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hatter-2-reducks
Community Member
Posts: 921
Registered: ‎09-16-2012

Cassini and the New ebay

A while back, in the “New Logo-Opinions” thread, I suggested sellers start learning about Cassini, ebay’s new search engine.  I first came across Cassini about 2 years ago and thought, “Yeah!  Yeah!  Yeah!  Another tweak…moving right along.”  Apparently, it’s not just a tweak of existing algorithms, but an entirely new search engine, incrementally being rolled out over time, category by category, until the entire site uses it.


 


The implications are mind boggling…if it works.  And that’s a big “IF”.  Not only will Cassini search item titles in determining the “Best Match” for each particular buyer, it will also mine item descriptions, FB received by the seller, FB left by the seller, even the text of both buyers’ and sellers’ ebay messaging, as well as factoring in a prospective buyer’s buying (and perhaps browsing) habits, all to give the buyer a few hundred (not thousands) recommendations of what matches their search query.  Sounds a little like Match.com, no?


 


To whittle down those recommendations even more, as part of the “New ebay” experience, the buyer will be able to personalize their own criteria for what’s important to them and weigh them, specifically for trust, value, diversity and relevance.  For example, if a buyer rates “trust” as more important than the others, he may be thinking, “I want to buy from a trustworthy, professional seller, not some hack.”  If a seller leaves false-positive FB, or a buyer leaves a “Never shipped!  BUYERS BEWARE!” FB, or either says in an ebay message, “You’re a freakin’ jerk!”, or is even argumentative, that seller may not make the final cut of a few hundred recommendations, never to be seen, regardless of their FB or DSRs.  If the cut is 200 listings and you’re #201, your item won’t be sold today to that prospective buyer…it won’t be seen.


 


Following are a few links y’all might find interesting.  The first is an overview of the “New ebay” by the CEO of ChannelAdvisor.


 


ChannelAdvisor article


 


 


Next is an article from EcommerceBytes, which shows how Cassini will work.


 


EcommerceBytes, Poised...


 


Here’s one, also from EcommerceBytes from a seller’s perspective who apparently has had a sneak preview.


 


EcommerceBytes...Seller's...


 


Finally, an EcommerceBytes “Top 10” recap of Cassini impact on sellers, along with blog comments.  hondamedic previously linked this on “Logo” thread.


 


EcommerceBytes...Top 10

The entrepreneur always searches for change, responds to it, and exploits it as an opportunity.

--Peter Drucker
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bostongrammy
Community Member
Posts: 9,279
Registered: ‎11-24-2002

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

It won't work. It's Best Match on steroids and based on many many flawed assumptions and analyses. No matter how many engineers you throw at it, it won't think of everything that a regular buyer could do using basic Boolean tools.



Just give me back my wildcard search. Please.

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ipickubuy
Community Member
Posts: 11,442
Registered: ‎08-04-2004

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

I'm bumping this thread because the sellers need to check out this info if Cassini will be the "new" eBay.  I'm not for or against Cassini because I don't know enough about it - yet.


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ipickubuy
Community Member
Posts: 11,442
Registered: ‎08-04-2004

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

Okay, I've been reading the articles Hatter linked to in this thread and, imo, Cassini will be an asset once it is fully implemented - and, in line with Granny's opinion, if it will work as intended. 


 


Granny mentioned about the buyers and Boolean tools, so will Cassini be able to make adjustments as needed to keep up?  Also, can and will Cassini be used to make eBay a level playing field again, such as where feedback is concerned, among other things?  Can Cassini help solve the problems the sellers are dealing with now?  The problems are obvious, as can be found on the other threads and forums.   Will Cassini be an asset to the sellers or not?


 


 


 


 


 


 


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hatter-2-reducks
Community Member
Posts: 921
Registered: ‎09-16-2012

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

@ ipcikubuy:


 


“…so will Cassini be able to make adjustments as needed to keep up?” 


 


Theoretically, yes…so long as ebay has enough server power and the code is good.


 


“Also, can and will Cassini be used to make eBay a level playing field again, such as where feedback is concerned, among other things?


 


That depends on what “a level playing field” means.  Cassini is a search engine, just like Google,  except it will carry the search farther within a smaller database,  ie, refining the search based on user(buyer) preferences (trust, value, diversity and relevance) and buying/browsing history.  In other words, it will give results for an item based on no less than the item itself, but also buyer preferences and history, seller past performance, FB, correspondence, and probably more.


 


Here are a couple examples that don’t address feedback.   A while back, I was researching “chrome plated rolling pins”, the thing you use to make pie crusts.  Fortunately, there were only about 50 results, but about 10 were for “Rolling Stones chrome plated lapel pins”.  If, with Cassini, I placed a high emphasis on “relevance”, it would automatically recognize that I never search for anything that has to do with music, no less the Rolling Stones, but I search quite often for kitchenware.  It would then  give only results for the pie crust thingies and probably show them in the order of my other preferences.


 


Another example is if a buyer wanted to search for one of my items and placed an emphasis on “value”…they want a bargain.  Since I price my items at or above the highest “sold” price of recently completed listings, my item would never come up high…it might not even make the cut for the limited list of results given to the buyer.  However, if their emphasis was on “trust”, I might be in the top 3.


 


Back to your concern about feedback, a negative comment from a previous buyer  would definitely hurt; a false positive would probably hurt less.  An “A+” or “Thanks” would probably be neutral.   A “The BEST seller on ebay!”?  Bingo!  You win the cupie doll!  You tell me…does that level the playing field?


 


“Can Cassini help solve the problems the sellers are dealing with now?”


 


Absolutely not!  It’s a search engine within the selling platform.  It will not interpret or implement ebay policies, nor buyer behavior.


 


“Will Cassini be an asset to the sellers or not?”


 


That will depend on the particular seller.  For top notch sellers, I think it will be an asset.  For average sellers, it will be a challenge to get exposure.  For bad and casual sellers, I think it will kill them.

The entrepreneur always searches for change, responds to it, and exploits it as an opportunity.

--Peter Drucker
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ipickubuy
Community Member
Posts: 11,442
Registered: ‎08-04-2004

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

Thanks for the explanation, Hatter. 


 


When I say level the playing field, I am talking about where feedback is concerned so I can see where Cassini will have no effect on that one way or the other.  Imo, the way feedback is handled now is not equal for both sides.  


 


I can see now where the Cassini search engine will be an asset to eBay and, I hope, for the sellers and buyers in the long run.  Time will tell.


 


I just wish eBay would also implement some new adjustments to help the sellers with the problems they are already experiencing.  Such as the FB systerm, shipping hassles, etc. 


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ipickubuy
Community Member
Posts: 11,442
Registered: ‎08-04-2004

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

One more comment I'd like to make in regard to your answer, Hatter. 


 


In the case of bad sellers, I'm happy to hear it will kill them off.  They make the rest of sellers look bad.  And the same can be said for bad buyers.   


 


As for the casual seller, I think it depends on what they are selling whether they can survive or not. 


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For the sake of others, please learn CPR. You could save a life.


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Community Member
Posts: 778
Registered: ‎10-24-2011

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks



Just give me back my wildcard search. Please.


  







YES EBAY ...PLEAAAAASSSSE!!!

Ignorance is bliss
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hatter-2-reducks
Community Member
Posts: 921
Registered: ‎09-16-2012

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks


One more comment I'd like to make in regard to your answer, Hatter. 


 


In the case of bad sellers, I'm happy to hear it will kill them off.  They make the rest of sellers look bad.  And the same can be said for bad buyers.   


 


As for the casual seller, I think it depends on what they are selling whether they can survive or not. 



Partially true for the casual seller...it will depend on what they're trying to sell, but it will also depend on their past performance and the prederences a buyer sets.  If a buyer dials in "trust" and the casual seller only has 3 FB, regardless of how glowing, I'm led to believe they would be placed behind the seller with 300 or 3000 equally glowing FB...3 ia a much smaller data sampling.


 


Exposure in "Search" will be more difficult than in the current "Best Match" as it will be a moving target partially based on buyer preferences.  The smaller the amount of data the casual sellers have, the less Cassini will have a basis to match them with a prospective buyer.

The entrepreneur always searches for change, responds to it, and exploits it as an opportunity.

--Peter Drucker
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janewt-1
Community Member
Posts: 1,913
Registered: ‎12-01-2006

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks


No matter how many engineers you throw at it, it won't think of everything that a regular buyer could do using basic Boolean tools.


 


Just give me back my wildcard search. Please.




Grammy - I agree it would be great if we could switch to pure boolean based searches at will.  However, I think you need to substitute "experienced, search-savvy buyer" for "regular buyer".



They are aiming the search algorithm at new & average-savvy buyers who need a tool that can sort of read their mind and give them the result they wanted rather than the one they asked for.



Newt
“Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country and giving it to the rich people of a poor country”. Ron Paul
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ipickubuy
Community Member
Posts: 11,442
Registered: ‎08-04-2004

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks


Partially true for the casual seller...it will depend on what they're trying to sell, but it will also depend on their past performance and the prederences a buyer sets.  If a buyer dials in "trust" and the casual seller only has 3 FB, regardless of how glowing, I'm led to believe they would be placed behind the seller with 300 or 3000 equally glowing FB...3 ia a much smaller data sampling.


 


Exposure in "Search" will be more difficult than in the current "Best Match" as it will be a moving target partially based on buyer preferences.  The smaller the amount of data the casual sellers have, the less Cassini will have a basis to match them with a prospective buyer.



 


Hatter, is Cassini basing its search results of trusted sellers on the feedback opinions left for the seller?  If so, then wouldn't the search results will be based on inaccurate info?  If the buyer leaves inaccurate info in fb then the whole search result would be in question.


 


As for Cassini's search results when looking for a specific item or group of items, if the casual seller is selling something that is considered hard to find, such as some collectibles and antiques, wouldn't that bring their item to the top of the list or near to it depending on the availability of the item on eBay? 


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The fragrance always remains in the hand that gives the rose.


For the sake of others, please learn CPR. You could save a life.


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ipickubuy
Community Member
Posts: 11,442
Registered: ‎08-04-2004

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

Another question, (I hope you don't mind.  I can't help it, I'm a Gemini.;  :smileywink:  )  Concerning those sellers who might be "killed", will other search engines be able to access Cassini?  That way the seller would be able to send potential buyers to check out their eBay page from  whatever other site they are selling their items at that time. 


 


If I think of anymore questions, I'll be back.  :smileyhappy:


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old_man_arthur
Community Member
Posts: 801
Registered: ‎11-13-2007

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

Uh... But no experienced bidder/buyer uses "Best Match"



Therefore, why would I care how evilBay figures it out?

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ipickubuy
Community Member
Posts: 11,442
Registered: ‎08-04-2004

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

OMA, how about those buyers/bidders with less experience?  I know of a few folks who buy on eBay and they still use best match.  And they've been buying on this venue for awhile.


 


You may not care how it is figured out, but others might.  I guess it all depends on your situation.  ?:smileyindifferent:


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For the sake of others, please learn CPR. You could save a life.


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bostongrammy
Community Member
Posts: 9,279
Registered: ‎11-24-2002

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

OMA, Cassini is about which search results are found, not about how they're arranged.

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Community Member
Posts: 16
Registered: ‎02-28-2003

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

if you searched for ["Chrome plated rolling pins" -rolling] you would not see rolling stones.   simple as that.  



with this new search engine, who knows what will be blocked based upon "ass umptions" that can not satisfy all buyers. 



i say let buyers search for what they want to search for and not what an engineer or consumers assume.   



it's sad that ebay charges listing fees and tells you that there is no guarantee that your item is searchable.   but pay them up to $2.00 anyway to list... ...whether it sells or not.






@ ipcikubuy:



 


Here are a couple examples that don’t address feedback.   A while back, I was researching “chrome plated rolling pins”, the thing you use to make pie crusts.  Fortunately, there were only about 50 results, but about 10 were for “Rolling Stones chrome plated lapel pins”.  If, with Cassini, I placed a high emphasis on “relevance”, it would automatically recognize that I never search for anything that has to do with music, no less the Rolling Stones, but I search quite often for kitchenware.  It would then  give only results for the pie crust thingies and probably show them in the order of my other preferences.


 



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old_man_arthur
Community Member
Posts: 801
Registered: ‎11-13-2007

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

I searched "Rolling Pins" and got




I also got


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hondamedic
Community Member
Posts: 7,002
Registered: ‎06-05-2005

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks


I plagiarized this link from janewt-1 to bump this thread.> https://www.appeagle.com/what-to-expect-from-eBays-cassini-search-engine


 


 

BBL: Blocked Bidder List... BIN: Buy It Now... BO: Best Offer... BR: Bid Retraction... DC: Delivery Confirmation

DSR: Detailed Seller Rating FB: Feedback FRB: Flat Rate Box FVF: Final Value Fee IPR: Immediate Payment Required

NARU: Not A Registered User OP: Original Poster OT: Off Topic PM: Priority Mail.... PS: Power Seller....

SNAD: Significantly Not As Described...... TRS: Top Rated Seller...... UIA: Unpaid Item Assistant..... UID: Unpaid Item Dispute
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ipickubuy
Community Member
Posts: 11,442
Registered: ‎08-04-2004

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

Thanks for the link, Honda.  :smileyhappy:


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The fragrance always remains in the hand that gives the rose.


For the sake of others, please learn CPR. You could save a life.


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janewt-1
Community Member
Posts: 1,913
Registered: ‎12-01-2006

Re: Cassini and the New ebay

in reply to hatter-2-reducks

Thanks for that Honda.  There is quite a bit of good info out there about this whole search thing - some of it even what I would consider very encouraging such as the strong possibility that ebay will do away with DSRs and possibly do away with listing fees if they use Cassini the way the seem to be considering right now.



Here are three recent articles by Ina Steiner who writes the eCommerce Bytes blog.  Her factual stuff is, well, very factual even though some of her purely editorial comments can lean toward anti-ebay.  These, and the links they contain, should be good reading for sellers who want to actually have their stuff sell.



http://www.ecommercebytes.com/C/blog/blog.pl?/pl/2012/10/1350267935.html



http://www.ecommercebytes.com/cab/abn/y12/m10/i15/s02



http://www.ecommercebytes.com/cab/abn/y12/m10/i15/s01



Cassini is partly in use now and will be coming into full use by early next year.  Sellers will either adapt or do poorly and probably leave.



Newt
“Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country and giving it to the rich people of a poor country”. Ron Paul
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