A new scam
I have been buying on eBay a lot nearly every day for my business for the last 9 years. Recently I have dealing with a new seller-side scam attempt. This one has been the most elaborate, most difficult to defeat scam attempts that I have ever encountered, and the case is still ongoing. Basically what happened is that an item got delivered to my PO Box. The seller then called my local post office several times that morning claiming that I had not paid for the merchandise. They were able to persuade someone at my local post office to approve a package interception outside of the regular online process for intercepting packages. So the package ended up getting returned to sender, but the worst part is that the post office coded it as “refusedâ€. When a package is refused, that completely eliminates the Money Back Guarantee. I’ve been on the phone with multiple eBay CS reps and supervisors, and they won’t budge. (I opened an INR request.) The tracking on eBay shows delivered to me, but the tracking on USPS shows returned to sender. I have not escalated the case to eBay yet because I know the system will auto-decline me. I have made formal complaints with my local Postmaster and the USPS Office of Inspector General. The eBay CS reps are saying I need to get documentation from the USPS that I did not refuse the package, but going about that is the most difficult process ever. The USPS had no problem telling me on the phone what happened, but getting them to do that in writing is nearly impossible. The USPS bureaucrats all practice CYA. I am currently dealing with a USPS agent from the Consumer Affairs division. Overall this ordeal is totally ridiculous. eBay is protecting the scammers. Any tips, comments, or advice are appreciated. Thanks
christworks
·7 months ago@royal_metals_designs You can actually do an intercept over the phone. I realize the USPS website says you cannot, but you can when fraud is suspected. In my own case the buyer used a stolen card to make the purchase, which I was notified about two days after I shipped it.
The buyer had actually called USPS and pretended to be me and had the package rerouted halfway across the country. I discovered this when I looked at the tracking upon getting the fraud notification from eBay. I called my friend who works in a regional USPS office, and he directed me to call the toll-free number first so that the intercept was prioritized. I did, and it turned out the buyer had called pretending to be me and had the package re-routed. The initial intercept appeared to work and the package looked like it was coming back to me. Then, it started going south to the original destination. At that point I called the local USPS in that town and had an intercept by there to get it back to me.
Your seller told the USPS it was a fraud situation (i.e. you didn't pay), which is why they sent the package back.
Now, after telling you all of that, I'm going to be frank: I don't believe your story. I read all the feedback you have left other sellers, and I would encourage anybody who is thinking of taking up for you, go do that before you respond. Spoiler: This buyer probably has a 2:1 ratio of positives to negatives they've left sellers.
I see why they got their package back. Let me guess. It was a package of gold, and they saw all of that feedback accusing sellers of sending fake gold and you opening a return. No doubt they suspect you swap fake for real. I would given how many "problems" you seem to have.
royal_metals_designs
OP7 months ago@christworks wow you took the time to read all the feedback I have left. It seems like you to not know how to count or calculate a ratio. There are 1,130 feedbacks I have left, and 50 or so of those are negatives. 50 might sound like a lot of negatives at first hand, but you need to put it into perspective. You can easily see that I have 5,233 positives, over a span of 9 years. Over that time I have had 10,000+ purchases. Only half the sellers take the time to leave me feedback. I will admit that I need to leave more feedback, as I have only left feedback on a little over 10%. eBay does not have a policy that requires me to leave feedback, however, so it is what it is. By the way, you need to click 200 items per page to see them all.
But what I find really absurd is that you are on the scammer’s side. Tell me then, why do you think it’s OK that the seller has their item back and still has my money??? Tracking shows delivered back to sender.
Lastly I must thank you because the first part of your reply is actually very informative. It seems that anyone can call USPS crying out fraud, and get the package returned. The local USPS clerks purportedly don’t have the ability to scan these types of returns as intercepted, because that’s only possible through the online process, and so they scan them as “refused†which eliminates eBay money back guarantee.
roccotacodad54
·7 months ago" The tracking on eBay shows delivered to me"
Hmm. Myself I think I'd wait a day or three (or more) and if the tracking on eBay shows the same I'd maybe think about approaching this from a different angle (INAD?)......................
campanaelia
·7 months agoDoes the USPS actually have an entry to show the package was intercepted by the shipper?
I ask because their reasons for RTS are very limited.
I've had similar issues with postage due packages being refused. USPS has no way to enter postage due so it only shows refused putting the burden of proof on the buyer with ebay.
royal_metals_designs
OP7 months agoThe USPS did not put an interception entry in the tracking, otherwise it would have been an easy INR win. My local post office is on alert about this and I’m confident that they will never let it happen again. Right now I’m trying to get USPS to either correct the tracking or give me some kind of incident report that I can submit to eBay.
eburtonlab
·7 months agoThat seems like a very odd scam that relies heavily on the participation of the recipient's post office to jump through hoops and violate post office policy. It also relies on the seller being able to get in touch with the just right person at exactly the right time to intercept the package without affecting the tracking showing delivery. Sounds risky and weird. I doubt it would work twice.
Ultimately if it is an issue of "false tracking" then it can be treated like any other "false tracking" situation, which has well-known solutions.
royal_metals_designs
OP7 months agoIt is very odd, and I’ve trying to think too how it would work on a large scale, meaning scamming groups trying to pull this off at multiple post offices. I use a PO Box, and presumably the seller did not know this before making the listing, but they knew after. I am trying to think how it could work against a buyer with a regular address. The scammer is able to get text notification alerts, so they could call whatever the local post office is and present a bizarre story. It’s called a social engineering attack. Scammers will try any angle they can get. It can even be something probabilistic, ie they try it on a 100 listings, but if it works on 20% of them it will pay off. eBay has been very good at blocking all of the obvious scam attempts, so the scams will only get more tricky.
kensgiftshop
·7 months agoIs this the same item you left neutral feedback for saying you were refunded or a different one?
royal_metals_designs
OP7 months agoThis is a different case. In the case you are referring to, the seller intercepted their package through the proper online channel. I left a neutral because I was not happy that the seller basically backed out of the contract after I had paid, and I still had to go through eBay CS to get refunded. No regrets on leaving the neutral.