Has anyone else noticed how many deceptive listing are on Ebay now?

[con-4871]

My first post to the Ebay community.  I apologize if I should have done more research before posting.

I've always tried to make Ebay my first choice over Amazon for most of my small purchases.   But I can't help but notice that sellers seem to offer way more deceptive listings now compare to just a year or so ago. 

For example, our internet performance is so slow that we cant stream, so we tend to buy DVD's.  Over the last month or so, we purchased several DVD's on Ebay.   We always look at the "new" DVD's but sometimes they appear to be too cheap and when you look at feedback, you will often find feedback that says they are cheap copies.  We don't go there. 

So we often look for "very good" used DVD's or "new" DVD's from sellers that have really high positive ratings.  

This algorithm didn't work out well for us over the last month of so.  One seller offered several seasons of a series as over all "very good"  including a season that was sold as "New factory sealed".  

Have any of you ever had to open a new factory sealed DVD?  This one had plastic like saran wrap  somewhat sealed over the DVD - it fell off when I dragged my finger across it.   When I challenged the discrepancy, I was immediately offered a full refund, which I accepted and I did not leave negative feedback.  The seller also apologized and said that they bought the DVD's at an estate sale. 

The 2nd negative DVD experience was this. I ordered a "New" copy of the Centennial mini series.   When I go to open it, I find the same Saran Wrap plastic sealing the "New" sealed copy of this.  I carefully open the DVD case and find that the "NEW" first DVD is covered with fingerprints.  I check the other disks and find fewer fingerprints and smudges, but clearly not new. 

I make the seller aware.  Hear nothing for a few days and ask again.  I get an immediate (like AI)  apology and a full refund about a minute after I ask with a statement that they bought this "new" DVD at and estate sale.

These are the easy latest failures of Ebay for me to convey to you.  But just let me ask the community.   If one gets these "free"  items from Ebay, what should one do.  I have to admit, I never leave feedback when I get offered a full refund when I point out the problem  (unless the refund requires that I do).  But these sellers are taking away from Ebay's credibility.  And when I say "free" there is nothing free about it.  It takes time to evaluate the junk that they sell  and communications can get quite involved as I will explain in my next post to you, if anyone is interested.  

My next post will be related to this. 

The next two "cheating sellers"  are sales in a higher $ range - in the $40+ to $80+ range.  The next post will be about sellers lying and buying positive feedback, if anyone is interested.   For both cases, Ebay was involved or made aware.  I have a lot more questions about these harder situations where in one case, the seller connects with Ebay and asks for revised feedback in exchange for a full refund, and has Ebay connect with me. The seller then fails to meet their obligation as they come back with a counter offer. 

I'd really like to know what the community thinks about this before taking more action. 

And for the record, I've been an Ebay buyer for well over 20 years.  My current account will show me as being a buyer for 5 years or whatever.   That's because I've been unable to get my original account from 2002 or so to be revived because my original email account is currently unavailable to me, and my attempts to get Ebay to allow me access to my old account seems to be unable to be changed without access to that old email account.  

[con-4871]

Sorry to respond to myself, but I really am appalled.  I just read a message from one of my dishonest sellers. 

After I left negative feedback for an item that was clearly misrepresented here's their last message to me on Ebay, from just a few minutes ago. 

"Kindly understand that many customer service representatives are looking at your case and may not have the full picture as the messages span over a month and many messages.

If you would like a 100% refund, please revise to positive feedback."

I responded with this:

Really?

So this is how you guys keep your feedback so high? And Ebay is totally ok with that? Cheating customers and buying positive feedback when the customer notices in time?

I'm appalled and disgusted.

It doesn't work for me, and we will see if that works for Ebay and the Ebay community.

You said "Dear valued customer,

Really?

So this is how you guys keep your feedback so high? And Ebay is totally ok with that? Cheating customers and buying positive feedback when the customer notices in time?

I'm appalled and disgusted.

It doesn't work for me, and we will see if that works for Ebay and the Ebay community.

You said "Dear valued customer,

Kindly understand that many customer service representatives are looking at your case and may not have the full picture as the messages span over a month and many messages.

If you would like a 100% refund, please revise to positive feedback."

[tobaccocardyahoo]

When you buy NEW DVDs from an Ebay seller, that seller may not source any of their NEW DVDs from an authorized wholesale distributor.

On Amazon, other than some grandfathered older sellers, a seller who sells DVDs must prove they have an account with an authorized wholesale distributor.

Your odds are better of getting NEW when you pay for NEW.

That said, the demand for DVDs is so low that many sellers are doing whatever they can to make a buck, this applies to both sites. Lines are crossed and corners are cut.

The best advice I can give you is to buy from sellers you have bought from in the past who have not disappointed you.

There are many items that I will not buy from any seller I do not know, personally or by experience, or by size and reputation. You cannot rely on Feedback on any site.

[campanaelia]

You're being taken advantage of and they're hoping to string you along with their terms to get a refund to possibly run out the MBG  clock. You should stop communicating with these sellers. There is no reason to make deals with them to be refunded. Open an "item not as described" claim, then they will then be required to provide you with a prepaid return shipping label or refund you without shipping the item back. If they don't respond to the case within 3 business days, on the 4th day you can ask ebay to step in and they will refund you. You have 30 days from day of delivery to open a claim or your ebay buyer protection will expire.

I would also recommend getting faster internet so you can stream movies instead. I have only the basic speed from my ISP and have no problem usually. Here are some sites I use if you don't know where to look. They are free, no account necessary I also recommend using an adblocker with these sites.

https://ww16.0123movie.net/list/movies.html

https://5movies.lat/movies/

https://5movies.pw/movie/filter/movies/

[con-4871]

Thanks for the reply.  But it's not just about the listings that advertise as new.    Your reply suggests that one should assume that all Ebay "new" sellers should not be trusted.  I can't accept that.  IMHO Ebay should work to keep their sellers honest and the feedback honest.  Without that, what does Ebay have?  It appears to me that Ebay is more interested in immediate profits than doing the right thing.

Many of the "used" sellers DVD's don't meet the standards of "very good", "good", "acceptable" as defined by ebay. 

So what you are saying is that I should assume most DVD sellers on Ebay are being deceptive and so I should go elsewhere?  I get that, but only about 10-20% appear to be deceptive.  The real question is what to do about that 10-20% that are liars. 

I was hoping that some folks here could suggest how we might let Ebay know that this is important so that they might at least try to do something to keep their seller's a little more honest.  

I'm sorry to rant, but it's been a hard few days. 

[con-4871]

Thanks for your reply.    Please trust me,  if I could get better internet easily, I would.  We live in an underserved area, only option to get better speed is satellite (data limits apply- not condusive to streaming)  or space-x. 

So you really have me thinking.  Instead of giving these sellers the benefit of the doubt, just immediately go for the item as not described. 

I did try that once, not with a DVD, but with a portable hard drive.  When I received that drive, it didn't work. I contacted the seller within 2 hours after receiving said item.  They told me to return it, as they could not troubleshoot remotely.  After returning it, they refunded me the price of the item, but not the original shipping.   I made them aware that that did not meet Ebay's policy.  They then went on to tell me that the item was as described and it was fine, I just had some problem on my end that had nothing to do with the item in question.    I tend to be pretty careful before making accusations so I documented the serial number of the drive in the listing and more.  When I told them that they were wrong, they sent me a drive health output for what they said was my drive.  The only problem was that that health report included the serial number which didn't make the one the sold me.  When I pointed that out to them and sent a report to Ebay, they immediately refunding my original shipping charge.  They relisted that same drive a few days after I sent it back to them.  When I told them I would like to try to buy that drive again, they suggested that I shouldn't do that, as they couldn't guarantee iy would work with MY computers.  I watched them resell that defective drive again.  

There is no way for me to tell the next buyer that they bought a dud.  What are my options?  If I knew how to reach out to Ebay and tell them about my issue, I would.  But I don't know how to do that -  

[campanaelia]

Yes every return or refund should be done by opening a case. You don't even need to message the seller first. I usually do because many times a partial refund might be negotiated, but if you want a full refund and they're not agreeable and want the item back, open the claim right away. Keep all future communications documented through the case. It will help you avoid many of these issues you are having. It also makes things easier for the seller to send you the prepaid return label and the refund. They also can't drag it out because ebay gives them certain time frames to process the refund.

[campanaelia]

---

@con-4871 wrote:

 or space-x.

---

I've installed a few starlinks and they work great. The basic kit was all I needed for the installations I've done. It is also very easy to setup and has both 2.4g and 5g speeds. The only thing necessary is a smartphone you can install the starlink app on to program it. The kit comes with a 75' cable which is usually long enough for most applications. I'm not sure of the cost of the equipment or service but would recommend it especially for an area with limited choices, and trust me I'm no Elon fan.

[soh.maryl]

If you opened an item not as described case, you need to pursue it to a successful conclusion.

There's no reason or need for any back-and-forth communication with sellers.

And you can and should report that seller because that is feedback extortion which is not allowed.

[slyders_finds]

Deepdiscount and blowitoutahere have great deals for the most part on new dvds. They have accounts on Ebay and a website. I have purchased vinyl records and cds as well. Haven't had a bad experience so far. 

[tinsoldierunderground]

In any of these situations, you should just stop communicating with the seller and open a case through ebay, as @campanaelia suggested.  I understand your frustration, but none of us are responsible for policing ebay, nor are welcome to make ebay aware of these situations.  They'll give lip service, but only take action in the most extreme circumstance ( as deemed by them).  Ebay is as ebay does, and as long as San Jose is happy, they could care less what any of us think.   

[stevescho]

My experience across a  range of buy categories is that about 5% of items listed as new aren't really, but this thing about faking packaging or tags is even rarer. I did take a look at your DVD category, with a million listings, and that is all over the map, but I think there's enough there for you to select the real McCoy new where there's enough in the listing photo.  That kind of buyer scrutiny wouldn't work if you're buying 100s of discs, as in trying to stock a rental business in a 3rd world country.

[con-4871]

I apologize for not having a good understanding of how to report issues including feedback extortion to Ebay.  How does one do this?    When I choose "help and report" I get a very limited number of options like "item not delivered" and I think 3 others.     None of the choices fit the "extortion"  area and I was very disappointed to see that Ebay seems to not to be interested in including a choice like "other".    The seller was able to reach out to Ebay and ask for revised feedback.  Ebay contacted me with a copy of the request and said that they would guide me through the process.  But, guess what, no guidance through the process for me from Ebay. 

For the record here's  one of the messages from Ebay:

"con-4871 has 10 days to respond to your request, Dung.
The buyer will review your feedback revision request
Hi Dung,
Your feedback revision request for SEAGATE STDR4000603 Backup Plus 4TB Portable Hard Drive - BLUE was sent to con-4871.
Reason: The seller was able to resolve a problem you had with this transaction.
Message to buyer: we will process the 100% discount once feedback is revised
The buyer will have until Fri, May 03, 2024 to either revise the feedback or decline your request. If they decide not to respond or decline your request, please respect their decision."

Please note I revised the feedback -  after reading what Ebay  said:

"Message to buyer: we will process the 100% discount once feedback is revised." 

I revised the feedback from negative to neutral but continued to point out that I did have an issue.  Ebay hasn't "processed the 100% discount" and hasn't reached out in anyway. 

Below you can find the message from the seller promising a 100% refund for revised feedback.  I also have a message from Ebay stating that the seller will refund 100% once the feedback is revised.  

Also here's my revised feedback:

"I m revising my feedback for seller and upgrading from negative to neutral as after about 4 weeks from my initial complaint to them, seller reached out to me and offered a full refund in exchange for my revised feedback. Please understand that I did get several immediate responses to my earlier communications, but said communications failed to address my issue. I recognize that in the process of making huge numbers of transactions, mistakes and oversights can occur. Bottom line i

SEAGATE STDR4000603 Backup Plus 4TB Portable Hard Drive - BLUE

"

New message from: seller )

would you consider revising the feedback for a 100% discount? Sincerely, Passionate Staff

[con-4871]

I just reported the seller to ebay.  It took an hour or 2 to get someone on the phone, but I was pleased that I was able to get that to happen.  I was on the phone with Ebay for nearly an hour. 

I ended up talking to 2 levels of support.   The second level of support had all of my exchanges with the seller available to him.   When he asked me for  and overview of the problem I asked if he had the messages available and he said yes.   I pointed him to a key one where the seller promised a full refund in exchange for revised feedback.   I asked him to please read it or I could read it to him.   I ended up reading the key 2 sentences to him. 

"

Hi xx,

seller has asked if you can revise the feedback that you left for SEAGATE STDR4000603 Backup Plus 4TB Portable Hard Drive - BLUE (166460835327).

Reason: The seller was able to resolve a problem you had with this transaction.

Message from seller: we will process the 100% discount once feedback is revised

You'll be able to revise your feedback until Fri, May 03, 2024. Or if you don't want to, you can decline the seller's request to keep it the same.

It didn't take long for him to get a pretty full picture of what had transpired.   I made it clear that the seller failed to meet what they promised in the email, and that they were continuing the deceptive behavior with these messages: 

because you only revised to a neutral, we can only offer you a 50% refund, please let us know if you accept 

Sincerely, 
Passionate Staff 
 

and

Dear valued customer, 

Kindly understand that many customer service representatives are looking at your case and may not have the full picture as the messages span over a month and many messages. 

If you would like a 100% refund, please revise to positive feedback. 

Sincerely,
Passionate Staff
 

The way I left it with Ebay is that they sent the seller a message explaining that I had complained and they have 3 business days to resolve the issue.    I followed up with the seller with yet another message:

"Yes many messages. So let me just add one more.

I just reported to EBAY and spent the better part of an hour on the phone with them explaining our situation and pointing them to the most important of the 25 messages or so that we've exchanged to provide them with a full understanding of the situation. They now have a full understanding of the issue and have access to all of our messages including where offered a full refund in exchange for revising negative feedback.

The conversation with the first level support didn't go very well, so please disregard the first email request to return the item for a refund. The second level of support was able to get a much more full picture of the situation and I would ask you to please consider that second email from Ebay carefully that gives you 3 days to resolve our issue.

The way I left it with Ebay, is that I should connect back with them no sooner than Tuesday, May 14 (after the 3 business day window that they provided you) if we haven't been able to resolve the issue. I asked them to look into reverting my feedback from neutral back to the original negative feedback if seller fails to meet their promise and they said that they would do that. And in any case, they made me aware that I am free to offer follow-up feedback for you where I can explain about reneging on your promise for a full refund in exchange for revised feedback.

I'm hoping to hear back from you before the end of the 3 day window."

Not sure if anyone cares how this plays out, but I want to thank you all for your input.   I was getting ready to give up on Ebay, but your support and the fact that Ebay gave me an hour of phone time makes me take pause.  I'll keep you informed of the outcome if any of you are interested.  if not, I get that too.  Just let me know if I should continue to post. 

From Ebay: 

Your post has been changed because invalid HTML was found in the message body. The invalid HTML has been removed. Please review the message and submit the message when you are satisfied.