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Community Member
Posts: 39
Registered: ‎06-14-2011

MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

There are a BUNCH of fake ornaments being sold on German ebay right now and they are making their way to US ebay. BEWARE of German sellers describing "rare" or "older" figural ornaments. Some of the fakes include ANY Hindenburg busts, most all zeppelins, Mary holding the baby Jesus, the singing frog, girl heads, the bust of Christ and many more! They are using old caps or clips, but the paint colors are not quite right, the weight of the glass is slightly heavier, the silvering is way to bright and clean and there is little or no wear to the paints (unless intentional). An easy wat to spot fakes in most cases is to look at the top where the cap fits on. If it is painted all the way under the cap it is probably a fake. Old ornaments were rarely painted in this manner. The pike was almost always left unpainted and the area should be dark or clear from oxidation/age of the silvering.

Reproduction kugels are always on US ebay in droves, however, I think in most cases this is unintentional as the new ones look old. Inferior materials make the caps rust quickly and the silvering fades quickly for the same reason.

An easy way to spot a fake kugel is to look at the cap. German/French kugels almost NEVER have a pike. Old kugels were ground down so that the cap fit tight onto the body of the kugel. Also, old kugels NEVER had caps with the saw-toothed or serrated edges. They also never had the U shaped markings on them seen in many repros these days. If you have any doubts, look at the completed items and check the caps on those that brought the most money.
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Community Member
Posts: 158
Registered: ‎12-04-2002

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty
Thanks lemonty - that is great info for the collector!

I do check e-bay and notice there are a suspicious amount of early German ornaments, and the whole Kugal thing has gone waaaaaay wrong! Buyer beware!!!!
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wessleysbest
Community Member
Posts: 446
Registered: ‎02-10-2005

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty
great tutorial lemonty ~ I hope you would consider putting that information into a help link.....
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Community Member
Posts: 39
Registered: ‎06-14-2011

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty
How do I do that?
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wessleysbest
Community Member
Posts: 446
Registered: ‎02-10-2005

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty
Click on site map. Under "Buying Resources" click on "Reviews and Guides". Click on "Create a Guide". Here is the link for your ease http://reviews.ebay.com/. I cannot tell you the incredible amount of information in these guides! Be sure and be very specific in your guide title so we can find it when we need it! Thank you for considering do this!
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wessleysbest
Community Member
Posts: 446
Registered: ‎02-10-2005

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty
lemonty ~ I should have mentioned that eBay tries to eliminate duplicate guides, so look to see if there is one already in existence that covers this subject....
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Community Member
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎10-30-2009

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty
Thanks for the info, do you know what the difference would be German versa French Kugals I have a chance to buy some but upon looking at both description of Kugals on e-bay I am not sure which would be what, will take any help at all Thank You Daphne Majewski
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Community Member
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎10-30-2009

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty
I didn't get a reply,!!!!!!! looking for an answer, what is the difference between a German Kugel and a French Kugal Thanks
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Community Member
Posts: 39
Registered: ‎06-14-2011

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty
German kugels are much heavier than the French balls. Also, while German kugels came (in order of rarity) in amethyst, red, blue, gold, green and silver and varying shades thereof, French kugels also came in a few more exotic colors such as orange, violet and copper. Most all French kugels have caps that have an arrow design in them and many are marked VG1721 in the caps themselves. The most common German kugels caps have "leafy" designs or swirls in the design. There is new evidence than the grape shaped kugels marked in the glass, "DEPOSE" are French in origin, however, this is speculation as no written evidence currently exists. As a matter of fact, there is little to no written evidence on the history of kugels at all. Sorry it took so long to answer. If you can get photos of the kugels I can tell you when and where they were made.
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Community Member
Posts: 39
Registered: ‎06-14-2011

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty
I need to clarify on the French caps...the arrow design has usually 6 large arrows that take up the whole face of the cap. If there are many arrows all over the cap it is a reproduction and if the egde is serrated (sawtoothed) is is a repro.
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Community Member
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎11-19-2008

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty

I listed two KUGELS that are the "real" thing.  Before I listed them I looked at the Ebay listings for Kugels.  There are several "pristine" Kugels listed as antique.  I don't know that much about them accept to say, mine are genuine antiques and I have my doubts about some that others have listed.



It gets frustrating when questionable items are listed as old and makes my sales that much more difficult because my Kugels have a patina that new never will!

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prettywoman-2012
Community Member
Posts: 4,723
Registered: ‎03-12-2012

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty

Thanks, OP, for this post! Very informative. I wish I had known this last year! Ended up with 4 fake Kugels.

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Community Member
Posts: 39
Registered: ‎06-14-2011

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty

Very sorry to hear that. If you have a question as to authenticity, please send me a message and I will tell you if it is real or repro.

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Community Member
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎11-06-2012

Re: Pictures of Kugels

in reply to lemonty

kugels 002.JPGkugels 003.JPGkugels 004.JPGkugels 006.JPGkugels 002.JPG

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Community Member
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎11-06-2012

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty
Hi. I just sent pictures of 4 Kugels that were found in a storage unit. The green one has a tag that says German Kugel with a purchase price from about 15 years ago. The others do not. Their caps are loose except for the green one which is very tight. Can you tell me if any of these are real and if so, their era and worth? Thanks,
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molly61johanne
Community Member
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎11-10-2013

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to manchesterantiques

Hello! Sorry, have all reproduction! Read above...Saw tooth and "U" on the caps....:smileysurprised:(

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bruceox1962
Community Member
Posts: 1,665
Registered: ‎08-30-2013

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty

So probably alot of the old ornaments we put on our tree are fakes.  What will we ever do?  I think I will keep this information from my wife or she will be crushed.

The Call
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my35life
Community Member
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎08-11-2013

Re: MANY FAKE ORNAMENTS BEING SOLD AS OLD!!!

in reply to lemonty

not sure what can you tell me about my pair if you dont mind

PhotoPhoto

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