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runaway2da
Community Member
Posts: 4,013
Registered: ‎01-21-2009

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to katydidthat

katydidthat wrote:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-03-12/malaysian-military-denies-detecting-missing-plane/5314212

 

The Malaysian air force has denied reports a passenger plane that vanished with 239 people on board was detected on radar far west of its flight path.

 

Interpol has all but ruled out terrorism as the cause for the missing Malaysia Airlines plane, which disappeared on Saturday while travelling from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing, but the CIA is not so sure.

 

In one of the most baffling mysteries in recent aviation history, a massive search operation has so far found no trace of the aircraft or its passengers, six of whom were Australian.

 

Air force chief General Rodzali Daud was this morning quoted by Malaysian media as saying that radar had last detected the plane over the Strait of Malacca off western Malaysia.

 

That location would have indicated the flight had banked far to the west of its intended flight path over the South China Sea.

But Mr Rodzali says he "did not make any such statements," and that newspaper Berita Harian published "what is clearly an inaccurate and incorrect report".

 

Read more in the link.  


Malaysia was not the only radar tracking system on this plane to show that it went of course.

What is Malaysia trying to hide?

 

------------------------------------------

~The result of shielding men from their follies is filling the world with fools.~

~ There are as many paths as there are people to walk them, and that each person is the best judge of which path they will walk at any given time.~
Community Member
Posts: 3,755
Registered: ‎03-06-2012

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to runaway2da

Certainly it sounds like an inconsistency.

 

I think what I heard today was that the first reports were based on CIVILIAN radar (presumably the civil aviation), which said they lost tack of the plane while on its original northwrd path.

 

If I understand correctly, today's new info is from MILITARY radar.  I didn't hear a good explanation for why this info just came to light, but I suppose it's possible that after the initial search for wreckage on the planned flight path turned up nothing, the military was asked to check their radar data on other parts of the country, and then this new info came to light, from an area where they were not expecting the plane to be. 

 

 

 

 

katydidthat
Community Member
Posts: 3,874
Registered: ‎01-18-2005

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to runaway2da

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-03-12/malaysian-military-denies-detecting-missing-plane/5314212

 

The Malaysian air force has denied reports a passenger plane that vanished with 239 people on board was detected on radar far west of its flight path.

 

Interpol has all but ruled out terrorism as the cause for the missing Malaysia Airlines plane, which disappeared on Saturday while travelling from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing, but the CIA is not so sure.

 

In one of the most baffling mysteries in recent aviation history, a massive search operation has so far found no trace of the aircraft or its passengers, six of whom were Australian.

 

Air force chief General Rodzali Daud was this morning quoted by Malaysian media as saying that radar had last detected the plane over the Strait of Malacca off western Malaysia.

 

That location would have indicated the flight had banked far to the west of its intended flight path over the South China Sea.

But Mr Rodzali says he "did not make any such statements," and that newspaper Berita Harian published "what is clearly an inaccurate and incorrect report".

 

Read more in the link.  

**********************************Siggie***************************************

“Not even the apparently enlightened principle of the ‘greatest good for the greatest number’ can excuse indifference to individual suffering. There is no test for progress other than its impact on the individual.” Nye Bevan
runaway2da
Community Member
Posts: 4,013
Registered: ‎01-21-2009

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to tcmsecretuserid

tcmsecretuserid wrote:

Very true, Nana. 

 

 

They were able to track the plane, after contact stopped, and the plane did a U turn, and then was "lost". 

 

 

 


Not quite a U turn.

 

The plane turned off course 130 degress and the Malaysians knew this at the time that it had turned because they were tracking it. For some reason they saw fit not to tell any of the people that are and were searching for the plane. That they knew it's last know place and was not anywhere near were anyone was searching.

 

The plane did not go lost. It simply went out of the radar range of Malaysia. Which is 250 miles.

 

The Malaysians also knew/know that the the two tracking systems were either turned off or quit working at the time the plane turned off course. One of the system is the black box and the other is data system that reports the condition of the plane in flight back to the flight controllers. Both of these systems have three redundant backups. What are the chances that all three went down?

 

It would either take a catastrophic electrical failure for the black box and data system to stop sending or someone turning them off.

 

If there was a catastrophic electrical failure. The plane would probably not be able to fly, but it continued to fly. It was tracked on radar as continued to fly of course.

 

The problem here is and the question should be!

 

If the Malaysians knew all this from the get go.

 

Why did they not disclose what they knew?

 

Why did they allow millions of dollars to be spent on a search in an area that they knew the plane would not be?

 

Why did they not disclose that they knew where the last location of the plane and that the transponders and flight data systems stopped working at the time that the plane turned off course?

 

And that they tracked it after the flight systems stopped working. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

 

 

------------------------------------------

~The result of shielding men from their follies is filling the world with fools.~

~ There are as many paths as there are people to walk them, and that each person is the best judge of which path they will walk at any given time.~
katydidthat
Community Member
Posts: 3,874
Registered: ‎01-18-2005

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to tcmsecretuserid

I'll just clarify why I said the second sentence was silly.  

 

Other troubling details emerged when a telephone operator on a China-based hotline for KLM airlines confirmed Sunday that the passengers travelling with the stolen passports had booked one-way tickets on the same KLM flight from Beijing to Amsterdam on Saturday.

 

Where is the emphasis?  The one way tickets?  The same KLM flight?  That it was from Beijing to Amsterdam?  That it was booked for Saturday?  

 

I flew one way from London to Sydney shortly after the Lockerbie bombing.  I had ENORMOUS security guards surround me because I was travelling one-way.  I explained that I was returning to Australia (via Hawaii), and that I had a one-way ticket because I hadn't known how long I was staying in the UK when I returned there.  

 

Now, the scary thing here, is that they scrutinized most of my papers, asked me for proof that I lived in Australia ... BUT, I only showed them my UK passport which didn't have a visa for entry to Australia. They didn't pick that up at all ... and it was another trigger for terrorism at the time.  I didn't NEED a visa because I also had an Australian passport.  

 

 

**********************************Siggie***************************************

“Not even the apparently enlightened principle of the ‘greatest good for the greatest number’ can excuse indifference to individual suffering. There is no test for progress other than its impact on the individual.” Nye Bevan
tcmsecretuserid
Community Member
Posts: 6,427
Registered: ‎08-30-2006

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to lealta

 

My  tickets are one way... different airlines. I will eventually end up back at home, but not via the first destination, or airline. 

 

One way tickets do cost more. I agree. Sometimes it is necessary to book one way tickets, even if you eventually end up back home. My husband travels for work, and most of his flights are one way tickets, as he never returns to the last venue. Sometimes they meet the tour bus after they fly to a destination. They might pick up a flight to the U.K., then travel by tour bus, and fly home from another destination in Europe. Sometimes he gets a multiple destination ticket, and other times, he gets a one way ticket home. 

 

 

 

 

_____________________________________________________________________________
Bon mot boogie
jimmy*part3
Community Member
Posts: 1,818
Registered: ‎06-29-2011

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to lealta

lealta wrote:

  I hope the airlines check more carefully, on passengers who are booking one way.


From what I've read they already do. If someone on that flight wanted to go to from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing and stay there illegally they would book a round trip, otherwise they'd be closely scrutinized.

lealta
Community Member
Posts: 2,286
Registered: ‎10-31-2004

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to tcmsecretuserid

Well, I have 4 one way tickets booked this month, as I'm going to a few different places. So, I sort of think that is a silly comment too. I hope they don't take a closer look at me every single time I start to board a flight.

 

TCM, even though your ticket is booked with four destinations, does it include a ticket to return home from your last destination or are you going to book that later?  Generally speaking, when you book a one-way flight, it costs a lot more.  That's why most people book round trip.  A one way ticket from San Diego to JFK is $447.  A round trip is $696.  So booking one way twice, would cost you $894.  I hope the airlines check more carefully, on passengers who are booking one way.

jetscreameryouareadreamer
Community Member
Posts: 912
Registered: ‎02-18-2006

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to runaway2da
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/03/11/major-updates-in-malaysia-airlines-mystery-new-informatio...

What do you all think of the pictures of the two Iranians who were traveling with stolen passports? Why would these pictures show them with the same lower body? Why would anyone make the mistake of putting those out there like that? I saw the same pics on other sites, so it is not something the Blaze did.

That is just bizarre.
"They are imprudent: for they dash at their objectives without giving much heed to the risk of new abuses worse than the evils they hope to sweep away."
ipickubuy
Community Member
Posts: 13,756
Registered: ‎08-04-2004

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to tcmsecretuserid

This is a mystery and I hope it will be solved soon.  The families are going through hello.  You'd think if it was a terrorist attack then some group would of taken "credit" for it by now.  So many possibilities here.  

 

Maybe a kidnapping?


********************************************************************************

The fragrance always remains in the hand that gives the rose.

For the sake of others, please learn CPR. You could save a life.


tcmsecretuserid
Community Member
Posts: 6,427
Registered: ‎08-30-2006

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to lealta

lealta wrote:

I find the first comment silly, but I tend to agree with the second one.  Not many people book flights one way anymore.  It costs too much money.  So when they have a passenger who does only book one-way, they need to take a closer look at them. 


Well, I have 4 one way tickets booked this month, as I'm going to a few different places. So, I sort of think that is a silly comment too. I hope they don't take a closer look at me every single time I start to board a flight. :smileysad:

 

 

_____________________________________________________________________________
Bon mot boogie
tcmsecretuserid
Community Member
Posts: 6,427
Registered: ‎08-30-2006

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to nanapong1

Very true, Nana. 

 

 

They were able to track the plane, after contact stopped, and the plane did a U turn, and then was "lost". 

 

 

 

_____________________________________________________________________________
Bon mot boogie
nanapong1
Community Member
Posts: 3,429
Registered: ‎08-30-2005

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to tcmsecretuserid

I have to disagree with you TCM, unless you're not counting the actions of one or both of the pilots to possibly constitute terrorism. If there was a mechanical problem they were trying to solve, their first action would have been to radio their position and problem, possibly getting helpful advice. I think one or both of the pilots may have taken over the plane for unknown reasons.

katydidthat
Community Member
Posts: 3,874
Registered: ‎01-18-2005

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to tcmsecretuserid
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn25201-malaysian-plane-sent-out-engine-data-before-vanishing.ht...

**********************************Siggie***************************************

“Not even the apparently enlightened principle of the ‘greatest good for the greatest number’ can excuse indifference to individual suffering. There is no test for progress other than its impact on the individual.” Nye Bevan
tcmsecretuserid
Community Member
Posts: 6,427
Registered: ‎08-30-2006

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to katydidthat

I read the article, Katy. 

 

Yes, one of the guys was only 18, and he was trying to get to Germany to see his mother. He also had a connecting flight. I don't think most terrorists book connecting flights. 

 

The plane was off-course. If they were having mechanical difficulties, the pilot might have tried to find the closest place to land safely. 

 

It's a mystery. I do think that terrorism is slowly being ruled out now though. 

 

 

 

_____________________________________________________________________________
Bon mot boogie
katydidthat
Community Member
Posts: 3,874
Registered: ‎01-18-2005

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to jisretired2010

This is turning into movie material, isn't it?  

 

Here's a link from Jen's link above which provides a summary of the situation:  

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/03/10/world/asia/malaysia-airlines-knowns-unknowns/index.html?hpt=bosrea...

 

From the radio, it seems that the two Iranians were refugees seeking sanctuary in Europe.  A friend of one of them lived in Malaysia and he helped them.  He rang Malaysian Airlines up shortly after the plane disappeared, and told them exactly what had happened, and gave his name and phone number.  Authorities kept stating that they didn't know anything about the two men until very recently.  

 

 

**********************************Siggie***************************************

“Not even the apparently enlightened principle of the ‘greatest good for the greatest number’ can excuse indifference to individual suffering. There is no test for progress other than its impact on the individual.” Nye Bevan
jisretired2010
Community Member
Posts: 6,262
Registered: ‎06-21-2010

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to jisretired2010

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/03/11/world/asia/malaysia-airlines-plane/?hpt=hp_t1

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To sit with a dog on a hillside on a glorious afternoon is to be back in Eden, where doing nothing was not boring- it was peace. Milan Kundera -
jisretired2010
Community Member
Posts: 6,262
Registered: ‎06-21-2010

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to runaway2da

CNN is reporting that according to the Malaysian AF the plane was flying way off course when it dropped from radar.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To sit with a dog on a hillside on a glorious afternoon is to be back in Eden, where doing nothing was not boring- it was peace. Milan Kundera -
ted_200
Community Member
Posts: 12,824
Registered: ‎07-16-2007

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to katydidthat

I'm probably way behind you guys on the news curve on this... but I heard radio news saying the one way tickets were purchased cash in Thailand by an Iranian man who picked them up for the two passengers traveling on the stolen passports.   But the travel agent apparently put them on this flight after telling them it was cheaper than another flight on another airline they'd originally asked for... so that doesn't much support them having some terrorism targeting motive, they generally aren't going to try to blow up or hijack just any plane.  They also apparently bought connecting tickets to somewhere out of Bejing, so that doesn't make a lot of sense either.

 

As for the plane going to Iran, I can't see that... even with everything turned off, the plane would leave a radar signal blip, there'd be an unknown aircraft moving from the area it disappeared toward Iran, and no one apparently has seen that on civilian or military radar systems. 

 

My guess is less than 50/50 chance the two guys with the stolen passports had anything to do with this, although I'm short on other theories... but it just doesn't add up. 

katydidthat
Community Member
Posts: 3,874
Registered: ‎01-18-2005

Re: Breaking News! Missing Malaysian Flight

in reply to tdziemianowicz
CNN reports a "large solid debris" sighted by Cathay Pacific.
**********************************Siggie***************************************

“Not even the apparently enlightened principle of the ‘greatest good for the greatest number’ can excuse indifference to individual suffering. There is no test for progress other than its impact on the individual.” Nye Bevan