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Community Member
Posts: 1,292
Registered: ‎07-17-2011

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to ted_200

Hola Ted200: Your post of 22 August 2014 at 0215:  Perhaps you are referring to those 'private'

minting places?  Interesting point!

Perhaps there are more 'mints' in operation in just one country than all other mints operating in

'rest of world'?  Perhaps more mint operations than ever were?  Something to ponder por seguro!

Regards,

 

xx

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ted_200
Community Member
Posts: 11,388
Registered: ‎07-16-2007

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to elheron-grande

It also appears that Heron's own personal opinion as to how many 'mints' have been in operation

has been way too low!   The overall list must contain several thousand 'mints'.  Or more!

 

I suspect your are correct, as it would appear there are currently several hundred mints operating in Guangdong Province alone. :manwink:

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Community Member
Posts: 1,292
Registered: ‎07-17-2011

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to tdziemianowicz

Hola TDZ: Your post of 21 August 2014 0604:  Your fine post illustrates a point in GAC's post.

Regarding those folks that 'specialize' in one geo-political area or perhaps several issues

of coins within a specific time period.  

 

Regarding your study of 'mint' locations in the Duchy of Lorraine; it appears that there were many

mint operations in that Duchy.  [As you noted, the actual Duchy or entity boundaries were

changing constantly due to marriages, deaths of rulers, annexation, war, etc]

 

A few months pasado, Heron decided to develop a list of HRE 'states' to count the approximate

total.  Using various inter-net sites with HRE info, and counting for several hours, Heron arrived

at a total of 678 entities.  This only included 'states' established from 1500 to 1793. 

 

It is difficult to estimate or guess at how many 'mints' there would be in that batch of entities because

there was not enough information that included 'minting rights' granted by the HR Emperor.  Until

Heron has enough time to research each of the 678 entities it will remain a 'guess'.

 

With the Duchy of Lorraine mint information you have found, and knowing that there were approximately

678 'entities' in the HRE 1500 to 1793, we could surmise that there might be a huge number of actual

mint operations in the various HRE entities.

 

For several decades Heron has thought that there must have been a lot of folks employed in the

minting process around the world.  That would also mean that there were probably a large amount of

hammers manufactured. [Another 'dimension' perhaps]

 

As we proceed through the years and learn more about coins and minting and mint locations we increase

the 'dimensions' of study and discussion.  Heron for one truly enjoys these discussions pertaining to coins

[and paper money] and conducted in such a friendly manner.  A truly fun discussion that can last for

many years, perhaps?  Regards,

 

xx

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Community Member
Posts: 1,292
Registered: ‎07-17-2011

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to gacooke

Hola Gac:  Thank you for the information about the folks that research the 'details' of various coin

issues.  Over the decades, as my knowledge has expanded, this question re mints and how many

were in operation at one time or another has been at the edge of my thoughts.

 

It appears that most scholars and dedicated numismatists could be considered specialists of a

particular geographical area or a specific issue or several issues of coins.

 

It also appears that Heron's own personal opinion as to how many 'mints' have been in operation

has been way too low!   The overall list must contain several thousand 'mints'.  Or more!

Perhaps too many for one coin scholar to tabulate in one 'lifetime'?

 

Again, many thanks for the info and links to study.  This mint situation could possibly 'boggle' the mind ey?

Regards,

 

xx

 

 

 

 

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Community Member
Posts: 2,606
Registered: ‎03-06-2012

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to gacooke

gacooke wrote:

elheron-grande wrote:

Hola Gac:  Many thanks for the 'mintmark' info.  Now my question is this;

Has anyone ever made a study of all the 'mints' known?  Yes, a curious

question.  However, Heron has a curiosity factor.  Most likely it would

take years of research to compile such a 'list'.  Heron knows from his

experience collecting Holy Roman Empire coins that there are a large

batch of 'mints' located in that conglomerate of individual coin issuing

authorities.  Something to ponder though ey?  Regards.

 

xx


The short answer is yes ......... and no.  You could fill bookcases with the scholarship in this area.  In fact, I am well into my second bookcase, and I let my membership in the ANS lapse 20 years ago.  Online resources have grown as well, with many numismatic scholars publishing in open source literature that makes their work available on-line. 

 

For example, take a look at two of the items on ed snible's web site:

http://snible.org/

Die Beamtennamen auf den griechischen Münzen by Rudolf Münsterberg [AKA 'Official Names on Greek Coins']

http://snible.org/coins/library/muensterberg/

and The British Museum of Greek Coins:

http://snible.org/coins/bmc/

(I know is says plates only, but for most volumes, the text is available as well)

 

Scholars will pick a state or a province, a time period or a coin type, travel to the museums and the collections, track down hoards, assembling everything they can about the dies, die pairs, moneyers, mints, officina et cetera.  The results get published in articles and books.

 

Then somebody finds a new hoard (particularly valuable in this kind of study), and what they think they knew has to all be re-examined.  It is a very fascinating part of numismatics.  There is sometimes not a lot of written history about some of the obscure places and times in Europe and Asia.  But often there a bunch of coins, as testimony that people were there and were actively doing stuff.

 

 


I have a very narrow view of the mint question, but even that gives an understanding of the enormous richness and complexty (I know ... no surprise too the experts here). 

 

I collect one area that is close to el-heron's "HRE" field, Duchy of Lorraine.  In medieval/Renaissance times, there were minting authorities in places that today are tiny backwaters: Badonviller, St. Die, St. Michiel, Neufchateau.  Surrounding the duchy were additional mints in bishoprics and counties like Bar, Metz, Toul, Verdun, etc. that are in what today is considered Lorraine.  So, in this smallish part of France, no larger than our state of New Hampshire, and where there has been no minting for almost 300 years, there was formerly a very rich numismatic history, with at least a dozen mints.

 

Part of the fun!     

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gacooke
Community Member
Posts: 3,680
Registered: ‎03-10-2008

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to elheron-grande

elheron-grande wrote:

Hola Gac:  Many thanks for the 'mintmark' info.  Now my question is this;

Has anyone ever made a study of all the 'mints' known?  Yes, a curious

question.  However, Heron has a curiosity factor.  Most likely it would

take years of research to compile such a 'list'.  Heron knows from his

experience collecting Holy Roman Empire coins that there are a large

batch of 'mints' located in that conglomerate of individual coin issuing

authorities.  Something to ponder though ey?  Regards.

 

xx


The short answer is yes ......... and no.  You could fill bookcases with the scholarship in this area.  In fact, I am well into my second bookcase, and I let my membership in the ANS lapse 20 years ago.  Online resources have grown as well, with many numismatic scholars publishing in open source literature that makes their work available on-line. 

 

For example, take a look at two of the items on ed snible's web site:

http://snible.org/

Die Beamtennamen auf den griechischen Münzen by Rudolf Münsterberg [AKA 'Official Names on Greek Coins']

http://snible.org/coins/library/muensterberg/

and The British Museum of Greek Coins:

http://snible.org/coins/bmc/

(I know is says plates only, but for most volumes, the text is available as well)

 

Scholars will pick a state or a province, a time period or a coin type, travel to the museums and the collections, track down hoards, assembling everything they can about the dies, die pairs, moneyers, mints, officina et cetera.  The results get published in articles and books.

 

Then somebody finds a new hoard (particularly valuable in this kind of study), and what they think they knew has to all be re-examined.  It is a very fascinating part of numismatics.  There is sometimes not a lot of written history about some of the obscure places and times in Europe and Asia.  But often there a bunch of coins, as testimony that people were there and were actively doing stuff.

 

 

 



"climate is what we expect weather is what we get"
M. Twain
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beachgirlbaby01
Community Member
Posts: 5,982
Registered: ‎02-20-2010

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to tdziemianowicz

nice one,



The more you explain it, the more I don't understand it.


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Community Member
Posts: 2,606
Registered: ‎03-06-2012

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

[ Edited ]
in reply to tdziemianowicz

Oops.  Found a couple in Ebay sold items search.  French Afars & Issas, and Mongolia.  The same camel motif seems to appear later in Djibouti coins (successor nation to Afars & Issas if I recall):

 

CamelAfars.JPGCamelMongolia.JPG

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Community Member
Posts: 2,606
Registered: ‎03-06-2012

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to *smedley*

*smedley* wrote:

that's cool...!!


I second that!

 

What is interesting about camels seems to be their ABSENCE on coins from the places where they live.  I know th S-d-n coins are the only ones I've owned or seen.  But a quick look through my old (1995) KM "Collecting World Coins" does not turn up camels on any 1900-1995 coins from Algeria, Bahrain, Egypt, French West Africa/West African States, Iraq, Jordan, Libya, Mali, Mauritania, Morocco, Oman, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Yemen.  Yet you can find lions, gazelles, the occasional horse, even a lobster (or what looks like one - Democratic Republic of Yemen), heraldic falcons, and palm trees galore, of course.

 

Beasts of burden just not sexy enough?  (Though one finds oxen and llamas here and there). 

 

Maybe on more modern coins?

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beachgirlbaby01
Community Member
Posts: 5,982
Registered: ‎02-20-2010

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to tdziemianowicz

very interesting never thought about camel coins. good one



The more you explain it, the more I don't understand it.


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Community Member
Posts: 1,292
Registered: ‎07-17-2011

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to tdziemianowicz

Hola TDZ: Yes, Heron does have one a those Dom Rep palm tree coins! It was

probably the first palm tree coin Heron acquired.  Acquired sometime during the 1950s.

Only in about Fine grade.  However, it was the palm tree that was of interest!

One of many 'topicals' that interest collectors of world coins.  Just for fun! Regards,

 

xx

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Community Member
Posts: 1,292
Registered: ‎07-17-2011

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to gacooke

Hola Gac:  Many thanks for the 'mintmark' info.  Now my question is this;

Has anyone ever made a study of all the 'mints' known?  Yes, a curious

question.  However, Heron has a curiosity factor.  Most likely it would

take years of research to compile such a 'list'.  Heron knows from his

experience collecting Holy Roman Empire coins that there are a large

batch of 'mints' located in that conglomerate of individual coin issuing

authorities.  Something to ponder though ey?  Regards.

 

xx

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Community Member
Posts: 1,292
Registered: ‎07-17-2011

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to mcdcoins

Hola MCD:  That Somersetshire token is the very item that started Heron's interest

in camel coins & tokens.  Heron has that token but not in that super grade as depicted

in your post.  Thanks for posting that!  Regards.

 

xx

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Community Member
Posts: 1,292
Registered: ‎07-17-2011

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to tdziemianowicz

Gotcha! Entiendo todo! Regards.

 

xx

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Community Member
Posts: 3,250
Registered: ‎10-14-2008

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to mcdcoins

that's cool...!!

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mcdcoins
Community Member
Posts: 1,397
Registered: ‎05-20-2009

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to ted_200

medal but....

 

FRANCE. Napoleon I (1804-1805). Bronze medal struck in memory of the conquest of Egypt 1898.

Obv: Wreathed head of Napoleon facing; on edge of bust: J. Jouannin F. Denon D..
Rev: L' EGYPTE CONQUISE MDCCXCVIII.
Napoleon driving triumphal chariot drawn by two dromedars left, crowned by Victory flying right.

 

eg bon.JPG

 

 

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ted_200
Community Member
Posts: 11,388
Registered: ‎07-16-2007

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to tdziemianowicz

camel1

 

 

camel2

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Community Member
Posts: 2,606
Registered: ‎03-06-2012

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

[ Edited ]
in reply to impalajohnny

Camel5Obv.jpg

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Community Member
Posts: 2,606
Registered: ‎03-06-2012

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to mcdcoins

Fantastic camel, fantastic coin (I realize "coin" may not be completely accurate).  Thanks!  Someone very near to me is collecting Conders now ... Mostly with ecclesiastic architecture in mind, rather than beasts, Biblical or otherwise.

 

 

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mcdcoins
Community Member
Posts: 1,397
Registered: ‎05-20-2009

Re: --THE NEW COIN CHAT ROOM--

in reply to tdziemianowicz

Somersetshire Bath D&H 50

 

Photo by Larrymo

 

som bath 50.JPG

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