Buyer always beware on used consumer electronics products even when seller says fully tested/works!

[spindriftusa]

I sold several (10) used consumer electronics products years ago on ebay auctions so I speak from experience, and willing to take a chance, I recently bought some used electronic items on ebay.

Unless the item was originally purchased by the seller so he/she could tell you how frequently it was used, it's so-called "use history", it is hence difficult to determine that and naturally when there are numerous features/functions it is not known if everything actually works as it should or not.

Cut to the chase. I purchased a stereo receiver (identical model to replace mine that was forever stuck in the PROTECT mode) with 5.1 DTS surround sound and from the description of it, wrongly assumed that the unit was fully functional. As soon as I took delivery of it and upon plugging it in and powering up, I immediately heard that dreaded sound of relay chatter (rapid clicking on and off of one or more switching relays within the unt). Not a good sound when you have some technical background.

I tested the unit in it's standard 2 channel mode / 2. 1 mode using a powered subwoofer and it worked fine after being tested for 48 hours straight. It was then when I attached a center speaker and two rear speakers and used the remote control's sequencial test tone feature that I discovered that neither the center speaker (center channel) was functional nor was the rear channel (surround).

Adding insult to injury, the shipping cost was more than the price of the unit but local pick-up was available in my particular case, and that of course waived the inflated shipping cost but a big snow  storm was coming and I played it safe having it delivered to my door.

I communicated once with the seller and they did apologize that I was having trouble with the item and asked if it could be repaired. Realistically, anything electronic can repaired but as to what cost is the determining factor for an item that is many years old.

[the*dog*ate*my*tablecloth]

Did you try filing a SNAD with Ebay? From what I've read buyers have won a lot of claims when the item did not do what the seller promised it would. Even on used electronics.

[lintbrush*]

That was a lot to read 

And the answer is real simple.

You are covered by the Money Back Guarantee.

If you receive an item that is not as described (not working properly when it was stated it does), then you are entitled to return it for a full refund and return shipping expenses paid by the seller.

The seller sounds like they are trying to salvage the sale (as they'll be out a lot of money on shipping).  If you think the unit can be repaired, you can find out the potential cost and see if the seller will cover it.  If you think it isn't worth it, return it.

[*eponymous*]

Many/most sellers buy from garage sales, thrifts, goodwill, dumpsters, etc. and don't know an item's provenance.

Assuming the item was listed as "used" without any notice of the defects you have discovered...

You can find the item on your purchased items page - look to the right for "more actions" and click on "return item".

The seller pays for return shipping in an "item not as described" claim, and you get a full refund.

I wouldn't get into the repair end of things.  It is often seen as an attempt to get a partial refund, or laying the groundwork for a seller to claim the item has been "modified".  Further, the item might not eventually be repaired to your satisfaction, and you would not have further recourse against the seller.

If you lose an eBay case, you can file the same "not as described" dispute with PayPal.  You can get PayPal to reimburse you (I think it's up to $45, but check me on that) for return shipping if both you and the seller are located in the USA.

[spindriftusa]

Thanks all for the very informative replies.

I do realize that some ebay sellers (having a storefront operation or working out of their homes) that advertise used/previously owned electronic items, may sometimes not be able to or simply do not want to bother with fully testing out the item before putting it up for auction or making it a Buy It Now item. Naturally, some sellers place an "As Is" notation in the description of a particular item or "Use For Parts". Obviously that is an entirely different matter.

But the story doesn't end here. I also had purchased,  from another seller, an old school VHS VCR to replace my elderly mom's one (the exact same model) that was shutting off abruptly during recording and playback and sometimes snagging and damaging tapes. I tried to talk her into getting a modern DVR supplied by our cable company but she's just more comfortable with continuing on using a VCR.

The VCR was listed as WORKS GREAT! No Remote. There was no problem about the lack of remote as my mom had the original and it was still looking and working like new. From the photos posted, it looked like it was in really good condition with front and top advertising stickers still on it.

As soon as it was delivered and in a nice new box and bubble wrapped really well, I unpacked it, plugged it in and nothing, no power. Checked the fuse, power harness and AC cord and it was fine.  So much for works great, right.

Seller was very nice during communications, and at first wanted me to box it up and return it but then decided it wasn't worth the hassle and gave me a full refund.

The moral of the story is, at least for me, no more used/previously electronic items will be purchased on ebay, no matter how good the deal may seem to be.

[dhbookds]

When you're buying used anything electric, there is a chance that it will go bad........either get jostled enough in shipping or just die pretty soon after receiving........ Any seller that sells something as working that isn't.....is just going to create a mess for himself because, as was pointed out......the guarantee is there to get your money back.

Your Mother would probably appreciate getting duplicate of her VCR. even if she (you) has to go thru the hassle of returning one that doesn't work.  It's all in what you want and how much you want it. 

I sell some kitchen appliances that are 40-50 years old.....and test them for working condition......but am aware some may die and I'm sure the buyers understand that also.   Of course, I've also bought brand new in the box items that haven't worked when I've brought them home and had to return.......

[tofu107]

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@spindriftusawrote:

I sold several (10) used consumer electronics products years ago on ebay auctions so I speak from experience, and willing to take a chance, I recently bought some used electronic items on ebay.

Unless the item was originally purchased by the seller so he/she could tell you how frequently it was used, it's so-called "use history", it is hence difficult to determine that and naturally when there are numerous features/functions it is not known if everything actually works as it should or not.

Cut to the chase. I purchased a stereo receiver (identical model to replace mine that was forever stuck in the PROTECT mode) with 5.1 DTS surround sound and from the description of it, wrongly assumed that the unit was fully functional. As soon as I took delivery of it and upon plugging it in and powering up, I immediately heard that dreaded sound of relay chatter (rapid clicking on and off of one or more switching relays within the unt). Not a good sound when you have some technical background.

I tested the unit in it's standard 2 channel mode / 2. 1 mode using a powered subwoofer and it worked fine after being tested for 48 hours straight. It was then when I attached a center speaker and two rear speakers and used the remote control's sequencial test tone feature that I discovered that neither the center speaker (center channel) was functional nor was the rear channel (surround).

Adding insult to injury, the shipping cost was more than the price of the unit but local pick-up was available in my particular case, and that of course waived the inflated shipping cost but a big snow  storm was coming and I played it safe having it delivered to my door.

I communicated once with the seller and they did apologize that I was having trouble with the item and asked if it could be repaired. Realistically, anything electronic can repaired but as to what cost is the determining factor for an item that is many years old.

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knowing what you know about electronics,why do you buy a used piece?

You should know better.

I dont buy expensive or business tools on EBay,it may be new but where did they find it?in someone 's basement orgarage or estate auction or storage auction?exposed to heat/radiation/moisture,dropped from high places,kicked around and stomped,you never know

[tofu107]

paypal offers free return shipping up to $35 but you have to apply before you file claim.

there is a limit of how many times you can get free return shipping,I think it is 3 times

[magicjohnsonsvariety]

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@spindriftusawrote:

Thanks all for the very informative replies.



The moral of the story is, at least for me, no more used/previously electronic items will be purchased on ebay, no matter how good the deal may seem to be.

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I've been repairing and selling electronics for 24 years and there's only one thing I learned, and that is any electronic item can fail at any time, new or used. 

From my experience, you're actually better off going with used over new if the quailty is better. New doesn't mean better quailty and it often means much worse quality.

A couple tips,

Check the sellers Feedback....throughly check it. Did the seller just write "WORKS GREAT"??.....that's such a generic statement and I would avoid sellers who say this and nothing else about it.

For older receivers and VCR's, stick to well known brands that were manufactered in either Japan, Malaysia or Singapore. The failure rate is much less for product made in these countries. If the seller can't be bothered to mention where his vcr was made, or doesn't show it in his photos, that's a red flag. 

[coolections]

@spindriftusawrote:

The moral of the story is, at least for me, no more used/previously electronic items will be purchased on ebay, no matter how good the deal may seem to be.

Very smart move. You already mentioned in your first post that you where willing to take a chance. You cannot expect an old VHS, receiver or any other older unit like that  to be fully functional UNLESS the seller specifically says they tested every aspect. It's best to stop buying those old units and just open your wallet instead of taking chances. Those items can be found in most garage sales so if you insist on sticking with the old stuff take a chance on those locally.

[spindriftusa]

Once again, thanks all for the very informative replies.

Yeah, for sure, some brand new electronic products can fail right out of the box, and definitely, a lot of old electronics products were built much better, far more reliable and dependable, and adhered to rigid manufacturing standards, unlike obviously what the standards are today.

What made me take a chance, a gamble, in the first case of the stereo receiver, was that I really like the features it has and my original unit worked flawlessly for many years of frequent/heavy use. And it is built like steel vault, massive heatsinks and power transformer. Quality built all the way.

I gave the receiver to my sister who is set up for 2.1 channel sound as her old Technics reciever is no longer able to pick up/capture a stereo (multiplex) signal. She couldn't care less about 5.1 channel sound.

The situation and the gamble purchasing the VCR was that it would [simply] pay off by making my mom very happy to be able to continue using a product that she felt comfortable with.

I am ecstatic to know that ebay and PayPal does offer some form of buyer protection though I do hope that as many people as possible do not have to go that route and are/will be overall happy with their purchase(s).