putting the tracking number in for the details manually. I didn't even think that they might be manually modifying the label or creating a fake label with a legitimate tracking number.
I guess it just shows there's no bounds that a seller might go through to cheat the system and some buyers also go through a lot of hoops to cheat the system so there's cheaters on both sides guys.
1765gt
OP2 years agoI think your answer make good sense. What I'm hoping for is an answer from someone who works in eBay Managment who would be able to fully explain to me how and why eBay screwed this up so badly and how they plan to become more diligent and careful that they truly comply with their own policy.
mr_lincoln
·2 years ago@gator08041971 I suggested something like this on another thread somewhere as a potential solution for the Seller address or false tracking number scam that has been going on for a very long time. Sellers would be lose their Seller protection if they don't print labels through eBay. We've shipped over 9,000 items from here on three accounts printing all labels through eBay, no issues but some people use other sites, their choice of course.
mudshark61369
·2 years ago@mr_lincoln,
You wrote in reply to Gator;
"I was thinking that for the scam to work they were printing the label elsewhere and just putting the tracking number in for the details manually. I didn't even think that they might be manually modifying the label or creating a fake label with a legitimate tracking number".
I'm thinking the ebay shipping labels sent through Pitney Bowes to sellers are sent in an Unlocked PDF format, so the address can be altered by the seller/scammer before being printed out. The tracking number is not changed and automatically uploads. to the Order Details. Most likely the return address is modified as well. I do not know if that is true since I use my commercial USPS account to print out labels.
mr_lincoln
·2 years ago@mudshark61369
-Since the OP said the delivered package was an envelope with tracking then the Seller could have paid for the postage at the Post Office and manually loaded the tracking number to the Sold file, eBay allows that. That's the easy way to run the scam.
-As to an eBay label printed through eBay, that's easy enough to photoshop by taking a screen shot of the label and then photoshopping a different address in the same zip code. You then save the image and print that out. The Seller could easily list the weight as a couple of ounces to get their best discounted price.
-My issue is that eBay is not involved with the scam. I don't see where they are liable ... I could be wrong. If they were liable I would think there would have been lawsuits levied against them years ago on this kind of thing.
mudshark61369
·2 years ago@mr_lincoln,
A scammer going to an agency's store/office is one way the scam can be done, and I'm sure there are several ways a label can be altered. Of course sending something like a small empty box or an envelope, does save the scammer's money, they aren't dumb after all, and want to keep as much of the money as they can.
"My issue is that eBay is not involved with the scam. I don't see where they are liable ... I could be wrong. If they were liable I would think there would have been lawsuits levied against them years ago on this kind of thing".
You are absolutely right. However, the OP despite being told that over and over, through 3 other topics about this transaction, fails to grasp that point. They never posted the info about the seller or the item, in the previous ones either.
Like someone else who replied to this topic earlier said, the price for the guitar being sold by a (0) seller, was probably very good, to Too good to be true price to begin with. Of course the OP is not going to own up to making that mistake, because it's ebay's fault the seller was allowed to list the item.
tinsoldierunderground
·2 years agoAbsolutely agree, it's always along the lines of a 50s vintage Fender Telecaster or a Gold Top Les Paul for $400.00.😂🤣😅
kensgiftshop
·2 years agoYou would think, as long as this scam has been going, Ebay would do more to protect the buyers.
It wouldn't take much to check with the carriers and get the information they need to see it's a scam.
mudshark61369
·2 years ago@kensgiftshop,
It is the privacy policies of the shipping agencies that do not allow ebay access to label or package info. They all deny access to that specific info to anyone but the sender, in most cases. Some recipients who have special accounts with UPS or FedEx can access the info but ebay is not going to accept a screen shot or email as proof, because they can be faked.
That is why a scammed buyer has to jump through hoops to get a letter from a clerk on company stationary that can only say in general, that the label address did not match the one on order details page, and that the package type/size/weight was not appropriate for what was purchased.
kensgiftshop
·2 years agoI know the carriers won't give out certain information.
It shouldn't be to hard to call them and ask if this package was addressed to so and so and if they say no, they could refund the buyer.
mudshark61369
·2 years ago"I know the carriers won't give out certain information.
It shouldn't be to hard to call them and ask if this package was addressed to so and so and if they say no, they could refund the buyer".
@kensgiftshop,
The phone reps that work for the shipping agencies are about as reliable as ebay's phone reps. If you've ever dealt with trying to track down a package through their sites, you know that.
Since the reps servicing the U.S. ebay site are mostly located over seas they can't make the call. The Shipping agencies reps are admonished not to give out information to any party not associated with the shipping transaction itself. eBay being neither the sender or recipient is not entitled to it.
IMO someone in ebay and the other sites where the fake tracking scams are used, upper management, should be talking to the shipping agencies about either setting up a special dept. to handle the fake tracking scam, with a special code for each site, allowing their reps access to the label info, if only in general. However, reaching someone at ebay with power enough to set something like that up, is next to impossible. I doubt even the well intentioned blues who interact with the boards, have the pull to reach the right person at the corporate level. If they did a myriad of issues encountered on the site, might have been already solved.
krazzykats
·2 years agoIf you need to correct a printed USPS label, you can handwrite the correct address directly on the label. Here are some guidelines to follow:
Return Address: Print or type your return address in the upper left corner on the front of the envelope. Make sure it’s legible and accurate.
Delivery Address: Write the corrected delivery address parallel to the longest side of the envelope. Use all capital letters, and avoid using punctuation marks. Ensure that the address is legible from an arm’s length away.
Spacing and Fonts:
Remember that a return address is required on most mail, and for Priority Mail Express, you must use a USPS-produced address label provided by the Post Office. If you follow these guidelines, your corrected address should be accepted without any issues!
Maybe the Post Office needs to disallow handwritten corrections on preprinted labels to eliminate theft by readdressing.
mr_lincoln
·2 years agoHi @1765gt
Don't drag eBay into a dishonest Seller's address scam. That would be like dragging Ford into you getting caught speeding in a Ford Mustang. You are the operator, you are at fault, you get the ticket.
The Seller executed the scam, not eBay. You should report the Seller for Mail Fraud here: PS Form 8165 - U.S. Postal Inspection Service Mail Fraud Report (usps.com)
Sorry it happened but some Sellers make a bad name for good Sellers and eBay.
1765gt
OP2 years agoeBay has a duty and has a policy to protect its members. Legally in cases of fraud, Alignment is a charge that is often sustained against a separate party if they are in the position of being able to see that fraud may exist. This most often is charged if a second party stands to gain from the original fraud, which could be by means of a commissions or fee. It is aggravated if they are in a position of trust and have the tools to detect fraud. In this event, proof from the USPS was provided.
tinsoldierunderground
·2 years agoWe hear these stories all the time... usually they come from new inexperienced buyers.
You've been a community member since 2008? You must not come on these boards very often.
I agree with @mr_lincoln .
1765gt
OP2 years agoUnfortunately, although you would think eBay would "hear these stories all the time" (your quote) the people at eBay Act as if they never heard of this? How long has eBay been in business, perhaps longer then since 2008? This must happen to the inexperienced Custom Service people at eBay all the time, right? Perhaps? One of the Custome service people I spoke too referred to himself as a shipping problem expert, yet when I explained the issue, he told me he had never heard of such a problem before, such an expert?
tinsoldierunderground
·2 years ago@1765gt
Ebay CS reps are just about useless. The ones you contact from this site read from a script, and are based on the other side of the globe. Have you tried contacting on social media? Ebay for business on facebook.
I'm sorry this happened to you... but just so you are aware, ebay has no clue what goes on on these boards.
They rely on community volunteers to act as a buffer zone here, for the most part.
1765gt
OP2 years agoThanks for your message. I did follow up with eBay on social media but didn't get much of a response. I was really surprised how the mail delivery was done. One would think that the Tracking Bar code would totally determine the package destination right up to the final delivery address. To find out that they use the written address for the carrier to make the final drop of the package is really weird to me. Seems like this is a defect that should be easy for the USPS to fix. PayPal ultimately got my money back. I did a bunch of research, I even found the same guitar on Facebook, presented by a man in Russia named Surge. I think he was the one who forged my name spelling it "baZZy" on the fake Proof of Delivery Document he sent to eBay and eBay sent me to prove that the guitar was delivered and that I was lying to them and making up this whole thing for the fun of losing about $973.
mudshark61369
·2 years ago@1765gt,
If you had read some of the replies you received in the first 3 topics you wrote about this same issue, you would have known what information you needed to give the social media reps, in order to get a refund.
vandykrew
·2 years agohasdlfkjsef dasf
kensgiftshop
·2 years agoThey need to go back to limiting new sellers on how much they could list.
12345jamesstamps
·2 years ago"Zero first time seller"....that's a red flag.