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Community Member
Posts: 48
Registered: ‎05-26-2005

Auction Interference

Thanks pinks for the explanation posted on May 26th. But you seem to be operating in a 'vacuum' as you put it and not taking the matter seriously.

There are THOUSANDS of attempted frauds going on. If a member sees a fraud taking place they can

1) do nothing and let the fraud take place.
2) tell ebay - who ignore the member (just see the posts of the members who have tried to report these to you).
3) warn the potential victim.

Let us be realistic here, eBay can not be expected to police their own site, it can not work like that.

Your income is derived with the sellers, not from the buyers, so your loyalty is to the seller at the expense of the buyers.
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Community Member
Posts: 40
Registered: ‎04-18-2004

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
The problem is the result could be something like "No good deed goes unpunished" You never know for sure who you are warning when you attempt to contact a bidder during an auction. If the seller is conducting a fraudulent auction, it wouldn't be a big leap for them to perhaps shill bid their auctions to drive up the price. So here you are trying to be the good guy and you email all of the bidders telling them SCAM, RUN FOR YOUR LIFE! Well, the seller aka shiller gets your email, forwards it on to eBay. Just when you're thinking you did the right thing, you get a nastygram from eBay. Perhaps it even is a suspension notice.

Like I said, you never really know who you're dealing with or emailing so it's best to just report to eBay your suspicions and let them work it out. I'm convinced that under RobC leadership there is a concerted effort to put a halt to fraud on their side. The problem it seems is the scope and breadth of internet fraud is already well beyond the means of both manpower and technology to really contain it.



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Community Member
Posts: 48
Registered: ‎05-26-2005

Re: Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
I'm convinced that under RobC leadership there is a concerted effort to put a halt to fraud on their side.

If so why would they try to prevent the most effective warning system there is - the eBay membership. There are just a few guys at eBay doing anything about it, not enough.... There are THOUSANDS, if not MILLIONS of eBayers willing to help clean up the sites, eBay are not taking it seriously. We seem to be hitting our heads against a brick wall, the rogue sellers and fraudsters are being cushioned by eBay.

If I warned a London or New York Auction House that an item they were about to sell was a forgery they would at least check it out, not threaten to bar me if I ever told anyone it was a fake!
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Community Member
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎11-02-2004

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
gb1887,

If members were allowed to email other members without consequence, a lot of disgruntled members would be screaming fraud to bidders just to get even with members they have a grudge against. Is that fair?
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Community Member
Posts: 32
Registered: ‎02-26-2003

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
Not to mention sellers emailing buyers warning them of their competition.

Wouldn't be good.

T&S KKC Member Number 9 Number 9...

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Community Member
Posts: 48
Registered: ‎05-26-2005

Re: Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
It is my view that the majority of people are decent and honest. Yes the sort of scams you are talking about should be frowned on but the possibility of one scam can not be used as an excuse to do nothing.

But there is a genuine need for a warning system from experienced ebayers to the novices. Or from experienced eBayers to eBay then from eBay to the novices. Ebay are not experts in any of the collecting fields, they are rank amateurs, but are ignoring the help and assistance taht is being offered to them.
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Community Member
Posts: 125
Registered: ‎11-01-2004

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
"But there is a genuine need for a warning system from experienced ebayers to the novices. Or from experienced eBayers to eBay then from eBay to the novices"


OH BOY NOW I CAN RID EBAY OF anyone SELLING any THING I Sell. (Would be easy to do with that idea)
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Community Member
Posts: 182
Registered: ‎08-19-2003

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
Thank you for reading my post about Auction Interference.

eBay has always had a team to investigate fraud and trust & safety violations on the site. That team has grown tremendously over the past nearly 10 years. Member reports of shill bidding, auction interference, and other violations are taken quite seriously.

Forgeries are another area, and one fraught with dangers. Some forgeries are obvious, others are not. eBay does not have a resident staff of experts in all of the areas that are sold on the site. In a few areas, eBay has partnered with recognized, reputable organizations to try to eliminate forgeries, such as in the Stamps category.

However, in some areas, even the experts cannot agree. Museums have retired displays of items that were revealed to be forged. They had the advantage of having the item to hand, for examination. eBay does not have any of the items listed on the site. So even if there were an expert or experts, to examine the object, the object itself is not present.

eBay has made and is making efforts to prevent fraud, but there is no way to protect everyone from every danger. The buyer has some responsibility to be knowledgeable about what he is buying, and what the actual process is. eBay sells nothing but a service. If you buy on eBay, you are buying from a member, not from eBay. It is up to you to check out the seller as much as you can, and to ask questions before committing yourself to purchase.

Obviously, the investment of the buyer's time and energy will be proportionate to the final price. One would expect to spend a great deal more time checking on the seller of a high-priced item, and getting provenance or other verification of authenticity, than one would for an inexpensive item.

Please do not expect eBay to take the word of any member about the authenticity of an item. That would be unfair to all involved.
Kelley
eBay Community Development
To contact eBay, click on "Help" on the Navbar at the top of your screen. "Contact Us" is on the left.


To contact eBay, click on "Help" on the Navbar at the top of your screen. "Contact Us" is on the left.

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Community Member
Posts: 189
Registered: ‎04-17-2005

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
The problem with reporting things to Trust & Safety is that most of the auctions for counterfeit merchandise is usually listed on Friday and last only 1 - 3 days. By the time they are reported they are over!
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Community Member
Posts: 167
Registered: ‎11-26-2002

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
Please do not expect eBay to take the word of any member about the authenticity of an item. That would be unfair to all involved.

But we know that they do! Despite not being publicized, some of us know that certain people considered experts in some areas are allowed to stop auctions for fake merchandise (such as coins and stamps) simply by notifying eBay.

That team has grown tremendously over the past nearly 10 years.

Perhaps, but judging by the very slow response to violation reports, eBay doesn't employ anywhere near enough people to deal with all the problems here. Many aren't trained very well either.
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Community Member
Posts: 182
Registered: ‎08-19-2003

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
Plan to come to the Brown Bag Lunch (see the announcement at the top of the board) to ask some of these questions of the people who run that part of eBay. Get the information from the source.
Kelley
eBay Community Development
To contact eBay, click on "Help" on the Navbar at the top of your screen. "Contact Us" is on the left.


To contact eBay, click on "Help" on the Navbar at the top of your screen. "Contact Us" is on the left.

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Community Member
Posts: 48
Registered: ‎05-26-2005

Re: Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
Hello again Kelley,
I am a coin collector, and if you check the boards there you will find how bad the situation has become. I am also British and use the UK site which has none of the protection the USA has.

There is no ccw there and the US ccw refuses to handle items listed in GBP. So almost all Chinese scammers list in GBP. Our reports are ignored, look at my thread on the little Hoard of Fraudsters, there are HUNDREDS of Scammers on there. All with VERIFIED ID - It is not available in China yet. I report these guys before I update the thread, then dozens of readers report them as well. But they are there every day, defrauding the novices. You really want us to sit there watching the newbies being ripped off?

There are so many 1804 US Dollars coming out of eBay that it will soon be one of the commonest coins in the Series.


It is against human nature to allow crimes to take place in front of your eyes and do nothing. Reporting to eBay is actually doing nothing, your procedures take too long, the fraud takes place.

There are some forgeries out there that the experts would have trouble with, but that is probably 100th of 1 percent. Have you seen any of the listings for fakes? What is your view on say the "1086" Ugandan dollar, or the flood of 1804 US Dollars, the 1866 Edward VII Hong Kong Dollars??? Please just have alook at them. What you are being told about not being able to ID fakes is rubbish, there are very few of us who can not identify most of the listed fakes.

eBay can not police the site, even Bill Cobb accepts that. So let the eBay members do it, there are a lot more of us than of you. We are the experts in our fields, you are the experts in hosting Auctions, You do what you are good at, and let us do what we are good at.
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Community Member
Posts: 48
Registered: ‎05-26-2005

Re: Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
Thanks caped...

You are doing some brilliant work on the boards. It is appreciated even if we do not say so.

Steve
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Community Member
Posts: 48
Registered: ‎05-26-2005

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
Good Morning Folks,
The Bullet Proof Chinese foreger is today listing using the phrase "Althrough I do". Search on that for his lastest batch of 1806 Trade Dollars, 1086 Ugandan dollars etc.

Have a laugh at them, but remember there are some people bidding on this rubbish. Current estimates are £33 Billion worth of fakes coming from China. That is about $60 Million Dollars -

Please remember every one of the bids on these is a guy being defrauded - you are watching a fraud in progress.
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Community Member
Posts: 23
Registered: ‎01-16-2003

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
"you are watching a fraud in progress. "


Unfortunately, it is not just "coins" that the China scammers are listing. For some reason, I do not think that eBay ever imagined it would be this bad.

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Community Member
Posts: 30
Registered: ‎04-14-2005

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
"Althrough I do"

49 listings - obviously counterfeit items.

Already have 13 bidders (victims).

Besides the coin itself being a counterfeit, I noticed this:

1) $15 GBP shipping (about $30 USD). It would seem to me that would be fee avoidance (although I have seen worse from the Chinese sellers). Since the item is listed on Ebay.com, maybe Ebay looks the other way on these questionable auctions with high shipping because the shipping/handling is not paid by Ebay or Paypal on a claim.

2) There are many current and former sellers with the exact same "word for word" listings - right down to the question marks in the title. (about 2 or 3 different descriptions - amongst about a dozen or so - only 2 were NARU).

3) Payment type is "other". But in the description, it says Paypal and a few had the Western union money transfer option too. why is "other" even a choice ????

Of course, being that the bid price under $25, there will be no coverage under the Standard Protection policy (and for other reasons).

And with Paypal, payments to China are not covered either.(they say they accept it, but do they ?)

And the final thing that really gets Ebay and Paypal off the hook - these auctions have various listing policy violations (particularily counterfeit items cannot be sold here), so there is no coverage on ANY items that violate listing policies. (and as mentioned earlier, many of the sellers have the ID verify icon which is NOT supposed to be next to any Chinese user's ID. It gives the buyers a false sense of security).

---------------

1741 SPAIN RARE SILVER coin

(another thing I noticed on these current and completed auctions was this: The pictures on all these auctions are EXACTLY the same. Look at the 3 specks under the X on the reverse side picture of the coin.)
Ebay - Home of the returning scammer.

...........

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Community Member
Posts: 48
Registered: ‎05-26-2005

Re: Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
I have been reporting that one for 6 weeks now, and others for longer.
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Community Member
Posts: 602
Registered: ‎07-26-2002

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
eBay has always had a team to investigate fraud and trust & safety violations on the site. That team has grown tremendously over the past nearly 10 years. Member reports of shill bidding, auction interference, and other violations are taken quite seriously.


LOLOLOL this is just my once every two months posting. I don't think I've EVER read such nonsense as the last sentence in my entire tenure on eBay. I'm not telling ANYONE on this Board ANYTHING they don't already know, but not only are the vast majority of reports NOT taken seriously, and not even read or comprehended properly. not only has eBay done EVERYTHING in its power to make the reporting process are painful as possible... But TO BOOT, the vast majority of frontline eBay employees don't even have the CAPABILITY to understand a report, no matter how clear and concise it may be. And this is a result of the priorities of Management. eBay spends MUCH LESS a percentage of revenue on customer service than any multi-billion dollar company that deals with the public does. By a factor ot two AT LEAST. One thing that IS correct in the above paragraph though- the "team" HAS grown tremendously in the past 10 years. In VOLUME, NOT ability or comprehension, which has regressed. The author of the above post knows it, her former boss Brian Burke knows it, Rob Chesnut knows it, and everyone who has any real knowledge of how eBay operates knows it. Quit um wizzing on our heads, then telling us it's raining.
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n.s.sherlock
Community Member
Posts: 4,937
Registered: ‎04-18-2004

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
1022, you are missed.

:-D
nss

Is this email for real? Protect yourself from criminal scam attempts
Respectfully, Norm
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Community Member
Posts: 167
Registered: ‎11-26-2002

Auction Interference

in reply to gb1887
tentwentytwo - Your post #18 is the BEST I have ever read regarding the real abilities of eBay employees. You have summed up the truth about eBay's customer service in one fabulous paragraph.

How very sad that it will fall on mainly deaf ears.
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